Upgrade to Auria Pro or buy into Cubasis ?

Tritonman

I wonder what they could do with say, oh, I dunno, how about GarageBand?
nuff said on that.

eustressor

@AlterEgo_UK said:

I am a regular user of Cubasis. I have Auria (the previous version) but could never get to grips with it. However, some of the quaint features of Cubasis are doing my head in (as we say in these parts). Such as the adding of loads of extra space when mixing down, making the filesize at least 3 times as large as it needs to be, some timing issues when fellow collaborators import my shared stems, track names becoming corrupted when moving tracks around and sometimes audio clips getting a non-unique name and losing their actual audio on playback because they are playing the audio from the other clip with the same name!

But I have stuck with it as most of the time it works well, I know how to achieve most of what I want to achieve and I find it fits my workflow. 

Now Auria can record midi, I am thinking maybe I can record with fewer niggles but still not entirely convinced I will be able to get used to the way Auria works. One thing that might sway me though is if Auria can split imported midi files into separate tracks for each channel and even more important, export separate midi files for each track. Yes I can don't hating Cubasis but only by copying and pasting each midi track into a new project and mixing down the single track to midi. If I mix down to midi in a full project, with all tracks muted except the midi track I want to export, it always exports the midi from all the midi tracks even if they are muted. 

Can an anyone tell me for sure that Auria Pro can export separate midi tracks from a project?  Thanks. 

Can't say definitively, but page 192 of the User Guide suggests this is possible (I think)?

MIDI Inputs – Selects which types of the MIDI information to receive from a particular connection. Any detected MIDI connection will be listed here, including Virtual MIDI (labeled as Network Session), other running apps, and connected MIDI interfaces. 

MIDI Outputs – Selects which types of MIDI information to transmit out a particular connection. Any detected MIDI connection will be listed here, including Virtual MIDI (labeled as Network Session), other running apps, and connected MIDI interfaces.

Disclaimer: Eustressor = well-meaning Midiot  

@Tritonman said:

I wonder what they could do with say, oh, I dunno, how about GarageBand?
nuff said on that.

Excellent point - pretty much what I was thinking. Or as David Lee Roth once (supposedly) said, "If you've got what it takes, you can wow the crowd playing on a stage the size of a postage stamp." Please don't think I'm making the case that David "Dimebag" Lee Roth is in the same league as them nutty Liverpudlians ...

studs1966

It doesn't matter what you use to record your masterpiece on.  All software has its pros & cons. All talent comes from within yourself via brain, ears & your fingers. Whether it's a keyboard(virtual, or real)of somekind or strings( guitar, violin, etc). I remember make music on a Tascam 4 track many years ago, & so did everyone else who made it famous in the days of old for a demo, then onto DAT tape. Artists like The Prodigy, Phuture Phantasy Club, Mr Fingers, & so forth. They all started somewhere with the gear they had at the time. Imagine what they could of done with the iPad, if that was the technology was then, and there was no 4 Track tape recorders? Even Artists used an Amiga using Octamed to make a chart UK hit. Tho for life of me, I can't remember the group( hardcore/ drum n bass duo). Anyway,, if you have Auria, then defiantly upgrade to the Pro. It definitely worth it. Rim always keeps on top of things, & very diligent in what he does. Steinberg do good software too, but if there is a problem, they take a while to fix things. But at the end of the day. They are all good apps to make music on. It would nice if Doug could do a "Auria Pro, Cubasis, MTD Showdown" maybe?

studs1966

Ahhhh just remembered the group who used Octamed on the Amiga, who made it in the UK charts....... Urban Shakedown, & I think Calvin Harris too?

richardyot

Yes, well I remember using a Tascam 4 track to record demos, and there's no contest - I would choose an iPad over that any day, so actually tools can matter, a lot.

Auria is is in a class of its own on iOS, in terms of mixing, routing, available effects etc Cubasis is just nowhere near it. Even something as simple as the mixer view in Cubasis is just poor in comparison. The quality of even the most basic effects such as reverb and compression is light years apart, and the flexibility of the routing (Cubais basically has none). MIDI was the only advantage that Cubasis had, and that no longer holds.

The other factor is that Rim is a very responsive developer, who listens to users, and that is also worth a lot.

lovadamusic

@Gratouilli said:

@Flo26 said:

@hacked_to_pieces said:

Does not matter which DAW good results depend on the skill of the end user. 

+1000

+1001

I must be missing something because I don't see how this repeated again and again is terribly relevant or compelling in regard to this thread. I think everyone knows that buying a Stradivarius doesn't make you a violinist. But if you do play, you'll sound better on a better instrument.

My talent/skill (or lack thereof) is what it is. A DAW that makes working easier, faster, more efficient, with more useful and essential features, that inspires, that provides better sounds that match what I want to sound like is why I choose one over another. If I was a genius making gems out of coal, maybe it would be different, but in my real world, the tools I have absolutely improve or hinder my output. Choosing a DAW requires much research and consideration. The reason for this thread, no?

gsm909

^ @lovedamusic , exactly why I asked the question in the first place. Thanks everyone for honest input

AlterEgo_UK

@eustressor said:
Can't say definitively, but page 192 of the User Guide suggests this is possible (I think)?

MIDI Inputs – Selects which types of the MIDI information to receive from a particular connection. Any detected MIDI connection will be listed here, including Virtual MIDI (labeled as Network Session), other running apps, and connected MIDI interfaces. 

MIDI Outputs – Selects which types of MIDI information to transmit out a particular connection. Any detected MIDI connection will be listed here, including Virtual MIDI (labeled as Network Session), other running apps, and connected MIDI interfaces.

Disclaimer: Eustressor = well-meaning Midiot 

Thanks, @eustressor but I don't think that is quite what I was looking for, although the ability to choose which type of midi information to receive/send (I filter I guess) is more than what Cubasis has.

Here is an example of what I want to do in Cubasis but can't and wonder if I can do in Auria Pro. Maybe @WaveMachineLabs could help here?

OK, so I have just finished recording a project that contains audio tracks and midi tracks.

I want to send the individual tracks to someone else for mixing/mastering/collaborating on etc.

In Cubasis, if I want to export separate Audio Tracks, in the Mixdown menu I can select to Create Separate Files for Tracks, which works great for wav files.I can also create separate mixdowns with various audio tracks muted if I don't want those in the mix or exported. 

However,if I want to export say separate piano, bass and drum midi tracks as separate midi files the option to create separate files is not available and even if I solo say the piano midi track and do a mixdown to midi, I still get all the midi data for bass and drums as well.

Currently, I have to copy and paste the midi track I want to export into a new project and then mix the single track project down to a midi file - and repeat for each midi track I want to export!

Can Auria Pro export separate midi files for each midi track more easily?

Tritonman

Sometimes "I" take myself too seriously.( snicker). I am just not all that good heheh.

Tritonman

@Flo26 said:

it's only our point of view.nothing else.we express ideas as you do.should we have the same views as everybody?i don't think so! Open your minds guys! I respect your thoughts ( even if i don't always agree). Wouldn't it be great if you did the same?

+1

jimbomull

I have Auria Pro and Cubasis, and I find the editing on both of these programs to be anything but easy. I normally use Cockos Reaper on a high power P.C. and It's an absolute joy to use.
The problem for me on the Ipad Air is speed of workflow. It just doesn't do anything fast enough. On my pc using Reaper I can edit a track while it's playing, and even mess around with effects while part of the track is looping.
If you must choose an Ipad Daw, I think Cubasis has the edge when it comes to workflow.
Aulis is a frustrating piece of software, and still prone to memory issues and crashes on large projects. Cubasis also has the support of a very large company, and I am sure some better updates will arrive soon. Also Cubasis has a built in keyboard, and it's much easier to load/unload third part synths etc. I gave up with the Aulis midi editor, as I found it too clumsy/long winded to use.
I hope this is of some help! 

jimbomull

Aulis should read Auria (good website though)

_ki

@AlterEgo_UK

One thing that might sway me though is if Auria can split imported midi files
into separate tracks for each channel and even more important, export separate
midi files for each track.

Can an anyone tell me for sure that Auria Pro can export separate midi
tracks from a project?

I just checked:
- When importing a type 1 midi file, separate midi tracks are generated.
- For export one can select Type 0 or 1 (default) on the MIDI panel of
  the settings dialog.
  The type 1 files have all tracks separated in different channels, in the order the
      tracks have been (one re-order tracks with Auria)
  A type 0 file has all notes combined in one midi channel when importing the
      generated file back into Auria Pro
 
Auria Pro stores the midi file in its shared document folder, to get it into another
application one needs to access this folder via itunes or ifunbox from a computer
and then perhaps transfer it to dropbox or directly to the shared folder of
the IPad app you want to open it with.

I tested the type 1 file with three tracks with Fruity Loops Mobile, where it was
imported to separate tracks.
ProMidi only imported two of the tracks, which must be ProMidi problem - i verified
with Ableton Life on the PC that there are three midi tracks in the file.

TL;DR
Yes - import and export of multi channel midi files work, transfering the exported midi to another app is currently a little bit akward,.

AlterEgo_UK

Thanks, @_ki I think that does answer my question. Good to know Auria Pro can export Type 1 midi file even if it is not a straightforward to transfer the file another app or email.
It would be really great if it had an 'open in' for exported Type 1 midi files to make it easier to share them! @WaveMachineLabs !

PhilW

I saw a quote in an interview today with Mick Jagger, and thought of this thread - "it doesn't make any difference what guitar you play, it's what you play that counts". OK, back to DAW comparisons!

lovadamusic

@Flo26 said:

it's only our point of view.nothing else.we express ideas as you do.should we have the same views as everybody?i don't think so! Open your minds guys! I respect your thoughts ( even if i don't always agree). Wouldn't it be great if you did the same?

If disagreement is a lack of respect, you'd have a point. I made my point. Enjoy the discussion.

Gratouilli

@lovedamusic, you're right in a certain way... Those "+..." don't add many things to the discussion, but make easy to express that we agree with someone's else idea... I'll keep on using this simple way of "commenting without comment"

More about the topic... I use both Cubasis and Auria but not Pro yet. In fact I think that more than comparing what one or the other can do, the important thing is to clearly know what we need. At the moment, my needs are to be able to play synths and drum machines (often not more than 3 or 4 tracks) then add some effects... everything via IAA or Audiobus and finally add between 5 and 8 audio tracks (for guitars and voices).
when I decide to start a project in Auria, I add Pro Midi or another midi sequencer and now (very) often Fugue Machine (which I really like).
I can do all of this with both DAW (normal, because I have the more basic use of a DAW in fact  )
Even if Auria Pro adds Twin 2 which sounds great, I already paid for So many synth apps that one more could be "one too much"... It's the same regarding effects BUT I really enjoy using Timeless 2 and Saturn within Auria, even if most of the time I can have almost the same result with other effect apps (like Flux, Tornado, Holderness's apps, Kymatica's apps, Master FX... and so on) within Cubasis.
Choosing between Auria or Cubasis is often a question of mood  

So in the end, I don't absolutely "need" to upgrade to Auria Pro as everything I want to do can be done with Cubasis, but as I'm a "new app addict" I think I'm going to just "to see"  
Also, I can afford what I think are really low prices for such wonderful apps and also think (perhaps I'm naive) that it is important to support devs like Rim.

lovadamusic

@Gratouilli said:

@lovedamusic, you're right in a certain way... Those "+..." don't add many things to the discussion, but make easy to express that we agree with someone's else idea... I'll keep on using this simple way of "commenting without comment"

Just trying to be understood here. Whether you respond with a "+" or a 1000 word essay my point remains the same. If people think that the answer to the question here is that, it doesn't matter, then I disagree. We ask the question, we look for answers, because it does matter to us. Post all you like, whatever you like. I'm not telling you what to do; I'm disagreeing with the sentiment expressed in the context of this thread.

 

Lady_App_titude

Auria Pro seems like a huge milestone for iOS, and I'm watching with great interest, and may end up picking it up just out of curiosity. But at this point, having a studio with terabytes of software + hardware, and decades of experience working that way, I have yet to see a single thing about any iOS DAW that would make it a more appealing workflow. Maybe if you like composing in a bus stop better than a studio... For me, MusicIO and Studiomux was the big breakthrough. An integrated iOS/Mac OS studio still seems like the best option for me.

lovadamusic

The iPad is really about the mobility and comfort for me. And I'm an amateur who likes pro features at low cost. So my desktop, with Logic Pro X, is great for power, but I really want to get away, sit back in an easy chair wherever, and make music. Like playing a guitar or other mobile instrument. So a pro-level DAW on an iPad is a major breakthrough for me. Gadget is a nice though limited solution. I'm just getting into Multitrackstudio, and I'm liking that so far, but Auria Pro looks even more ambitious. I don't know, but I don't expect the iPad to outdo, or even match, the power of a studio. It's still tiny, in more ways than one, and the OS is better suited to phones. Amazing how close it's getting, though. 

Igneous1

@Lady_App_titude said:

Auria Pro seems like a huge milestone for iOS, and I'm watching with great interest, and may end up picking it up just out of curiosity. But at this point, having a studio with terabytes of software + hardware, and decades of experience working that way, I have yet to see a single thing about an any iOS DAW that would make it a more appealing workflow.

Fair point. Workflow being the key point for me.

WaveMachineLabs

DAW workflow is a very personal thing.  I think Auria's workflow is fantastic, (but I wrote it  Some agree, and others disagree.  It's really a matter of personal preference.  You need to find the DAW that works for you.  Of course, Auria Pro has features no other DAW comes close to, but how you interact with it is a personal thing.

Rim

lovadamusic

Another thing about the iPad is the touch interface. Totally different experience than the desktop. If this worked as reliably and well as advertised for me, I'd be a lot happier.

richardyot

@jimbomull said:

On my pc using Reaper I can edit a track while it's playing, and even mess around with effects while part of the track is looping.

You can definitely edit effects in Auria while a section of the track is looping, it's the standard way to work. It sounds to me like you maybe need to spend a little more time getting used to the app, because as a fellow owner of Reaper I can only say that the workflow is obviously very different to Auria - but I prefer Auria - YMMV.

gsm909

I'm very in love with the iPad way of working. The pricing is unbelievable once you have bought into the capable hardware. Be prepared for the inevitable hardware upgrade in a few years, but for now, enjoy the pricing and the massive leaps forwards every few months in processing ability and app development.
What bugs me is that here we are, 30 years later, after midi was first implemented, bickering over standards which should be accepted as 'the normal'. Apple are doing very little behind the scenes to help us as musicians. MIDI has been an accepted standard for more than 30 years, yet each OS update requires a rewrite from developers in order to adhere to an accepted standard. Apple need to accept a base level and stick to it (so all our ways of working continue to work better, wether it's midi, open in, audioshare, etc) that have been developed In previous OS versions that are accepted and work. I'm so frustrated with Apple and how they treat developers and users of music applications. we really are treated as 2nd class AppStore citizens, they think all we want to do is sample copyrighted material for our own financial gain. FUCK OFF Apple. We put the money in your pockets buying your crippled hardware and seriously restrained OS. We are the consumers you rely on. Get a grip Apple, before Google gets its shit together. It's only a matter of time before the Android hardware then software catches up and does a huge dump on your party.

gsm909

With Studiomux working well now, would an upgrade from Ableton Live 8.4 to. 9.5 would be a better choice than upgrading to Auria Pro . what do you think folks...the desktop PC IS the centre of the system. Synths , drum machines, fx, PC, and iPad all revolve around Ableton.

rkmonkey

Downloaded cubasis (after deleting long ago) and bought MTS during beta to compare to Auria Pro. None compares to AP. How incredible that AP is being compared to desktop DAWs. I have hardware and desktop systems that I haven't touched in 2 years thanks to Auria.

boone51

@richardyot said:

Yes, well I remember using a Tascam 4 track to record demos, and there's no contest - I would choose an iPad over that any day, so actually tools can matter, a lot.

Auria is is in a class of its own on iOS, in terms of mixing, routing, available effects etc Cubasis is just nowhere near it. Even something as simple as the mixer view in Cubasis is just poor in comparison. The quality of even the most basic effects such as reverb and compression is light years apart, and the flexibility of the routing (Cubais basically has none). MIDI was the only advantage that Cubasis had, and that no longer holds.

The other factor is that Rim is a very responsive developer, who listens to users, and that is also worth a lot.

Easy there, Rich...I have very fond memories of my tascam fourtrack...

grizzlegritz

A few months ago I decided to get back into computer music and got Logic for my Mac mini, while also checking out the Garageband ios version on my iPad. As I played around with the software I realized that I would have to commit many hours to learning Logic or any other desktop daw to use it well, so I began buying ipad daws, and various synths to make an educated choice. I kept reading about how everyone was waiting for Auria Pro to arrive, so I kept biding my time and playing around with the other options. 

Now that Auria Pro is here, I'm glad I waited because I, too, don't want to be anchored to a desk, or have to pay big bucks to have access to tons of quality sounds. Desktop daws seem to have inherited microsoft fever, overloading software with so many features that they are overly complicated and resource hogs. I've become enamored with touch replacing the mouse. Good times...

Tritonman

I like Cubasis a lot because of how rock solid it works with no bugs.  Frequent updates ease of use.  No plans for Auria anytime in the future as of now.  Perhaps after the many bugs being talked about here get worked out  I will take yet another look.  I am happy as is and that really means a lot to me.  No surprises to worry about this way.