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Tonestack 2.0 users -- significant variation in preset volume, anything that can be done?
I posted in the Yonac forums regarding an issue I am having with TS 2.0, but no luck with any responses.
When I use the various presets in Tonestack 2.0 the volume across them is significantly different. I mean, miles apart. Now of course I can tweak the input/output volumes, but this setting doesn't seem to persist when overwriting a preset. I can also turn up the volumes on the amps, but this introduces distortion often when the amp volume goes over 9 or 10, something undesirable when using a clean tone. Am I missing some setting? Or should I be adding to the presets with a pedal or something to boost the volume on the clean tones?
The clean tones are way too quiet, I need to crank the volume on the iPad to hear them. And then when I switch to something grittier I'm blown away, and need to be careful to turn down the volume before switching.
This is an iPad2 running iOS 8.3. My input is an Apogee Jam via the 30 pin port, and my output is the headphone jack into either in Line-In on my iMac or straight into headphones.
Comments
Been using TS 2 for the last few months and haven't noticed - though I very rarely go to the presets. I have 2-3 favorite amp models that I start with and tweak/add from there. I would just consider the clean tones your baseline, and start cutting volume on the dirtier tones. I'll usually add an eq after the cabinet model for subtle tonal changes, which also gives me an output fader/knob to pad overall levels down rather than using the amp master.
....or if you really like the presets just tame them by dialing down the master volume on the amp or distortion. The good thing is that TS lets you overwrite the original presets or you can save them to your own bank. It is probably the most flexible preset system.
Ok great ideas @rad3d and @supadom, I hadn't considered turning down the volumes on the amps on the louder presets. I'll probably save them to my own bank and then start modifying them from there. Thanks for the suggestions, we'll see how it goes now. My ears will thank you, no doubt!
I like Tonestack and use it often, but I don't think it does clean tones very well. The jazz amp (forgot the name) is OK but not great. IMO BIAS is the only one that has amps that can be clean and loud and the same time. JamUp gets dirty as the volume goes up and Amplitube.... ugh.
Ok thanks for the info. I have Bias, so put it back on my iPad to try tonight. I just got a notice that Bias FX is on sale... but the reviews for it are absolutely horrible. I think I'll save my $10 and see if I can tweak what I have with TS.
In this humble guitarists opinion, TS is more than capable of producing some really amazing tones. That’s without the Y split. Add that in, and I find it far more versatile than Bias. Sure, Bias is my go to when I want that Slodano true tone, but I use TS more across the full spectrum of sound I’m going for.
@boone51 - Totally agree with you, but when it comes to clean tones at a decent volume TS tends to come up short. It is either too quiet or gets dirty at too low of a volume.
Yes, when the banshee wail is needed, I don't use TS. Still, more than pleased with the app overall.
Totally agree with this. I haven't tried Tonestack, but I've tried all the others and Bias is the only one that works for me, especially with clean tones.
I second (or third) this. It's not a problem unique to ToneStack - it's actually true of a lot of modelers, even some hardware units the otherwise-awesome Zoom G1on. You can acheive clean tones if you keep the gain way down, but then you either have low volume/output or an anemic tone devoid of any low end presence. I find this on a lot of the ToneStack models, and also a lot of the original JamUp models, pretty much anything trying to do a clean Fender or Vox tone.
When BIAS came along in late 2013 (I think), Positive Grid kind of anointed it as the new gold standard in amp modeling on iPad, and a lot of people just ran with that. It's true that there are a few Fender and Dumble-based amps on there that sound much more amp like than other apps, particularly in clean amp modeling. But BIAS has so many other problems in terms of crashing, general slow performance, and infrequent updates to correct these flaws, that it's tough to recommend it over some of the other apps (for me, anyway). Also, my theory about BIAS was that it has an excellent room reverb built into it, so when you turn the app on and start playing, people hear that enhancing the amps and THAT'S what they are primarily responding to, not necessarily that the amps are so much better.
I could say a lot of negative things about ToneStack, but one nice thing I will say is that they at least set up the amps to behave like the settings on a real-life amp. Which is to say that you can set up a "cranked" tube amp sound and not clip things all to hell. I find that on BIAS, some of the amps are so hot that I need to keep the master on 2 or 3 just to keep the audio from messing up.
I go in phases with my guitar playing...in 2014, I played almost exclusively iPad modeling apps, and it was a great experience to play with some basic recording for the first time. Last year, I was sucked back into the world of home-sized combo amps and compact FX pedals. More expensive and lacks the tonal versatility of a full modeling suite, but I found it to be more tonally satisfying. This year, believe it or not, I found a great deal on a DigiTech RP360 - turns out it is class-compliant with iOS, which means I can use it as a pure audio interface via CCK! Removing some of the heavy lifting from my iPad in guitar modeling and allowing it to focus on serving as a DAW with an AudioBus chain is a nice option to have (I hate latency and audio glitches).
Yes, that room reverb is the major component of why BIAS sounds better. But, there's something about the "feel" that is different in BIAS as well--it has to do with the decay/sustain of the notes. I can achieve something that "feels" like a tube amp in BIAS, but when I take that same amp into JamUp, it completely disappears. Maybe it's just that reverb, but in my gut it feels a bit more complex than that...
Interesting discussion about the feel of the various amps. I had deleted Bias because the basic, out of the box but still spent $$ on it, just wasn't enough and then you still had to add a bunch of IAPs... after having spent money on Jam Up Pro IAPs. So Ieft it vanilla. I didn't try it last night like I said I would, but will certainly put it on my list of things to do tonight. I am staying away from Bias FX for now, too many reports of bugs.
Maybe the answer in figuring out how to get TS to work is messing a bit with an equalizer and adding a reverb. What could it be in the software that makes Bias "sound" so much better? After all, it is still the same Digital to Analog converter.
I started playing electric guitar last winter, so my feel for these things isn't well-tuned yet. But I've been having a grand time with JamUp, Flying Haggis, Bias FX, and ToneStack. I've been focusing on Tonestack for the last couple months, partly to see what it can really do and partly just to focus. I also have a Fender Mustang modeling amp that sounds pretty good to my untrained ear. I haven't used it to make any songs yet, but it has a built-in USB audio interface that works just fine with iPads and my iPod Touch 5G. I've toyed with the idea of buying a small tube amp, to get a feel for real analogue sound:
http://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=611705
But to record with it I would need to mic it, which means more equipment to buy, set up, and put away...
Positive grid moves further and further away from what they started as, now they just have a bunch of incomplete products. I really loved them when they first hit but none of my devices run their software anymore, despite the money that was spent.
I got away from iOS amps for a while but just bought a guitar interface which hopefully will be free of electrical noise since it won't be running off of a power plug. I'm a bassist by the way and usually make my own presets so I haven't noticed the volume issue that was stated.
Going back to the OP's question, have you tried putting a compressor after the CAB/Mic output to bring the levels up on the quieter presets ?
No I haven't tried that. I did add an equalizer before the amp and then raised the gain. That seemed to work pretty well, though I wonder if that is somehow not accomplishing what I want - which is to raise the volume. It seemed like a clean rise in volume but I always wonder about unintended consequences such as distortion that I can't hear, or distortion that will become apparent after more processing or once in the final mix... time to experiment!
I will try a compressor after the cab, I hadn't really considered that you could put anything after the cab, to be honest. Thanks for the suggestion!