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Keyboard player wants key controller, simplified set-up and multiple app volume/split control
New to the forum, somewhat new to IOS music making. I've always been a hardware guy, burned out with fussing with computers. I play keyboard (Nord Stage / Casio WK7600) and play in a r&r band and love to jam with others.
I don't have huge requirements of iOS to do a lot of different things, I mostly want to expand my sound palette to get more and better quality sounds. Unfortunately my good keyboard, the Nord Stage, is not recognized thru USB to trigger the sound of Korg Module. So I'm left triggering and controlling the sounds from my cheap keyboard, the Casio WK7600, which has far fewer control options.
What I'd like are recommendations of gear and setups to get the various apps to talk to each other, to simplify my setup and increase my real time control. My music apps at this point are:
- Galileo (awesome organ)
- Korg Module (keyboard sounds)
- IGrand (IKM grand piano)
- More real time controls. I'm using the Casio WK7600 keyboard as a controller. With it I've got pitchbend, and sustain pedal control, that's it.
? Is there a way of using this keyboard to map to other parameters in these apps?
? Is there a recommended controller for these apps worth purchasing? An upgrade would be having a controller that at the least has a sweep pedal input, mod AND pitch wheels, and if possible, aftertouch. Beyond that, at least 49, preferably 61 keys, low price (!), and known to play nice with iOS and Audiobus. I have no plans at the moment to expand to Apple or PC laptops.
Simplify my setup. I play a lot at home, but want to play live with this setup, so keeping it simple and quick to set up is paramount. I don't like having a mound of spaghetti wiring!
I'm currently hooked from my iPad mini thru lightning to USB on the keyboard. I heard about a wireless setup (Puc or other) and wondering if it's worth it, and what compromises are involved. I also saw on the recommended equipment list on this forum a usb to lightning adapter with multiple USB ports. Other suggestions?Apps talking to each other.
My basic desire is to control volume and splits from all three (or more) apps that are playing simultaneously. When my Module and IGrand are both on, they both can be heard, which is great, but it'd be cool to have some way of controlling at least the volume of both apps without switching between them, and, if possible, set up keyboard splits
The other desire is to use FX apps to add to the sound color of these apps.
Thanks,
Randyman, aka Randy
Comments
OP here.
Hmmmm.... The text editor changed my numbering above, and there's no EDIT option to fix mistakes in the post.
Should read: 2. Simplify my setup
3. Apps talking to each other
@Randyman
If you can buy another Casio for about £600, get the PX5s
Full size piano keys.
4 separate midi layers / splits
Knobs, sliders, pedals and wheels can all be assigned to send out midi on any or all of the 4 midi layers / splits
Very good controller keyboard
Works with iOS
Good built in sounds
Use all your apps in AUM and connect up the Casio.
Send the audio of the iPad back through the Casio PX5s and connect up to your amp.
Wow, reading App Store reviews of AUM, it sounds exactly like what I was looking for.
The Casio PX5s keyboard has been on my radar forever, and like you said it has outstanding MIDI control, but it has several glaring omissions that take it out of the running: no sweep pedal input, small screen to work with, no aftertouch.
The latest generation Casios have a large touchscreen (not doing complicated shit on a small screen ever again!), sweep pedal input, but unfortunately no aftertouch. The one I'm saving up for is the Casio MZ-X500, just now available, has 16 pads, 3 control knobs, etc. It'd be perfect, but at $1,100 it is more money than I have now and I'd like to jump further into the iOS instrument world.
A controller, even a used one, for under $200 would be ideal as a stopgap board.
Thanks for your input!!!
If you would like to use the Nord and its controls, you can buy a cheap MIDI<->USB cable. They're like 10 bucks on Amazon.
App wise, I'd check out Audiobus, http://www.imidipatchbay.com/ and/or AUM.
If you just want to augment your set up with dedicated faders, checkout something cheap like the Korg NanoKontrol 2 or the Arturia BeatStep. Both are pretty available on used markets.
You might also checkout the Samson Graphite line. They're inexpensive and have lots of controls though I don't think they support expression pedals. http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/dec12/articles/samson-graphite-49.htm
Yep not many cheap boards have after touch and a full set of pedal inputs
Syrupcore,
Hmmm... So instead of lightning to USB B, this adapter would route the lightning to my physical MIDI ports.
Don't know if that'd solve the problem. When using Korg Module an error message comes up in it that says, "Nord Stage not supported". I'll check on the Nord forum if this workaround works.
Thanks for all the suggestions, though in the spirit of fewer wires and KISS, I'm aiming for 1 keyboard to do it all, instead of having various attached specialty pieces like the BeatStep.
Try Midiflow. You should then be able to route whatever midi where ever you want
You'd still use the lightening USB adapter. Then a cable something like this one would plug into the 5pin MIDI ports on your NORD on one end and the lightening->USB adapter on the other. Your apps will see whatever that adapter publishes itself as, not the Nord since the the Nord wouldn't have anything to do with USB directly. That'd be one keyboard, one cable, one adapter and your ipad.
My love for MIDIFlow runs deep but think the OP actually wants iMIDIPatchBay instead. Both are made by the same developer but iMIDIPatchBay is more specific to this sort of live players set up with splits, layers and set lists.
My idea was to use the one keyboard midi signal in. Split and or layer midi to the devises and then have the audio mixed back through AUM with fx etc. Wouldn't that work?
Try Yamaha np 12 or no 32.. After touch, Bluetooth capability w adaptor.. Just no pitch bend is all.
Casio mzx500 is a BEEEST!
AUM, midiflow, imidipatchbay, I have no idea which will get me the simple results I'm looking for
That midi cable looks promising, at under $10 it's worth a shot. Hopefully the sustain pedal and pitchbend would still work.
The Yamaha np12/32 have no pitch/mod wheels or sweep pedal inputs. When it comes to controllers on a keyboard those are the most basic in my book, followed by aftertouch and a few knobs for filter sweeps, eq, etc.
Yes, really looking forward to having the mz-x500! Im anxious though about the quality of the onboard sounds, the much cheaper wk7600 II have is definitely lacking.
Absolutely. But have you looked at iMIDIPatchBay? It's made to do the 'split and layer' part you mention all from one keyboard. As well as controller remapping, everything recallable from MIDI program changes (just like a gigging keyboardist needs). Indeed, I think the demo videos for it used a single Nord as a controller.
I'd be inclined to combine iMIDIPatchBay for the MIDI routing/layering/splitting and AUM for mixing and effects. You can actually do splitting and layering in AUM so you might start with just that—it's just not as easy/robust as it is in iMIDIPatchbay. Understandable since it's a "nice to have" bonus in AUM whereas it's the whole point of existence for iMidiPB!
Midi Breakout Box does splits and layers and gives you 100 presets for $1 US.
MIDI BreakOut Box by Vinclaro
https://appsto.re/us/8eZOz.i
Thanks for the clarification!
So I'm imagining that the signal from my keyboard comes into the IPad as a single midi channel, and within one of these apps like imidiPB or AUM the midi channel is multiplied into a second midi channel and one of them is telling Korg module to play a specific note range, and the other midi channel is telling IGrand to play in a different note range and at a different volume.
AUM sounded appealing cause I imagine you've got one midi channel coming in, but once you've assigned the tracks within its mixer to the different apps, it'd be easy easy to change the volume of each individual track, but come to think of it, not the note range.
Got me a learning curve!
Yep, that's the gist. You can also apply different controllers per app-sustain, mod, etc. And you can transpose the entire rig in half steps! I would like to second syrupcore's recommendation of iMidiPatchbay for the purposes you've described. I also recommend M-Audio controllers, I've owned a few and I am currently using the Code 61. Looks cool, offers many features, 4 zones, after touch, etc. I also like the feel of the keys overall.
You can actually set the note range for an destination app directly within AUM. It's at the bottom of the MIDI input view. You can also have several apps listening on the same port (your USB dongle thing) but each destination app fixed to listen only to a given input channel. That way you can change the MIDI channel on your master keyboard and have it trigger only the apps you set it to instead of faffing about with the iPad. If you want to switch these sorts of settings while playing live though, say in between songs, that's where AUM will come up a little short. It's very very easy to use but you'd have to hunt and peck around to get it set up though you could save different presets for each tune.
iMIDIPatchbay can also send out CCs for each preset you load via patch change. AUM responds to CCs so you could use it to set the Volume/effects sends/whatevers at the top of each song in a set. And adjust from there, naturally. Actually, all of the apps you mentioned surely support CC7 for volume, which iMIDIPatchbay can send, so you might be able to get away without loading AUM at all, simplifying the whole thing a little further.