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Let's talk sub-$100 Interfaces for Synths
I'm curious what a lot of you use as interfaces if you have just a few external sources to hook up. I get the sense from reading this forum and reading reviews that a lot of people use something like the Focusrite Scarlett 2i2. But I never actually had a box-style interface like that because I did not use computer DAW's prior to starting with iOS, and the only external "gear" I had was my guitars.
Now, I have some low-end hardware synths/machines, including the Volcas, a few Pocket Operators, and a MicroBrute. I'm looking for ways to record them in Cubasis and incorporate them into iOS projects. I'm currently using two things right now:
Behringer UCA202
Apogee JAM Guitar Interface
For recording synths as home projects, which of those two is the better option? The Behringer is dirt-cheap, but converts audio at 48 kHz quality and seems to do pretty well. I need one or two adapters to get it into the RCA input, but it's manageable.
The Apogee JAM seems to work, but only because it has a gain control that allows me to back off the input to something closer to line level versus instrument (guitar) level. I love that it has a 1/4" input jack, because that makes it really easy to hook up guitar pedals between the synth and the interface. But I wonder if the Apogee JAM is really meant for guitar, and if it's doing something to the audio.
Is one of these better than other for capturing synth or drum machine audio? Or do I need to look at a different option? I should note that I do have a cheap 5-channel mixer that I can use if I need to hook up mics/XLR or multiple sources.
Comments
The problem is, you may want stereo inputs, or at least two mono inputs. I say, get an used Fast Track pro from M-Audio and be happy: less than 70 bucks on eBay, 24/96 quality, two XLR inputs, class compliant.
Tech specs: http://www.core-sound.com/FastTrackPro/2.php
The downside is that you'll need a powered hub and an USB to lightning adapter.
By the way, WaveMachine Labs, Auria Pro's developer, keeps a list of working interfaces for Auria: http://auriaapp.com/Support/auria-audio-interfaces
Behringer UMC204 is only $70 new on amazon. Seems like a really good value. Not sure how it works with iOS. I've heard positive and negative reports.
That is a fair point - I'm recording these as mono, which for a drum machine or bass synth isn't the worst thing, but that is a limitation.
The need for external power is one reason I do like the two options I am currently using - they are powered by the iPad - I could even record sitting in my car if I wanted to.
That does seem like a really good value - even has a MIDI interface, which many in this price range do not. I guess the concern I always have is that I don't want to go buy some full-featured digital interface and then plug it in to find out it's saddled with all kinds of latency. The UCA202 (miraculously) does not seem to suffer from that at all. The reviews on the UMC204 seem pretty good as well, though I assume it also requires a powered hub (I do have one those little $15 Plugable ones).
Alesis iO4 is a good deal. 4 ins, DIN MIDI i/o, hardware monitoring, guitar input, xlr inputs, separate level controls.... Can not be powered from the iPad though (comes with a PSU).
Totally busting the bank but I've been eyeing http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Sig12MT lately. I'm sorta deeply invested in my iCMA4+ setup at the moment and you can't use two audio devices at once so I'm keeping it at 'eyeing' for now.
That's funny, I nearly bought an iO2 Express once (think it does all the same, but just two inputs), but I passed on it for some reason I can't remember.
That's a good suggestion, and probably good enough for my limited means, but the build quality on the Alesis scared me a little.
talk about wierd import duties. the sig12mt costs less here than the iconnectaudio4+.....
That's just bizarre. Where is here? What does the ica4 cost?
Definitely not the most rugged thing but it does the job well. Will be easier to hook up your stuff than using the behringer. Can use two inputs for the items you most often use and the other two can be a submix from your 5 channel mixer.
Seems to me @StormJH1 that you have two perfectly good interfaces already. Is there anything about them that you can't get on with? Other than a fear that they aren't the most expensive. Use your ears. Do they produce audio recordings that make your music sound alive?
i live in india. the ica4+ works out to around 28000 Rs here.
meanwhile..... http://www.amazon.in/Soundcraft-Signature-12-Analog-Mixer/dp/B01IHD9EWQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1475269690&sr=8-1&keywords=Soundcraft+Signature+12
I actually agree with that. My primary original question, if you look back at it, was whether I was better off using the UCA202 versus the Apogee JAM for synths. Wasn't necessarily looking to buy a new interface. All of the literature I read for the JAM suggested that it was meant to be used for guitar, so I just wondered if (a) anyone else was doing that; or (b) there was any sound quality reason why I shouldn't be. Remember, I'm think about this like a guitar player, so in my mind, plugging a synth into an interface designed for guitar feels like trying to use a bass guitar into a guitar amp. But in practice, it seems to be working fine if I back off the gain knob.
I would actually prefer not to buy any more accessories for iOS music as I have quite a bunch of "stuff" piled up as it is, though I finally feel like I have most of what I need to do covered (Audio interfaces, MIDI interface, powered hub, etc.).
Presonus iTwo can be had for under $100 used. Mine has been great. Notable features:
two Combo XLR/ 1/4" inputs, with a switch, to make them hi-Z (for direct guitar input vs line level).
Phantom power
Old time MIDI in/out
connects to ipad with sync cable (no Camera connection kit needed). Saves $30 right there.
Mix knob between inputs and ipad/PC output, for zero latency monitoring.
Separate headphone volume, for previewing sounds, or recording in the same room as your studio monitors
Bus powered thru USB when using it with a computer (powered by wallwart/USB phone charger, thru USB port, when connected to the ipad with the special sync cable USB jack.
Got an ICA4+ now, after delving into iOS madness deeper, but it was twice as much, and I still recommend the presonus.
The only thing that bugs me is that the direct monitoring of the inputs sums them to mono, and I always use it for stereo keyboards. Not that it is a mistake on their part, people would have been pissed if say, their vocal mic is only coming out of one ear, so they would have had to add a confusing switch to the back, or something to satisfy stereo input sources.
It was tricky to find one that you can use a midi keyboard, at the same time as the audio in/out. Lots of solutions have lots of extra stuff to plug in. Powered hubs, CCK, multiple wallwarts, etc., all a drag, since most people like the ios stuff for portability.
Not sure of the price, but did you see the Alesis 4 channel mixer/ ipad dock? That could be cool for someone with a couple hardware goodies, nice form factor too, less stuff strewn around a table.
EDIT: Bah, no midi on the Alesis IO mixer. Be back to the powered hub.
Behringer umc204hd finaly worked with my iPad mini 2 after updating firmware. It sounds incredibly good, synths especially. I am addicted.
Did not worked before firmware update with usb3 CCK, and need a powered usb hub. Can only be updated with from MS Windows.
Also, don't count on customer service, they suck badly.
I have this interface, it's good and works well with the iPad. The power supply is low quality though, typical power supply that comes with things like this, so if you live in a house with bad wiring like me, expect lots of noise. But I've used it in other environments without an issue. In fact, there's video of me using it to record vocals in a van for the auria contest a few years ago, it's on youtube. I've definitely Gotten use from it.
I love how everyone keeps ignoring the original question
In fact, I'd like to hear an informed opinion on this as well, as strangely enough I am using those exact 2 interfaces myself...
Sorry, I'm one of the missed-the-original-question crowd. Seems to me the only way to really know is to record the same thing into both and see how it sounds.
My existing biases says that if what you're recording is mono, the Apogee is going to be better most every time. Might be fairly even if you're recording, say, the PO-12 at good strong volume but I bet if you record something peaking at -15db the Apogee will show its pedigree.
Thanks @syrupcore , that's helpful. Sounds like the Apogee is workable for my needs, but I will try them both. Most of what I'm recording externally would be mono, blended with mono and stereo iOS instruments.
that's highly recommended - the Apogee has a high impedance input that may even be optimized for inductive load (the coil of a typical guitar/bass pickup).
Your synth output is low impedance and a capacitative load.
It will work in any any case, but if the sound is pleasing also depends on the output circuit.
That's hardly predictable... there are indeed circuits that want proper loading (contrary to the common rule that it doesn't matter as long as input impedance is higher than output impedance, usually 5-10 times)
I just mention it in case you experience a strange or thin tone.
(this is the potentially confusing load/source impedance topic...)
On the other hand a synth signal is very robust, compared to a microphone or pickup, and shouldn't present a problem to any current converter, even those $10 USB sticks are likely to work in sufficient quality.
What circuits? The impedance of a connection between an input and output is decided by whichever is the lowest, usually the output. Doesn't matter if the input impedance is high, if the signal feeding it has a low output impedance, because it makes it low. Take guitar pedals- most modern pedals have low output impedance, and they plug into the next guitar pedal, or amp, which have a high input impedance. They don't sound thin.
It's making things too complicated to musicians, to make them feel like they need to be afraid of impedance, and they can't understand it. The only practical situation where most musicians will run into input impedance problems, connecting their gear together, is plugging a guitar or bass (or something with piezo pickups) into a low impedance, line input, on a mixer or audio interface, or passive DI box. It makes the guitar or bass lose treble (for piezo pickups, without a preamp, the opposite, they lose bass frequencies), because the pickups are too wimpy to drive a lot of current into the low impedance input. Line sources, like synths, can plug into high or low impedance inputs with no ill effect.
The original poster can plug synth into the guitar input on the Jam interface, with no issues. They may need to turn it down a little bit, because the synth can get louder than a guitar, but that is a headroom issue, nothing to do with impedance.
that's why I wrote that I meantion it 'just in case... it doesn't sound as expected
(and that it may be confusing, but it is as it is - and we both don't know which synths and drumboxes he will connect)
Btw the same applies to the low impedance output of an IOS device, which some users describe as 'not optimal', while for others it works perfectly when connected to a line level input.