What are your general thoughts/critique on iOS music production/performance?

lukesleepwalker

So huge. If I travel for work, I can dink around creating some music while in the airport or in the hotel or whatever. What a luxury!

AndyPlankton

@OscarSouth said:
I am with you in that loading multi app scenes should be more reliable. Right now it's vaguely doable, but we're just 'more or less' making do with what we have.

However Ableton live is working inside it's own single app ecosystem while we're running networks of apps together, so I think that we're never going to have an 'Ableton live on an ipad' scenario. Something great and flexible for sure, but also different in it's nature.

using iOS is more akin to working with the actual hardware that most of the apps are reproductions of. So the screen makes it very hands on in terms of the knobs etc....however the downside is that you can only access one app at a time whereas with the hardware units you can reach at least 2, 1 with each hand.

My particular approach is to ignore the screen as much as I can for performance and try and use controllers instead.

I'm yet to find the right combination that I feel comfortable with though.

kobamoto

@mschenkel.it said:

@kobamoto said:

@db909 said:
Live composition and arrangement. Totally on the fly.

I'm really hoping that Hermutt Lobby lead the way on this once they allow us to import our own samples!

You already can have a Playgrounds approach with HL Beatsurfing, which is the midi controller counterpart to PG(but it really needs an update, not the easiest thing to route)

considerable differences.

supadom

@AndyPlankton said:

@OscarSouth said:
I am with you in that loading multi app scenes should be more reliable. Right now it's vaguely doable, but we're just 'more or less' making do with what we have.

However Ableton live is working inside it's own single app ecosystem while we're running networks of apps together, so I think that we're never going to have an 'Ableton live on an ipad' scenario. Something great and flexible for sure, but also different in it's nature.

using iOS is more akin to working with the actual hardware that most of the apps are reproductions of. So the screen makes it very hands on in terms of the knobs etc....however the downside is that you can only access one app at a time whereas with the hardware units you can reach at least 2, 1 with each hand.

My particular approach is to ignore the screen as much as I can for performance and try and use controllers instead.

I'm yet to find the right combination that I feel comfortable with though.

Exactly. In my case loopy is just like any other hardware looper except on acid. If loopy responded to a command from AB (controlled by midi) to load a session as suggested by mr. Sleepwalker, one could pretty much leave iPad under the table. We're so spoiled with midi controllers that it is almost inexcusable not to use them: foot, breath, pad, you call it, there is one be it via a cable or wirelessly. IMO the screen should be exclusively used with apps that are specifically made for gestures rather than virtual knobs, keyboards etc. Of course I mean live and not on public transport.

Another beautiful thing is that the set can be prepared on the same device without all the external gear attached, so sampling can be easily done on the device without the need of the flipping 'proper' computers.

eustressor

If you use professional accessories and learn how to mix and make sure your material is suitably mastered, you can make professional music on iOS without ever involving your laptop or desktop computer. Any artist who treats it professionally can make a damn nice-sounding album in any genre right now. The tech, apps and interfaces are already in place - and will likely get better with time.

Add the mobility factor and mobile app pricing structure, and it's really only a matter of time before adding, "And it was made on an iPad!" to a music review becomes wholly unnecessary. Choose your weapon(s) of choice and make some kick-ass music!

AndyPlankton

It is ironic that the touch screen which is the iPads main USP is also its main limiting factor.

lukesleepwalker

@AndyPlankton said:
It is ironic that the touch screen which is the iPads main USP is also its main limiting factor.

Only live! The touch screen is amazing when I'm working at home.

OscarSouth

@lukesleepwalker said:

@AndyPlankton said:
It is ironic that the touch screen which is the iPads main USP is also its main limiting factor.

Only live! The touch screen is amazing when I'm working at home.

I've had the opposite experience. For me, compared to a keyboard and mouse the touchscreen is far superior live and inferior in a studio environment. When keyboard shortcuts are properly utilised, mouse+keyboard is king! I actually use my iPad in combination with Studio One Remote, but if the mouse/keyboard are in arms reach.. forget about it!!

The touchscreen is definitely a tool that I feel will be more and more useful in the studio as an interface, but the big leap for me was having a 'computer' with a fluid enough interface to interact with live. Where using a keyboard/mouse is unimaginable in this setting, I can easily and effortlessly make precise changes without losing the 'flow' of a performance. It's wonderful!

O

Syngularity

NEVER ever create music on an iPad or iPhone without the chance to connect it with proper studio equipment for balanced mixing, and use the comfortable built-in upload services...

lukesleepwalker

@OscarSouth said:

@lukesleepwalker said:

@AndyPlankton said:
It is ironic that the touch screen which is the iPads main USP is also its main limiting factor.

Only live! The touch screen is amazing when I'm working at home.

I've had the opposite experience. For me, compared to a keyboard and mouse the touchscreen is far superior live and inferior in a studio environment. When keyboard shortcuts are properly utilised, mouse+keyboard is king! I actually use my iPad in combination with Studio One Remote, but if the mouse/keyboard are in arms reach.. forget about it!!

The touchscreen is definitely a tool that I feel will be more and more useful in the studio as an interface, but the big leap for me was having a 'computer' with a fluid enough interface to interact with live. Where using a keyboard/mouse is unimaginable in this setting, I can easily and effortlessly make precise changes without losing the 'flow' of a performance. It's wonderful!

All depends what kind of music and/or live show you present. Are you playing EDM type stuff live?

OscarSouth

@lukesleepwalker said:
All depends what kind of music and/or live show you present. Are you playing EDM type stuff live?

Kind of hard to sum it up.. closer to folk music! (but it does incorporate EDM elements). My big 'iOS Music' project is ethnographic fusion: http://www.udaganuniverse.com/
live picture here: https://ancient-trance.de/en/line-up/233-udagan-2.html
It's out of shot but I'm using the iPad for sequenced synthesis/sampling (predefined structures are out of the question so has to be performed) and my instrument is also processed. I also use iOS music in my day to day session work with usually singer songwriter kinds of things, but in these cases it's much more subtle touches (even when the iPad is making a big sound, it's playing a specific role in a larger ensemble).

O

Matt_Fletcher_2000

@OscarSouth said:

@lukesleepwalker said:
All depends what kind of music and/or live show you present. Are you playing EDM type stuff live?

Kind of hard to sum it up.. closer to folk music! (but it does incorporate EDM elements). My big 'iOS Music' project is ethnographic fusion: http://www.udaganuniverse.com/
live picture here: https://ancient-trance.de/en/line-up/233-udagan-2.html
It's out of shot but I'm using the iPad for sequenced synthesis/sampling (predefined structures are out of the question so has to be performed) and my instrument is also processed. I also use iOS music in my day to day session work with usually singer songwriter kinds of things, but in these cases it's much more subtle touches (even when the iPad is making a big sound, it's playing a specific role in a larger ensemble).

Wow. Watched your latest music video - great stuff Oscar.

funjunkie27

Very nicely on the edge.

JeffChasteen

@eustressor said:
If you use professional accessories and learn how to mix and make sure your material is suitably mastered, you can make professional music on iOS without ever involving your laptop or desktop computer. Any artist who treats it professionally can make a damn nice-sounding album in any genre right now. The tech, apps and interfaces are already in place - and will likely get better with time.

Add the mobility factor and mobile app pricing structure, and it's really only a matter of time before adding, "And it was made on an iPad!" to a music review becomes wholly unnecessary. Choose your weapon(s) of choice and make some kick-ass music!

This! Yes.

chimp_spanner

Yeah gotta say, having just realised I can use my Komplete Audio 6 with my iPad, my view on the whole thing has changed drastically. The biggest barrier for me was the non-musical feel of trying to "play" a touch screen. With a hub, keyboard and audio interface connected it's just a whole different experience. Actually blown away. Got the USB3 cable coming tomorrow so I can charge while I work.

hellquist

@OscarSouth said:

Kind of hard to sum it up.. closer to folk music! (but it does incorporate EDM elements). My big 'iOS Music' project is ethnographic fusion: http://www.udaganuniverse.com/
live picture here: https://ancient-trance.de/en/line-up/233-udagan-2.html
It's out of shot but I'm using the iPad for sequenced synthesis/sampling (predefined structures are out of the question so has to be performed) and my instrument is also processed. I also use iOS music in my day to day session work with usually singer songwriter kinds of things, but in these cases it's much more subtle touches (even when the iPad is making a big sound, it's playing a specific role in a larger ensemble).

Cool stuff!

OscarSouth

Haha, thanks folks! That's Saydyko's composition released under her own name, which has been infused with electronic elements. The video was shot in the Siberian Republic of Sakha. It can commonly reach -50oC out there! We're developing an album in advance of our late summer performances currently which will push things much (MUCH!!) further.

I've got another sneaky video of performing in a different context if anyone is interested. It's iPhone footage of a recent bit of session work I did. I used Funk Box and Filtatron for the drums with an external midi input to control the LPF. The bass is processed with AUFX:Space and Crystalline.
The artist is Gary Edward Jones (http://www.garyedwardjones.com/)
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/134504/VID-20160320-WA0002.mp4
Don't share it!!

O

srcer

@shaboogen said:
You hit the nail on the head when you say that there are a tonne of unmixed and unmastered tunes coming out of iOS producers. Surely though that is inherent to a medium with a deliberately lower barrier to entry?

I would hazard a guess that the majority of casual music producers don't really know what mixdown or mastering stages are when it comes to production, and if you think about it, why would they? Hell, I know producers that release tunes that do relatively well on Trackitdown that don't REALLY know how a compressor works (they just saturate everything instead), and if that person doesn't, a person that bought an iPad Pro that came with Garageband probably has no chance.

None of that is intended as a slight, just seems like the lay of the land to me.

Any suggestion where to get started with mixing/mastering?
Surely not this: http://www.mixingguide.com/beats-bars-and-phrases
He says all dance music uses 4 beats, uh, waltz, hello!
Or this page: http://www.mixingguide.com/pitch-tempo-and-key
Wonders why DJing assumes tempo changes will mean pitch changes. Umm, the D stands for disc, and if you slow it down the pitch is going to change too! Holy shit, when did I get old. Realizing I can actually remember record players as a thing that regular people had, not just hipsters :P

kobamoto

if regular people had record players and hipsters still have record players wouldn't that then mean that the people without record players are the hipsters?

@Oscar, What is your mastering chain for iOS?

OscarSouth

@kobamoto said:
if regular people had record players and hipsters still have record players wouldn't that then mean that the people without record players are the hipsters?

@Oscar, What is your mastering chain for iOS?

1. Upload to Dropbox
2. Gmail link to whoever is mastering it

Being serious, on iOS I have used Final Touch in the past and had acceptable results from it, but mastering not dead centre of my skillset. I'm a performer/instrumentalist and while I'm pretty handy as a content creator through the tracking, editing & mixing stages, I prefer to hand off mastering to a serious expert (and would generally recommend that any professional body of recording work be mastered by a third party).

If I do any mastering myself I prefer to keep it as minimal as possible and whatever DAW or app I use, I just do a little light (LIGHT!!) EQing, balance things out with a multiband compressor and then limiter to boost it to the right level.

O

wigglelights

@srcer , recordingrevolution channel on YouTube has some great vids covering the basics. Not on iPad apps specifically, but covers the concepts of compression, EQing, level and limiting pretty clearly.

[Deleted User]

@chimp_spanner said:
Interesting thread! I will admit to being (initially) disappointed, having gone from a Mini 1 to an Air 2 thinking it would make production easier...I wouldn't say that's been the case haha. The biggest problem for me is just dealing with all the different standards and methods different devs use to send/receive data. I mean there's some degree of standardisation with IAA and now AB but it still feels a bit muddled especially with some things saving states and some things not. And of course a lot of it is also to do with iOS itself. Multi-tasking still feels clunky. And while I appreciate how apps have to work on tablets to ensure you don't lose work, having apps open with bits of different sessions is just...bleugh.

However...where the iPad excels is in the immediacy of single apps. It's like a shape shifter. Sometimes it's a drum machine, sometimes it's a synth, sometimes it's an outboard processor. And they're all really fun and fast to use. The best results I've had by far have been using StudioMux and using my iPad like a piece of external gear.

I'm looking forward to getting the itrack dock so I can get more out of my apps but my impression atm is that trying to replicate how I work on my laptop in any way is only gonna lead to frustration.

I hear ya with these points, another few years and AU's should open up the field a bit in terms of a more desktop oriented workflow

OscarSouth

@DaveMagoo said:

@chimp_spanner said:
Interesting thread! I will admit to being (initially) disappointed, having gone from a Mini 1 to an Air 2 thinking it would make production easier...I wouldn't say that's been the case haha. The biggest problem for me is just dealing with all the different standards and methods different devs use to send/receive data. I mean there's some degree of standardisation with IAA and now AB but it still feels a bit muddled especially with some things saving states and some things not. And of course a lot of it is also to do with iOS itself. Multi-tasking still feels clunky. And while I appreciate how apps have to work on tablets to ensure you don't lose work, having apps open with bits of different sessions is just...bleugh.

However...where the iPad excels is in the immediacy of single apps. It's like a shape shifter. Sometimes it's a drum machine, sometimes it's a synth, sometimes it's an outboard processor. And they're all really fun and fast to use. The best results I've had by far have been using StudioMux and using my iPad like a piece of external gear.

I'm looking forward to getting the itrack dock so I can get more out of my apps but my impression atm is that trying to replicate how I work on my laptop in any way is only gonna lead to frustration.

I hear ya with these points, another few years and AU's should open up the field a bit in terms of a more desktop oriented workflow

I've got a shortlist (very short) of apps that I'm extremely excited for AU versions of to arrive in the future. I'm reasonably certain that they will be on their way, for to the reasons stated.
AUFX Series (I've heard Jonatan mention future plans..)
WOW Filterbox (It was ported from AU to iOS..)

O