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Are you still excited by iOS music apps?

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Comments

  • Apple could release an iOS Pro for iPad Pro owners, with preemptive multitasking and file system (root access). The kernel is the same XNU (Darwin OS, Unix) upon which macOS is built, so it shouldn't be difficult, technical wise. But I will not hold my breath for it, because it would hurt Apple's ultrabook sales, so it's ultimately a business decision.

  • Been catching up on this thread, reading posts, and something came to mind- i'm no more or less excited about any particular iOS app than I am at the piano or with a bass guitar or drum in my hands. I'm just turned on by sound and the chance to make music. So, an iOS app, or a physical instrument...it's all the same. Just let me make something that I can express myself with, and hopefully, connect with people.

  • @theconnactic said:
    But I will not hold my breath for it, because it would hurt Apple's ultrabook sales, so it's ultimately a business decision.

    I doubt that's the reason. It's more fundamentally a conceptual design decision rather than a business decision. iOS has always been designed around the concept of it explicitly not being a PC: no file management, no funny business with drivers and components, no external storage. Nothing that makes PCs such a pain in the behind most of the time. Nobody enjoys managing files, sorting out a hierarchical mess of folders full of accumulated junk. At least, I don't know anyone who does and I know plenty people who make a mess of it all the time...

    iOS was designed to put just the fun part of computing in the limelight: applications that work immediately, designed around simple focused tasks, as seamlessly integrated in the system as possible. No installation, no configuration, no setup, no tinkering with different settings, minimal overhead, short learning curves. Everything just works right away - and you don't have to worry about where your files are. True iOS apps didn't even have oldfashioned save/open systems with filenames. They implicitly remember states and make smart decisions for the user, etc. Sure, these days many apps do have "file management", but that's because many developers and users are so hung up on their way of working with the PC/laptop that they can't surrender to a different paradigm.

    Introducing filesystems and complex OS features would go against the most fundamental design principle of iOS. If you truly need those, Android is the way to go I guess, since that was designed to be a hardware-agnostic generic PC-system in a mobile box :#

  • I have enough music apps. Fishing rods now excite me :p

  • @Brambos, I agree the casual consumer doesn't want manage a file system etc, but a professional/power user might need those features, and they have a line of "pro" iPads, so it would make sense for them to offer these features in an iOS build tailored for these iPads - and they could do it: there is a thing in both macOS and iOS called SMBIOS that allow for differentiate between a regular iPad and the iPad Pro, so only the correct iPad gets the advanced features.

    All the best!

  • @theconnactic said:
    @Brambos, I agree the casual consumer doesn't want manage a file system etc, but a professional/power user might need those features, and they have a line of "pro" iPads, so it would make sense for them to offer these features in an iOS build tailored for these iPads - and they could do it: there is a thing in both macOS and iOS called SMBIOS that allow for differentiate between a regular iPad and the iPad Pro, so only the correct iPad gets the advanced features.

    For me iOS10 is almost perfect in terms of useability. I'm sure iOS11 will improve things further but I'm more interested in the hardware getting to the next level: 8GB RAM, Terabyte storage and USB-C file transfer would be fabulous.

  • For many things, I can get by pretty easy with the lack of a conventional file and computer system on iOS. With multiple apps needing to share content, though, I'd prefer to have a hands-on central file system. Managing files that way for me is straightforward, way more efficient, and the concept simple. These days I find myself too often confused about where files are and how to get them from one place to another. So Apple didn't make iOS for old dummies like me. :)

  • I find this thread interesting. I would be fascinated to see a matrix of age, musical style preference, geographic locale, and other little bits all laid out side by side.

    The demographics so to speak of ios music.

  • More Gadget's excites me into instabuy mode

  • Are you kidding? I'm on a plane ... A PLANE.. bought WIFI just for this post which i saw at the boarding gate ... I'm playing with 2 moog synths ... A wild guitar similar ... with some drums !

    Sure i wish it all connected up better but

    I'M ON A PLANE...

    'Course its exciting

  • For me it's no longer "exciting".IOS is simply what I use and that's a good thing. "The hype" is more often than not a distraction from creating, I've learned not to follow it.

  • edited April 2017
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • 'Excited' may be too strong a word, but I rely entirely on iOS apps to make music. Nothing compels me to take my XP-50 in to get repaired - and it's pretty much an ancient mammal if not a outright dinosaur. I'm staying put.

  • Are iOS music apps still a heart-thumping, nerve-wracking, about to jump out of an airplane thrill ride for me? No. I can now pick up my Pad without hyperventilating. :)

  • @brambos said:

    Introducing filesystems and complex OS features would go against the most fundamental design principle of iOS. If you truly need those, Android is the way to go I guess, since that was designed to be a hardware-agnostic generic PC-system in a mobile box :#

    Not sure about that. I use iOS as it's portable primarily, not because it's so great. I would much prefer a file management system rather than having lots of sound files all over the place. For sure, you need to adapt to iOS from the desktop way of working (as things currently stand)

  • Installing, deleting and manage tons of tools from different developers is a lot more easy in iOS indeed. But connecting these, using the same samples in different tools, easy drop and drag etc. is still much more easy in other OS.
    As usual there are pro and contra everywhere.
    If i could drag and drop a midi sequence or sample direct from an app or folder of my choice into another app or even to a specific point in my sequencer of choice it would speed up things a lot.

  • @ltf3 said:
    Are you kidding? I'm on a plane ... A PLANE.. bought WIFI just for this post which i saw at the boarding gate ... I'm playing with 2 moog synths ... A wild guitar similar ... with some drums !

    Sure i wish it all connected up better but

    I'M ON A PLANE...

    'Course its exciting

    I share this excitement every time I travel and have s couple of hours to tinker with my music on a flight.

  • edited April 2017

    @lukesleepwalker said:

    @ltf3 said:
    Are you kidding? I'm on a plane ... A PLANE.. bought WIFI just for this post which i saw at the boarding gate ... I'm playing with 2 moog synths ... A wild guitar similar ... with some drums !

    Sure i wish it all connected up better but

    I'M ON A PLANE...

    'Course its exciting

    I share this excitement every time I travel and have s couple of hours to tinker with my music on a flight.

    Travelling 1 1/2 hours to work for half a year got me into iOS music all those years ago. Still today, it makes you appreciate traveling. You find yourself in weird focus, knowing the next hours you can immerse yourself. It's so weird that you can find more focus on a plane/train than in your homestudio sometimes...

    Or if you just fire up a synth like the FM4, unleash the filthiest vintage sounds and stare at your iPad in disbelief, that this sound really comes out of that tablet...

  • I'm getting to a point now where my beatmaking workflow is finally becoming fun, and I'm super titillated.

    Now that I'm jamming and it's flowing and I can see these sexy beats coming together I'm much more stoked. A month ago I was ready to say eff it and go hardware only, now I'm loving the balance.

    Everything in its right place, beatboxing looping stays mostly w my rc202 but oh the synths and drum machines on iOS so luscious!!

    The fact I can do all dis on the phone while waiting for wifey poo to finish shopping or make a quick beat while baby is napping is so perfect!

    Now only to see if I can resist buying an old school MPC and save up for dat iPad Pro 2 10.5 haha

  • @Gaia.Tree said:
    I'm getting to a point now where my beatmaking workflow is finally becoming fun, and I'm super titillated.

    Now that I'm jamming and it's flowing and I can see these sexy beats coming together I'm much more stoked. A month ago I was ready to say eff it and go hardware only, now I'm loving the balance.

    Everything in its right place, beatboxing looping stays mostly w my rc202 but oh the synths and drum machines on iOS so luscious!!

    The fact I can do all dis on the phone while waiting for wifey poo to finish shopping or make a quick beat while baby is napping is so perfect!

    Now only to see if I can resist buying an old school MPC and save up for dat iPad Pro 2 10.5 haha

    Would love to hear your stuff.

  • @brambos said:

    @theconnactic said:
    But I will not hold my breath for it, because it would hurt Apple's ultrabook sales, so it's ultimately a business decision.

    I doubt that's the reason. It's more fundamentally a conceptual design decision rather than a business decision. iOS has always been designed around the concept of it explicitly not being a PC: no file management, no funny business with drivers and components, no external storage. Nothing that makes PCs such a pain in the behind most of the time. Nobody enjoys managing files, sorting out a hierarchical mess of folders full of accumulated junk. At least, I don't know anyone who does and I know plenty people who make a mess of it all the time...

    iOS was designed to put just the fun part of computing in the limelight: applications that work immediately, designed around simple focused tasks, as seamlessly integrated in the system as possible. No installation, no configuration, no setup, no tinkering with different settings, minimal overhead, short learning curves. Everything just works right away - and you don't have to worry about where your files are. True iOS apps didn't even have oldfashioned save/open systems with filenames. They implicitly remember states and make smart decisions for the user, etc. Sure, these days many apps do have "file management", but that's because many developers and users are so hung up on their way of working with the PC/laptop that they can't surrender to a different paradigm.

    Introducing filesystems and complex OS features would go against the most fundamental design principle of iOS. If you truly need those, Android is the way to go I guess, since that was designed to be a hardware-agnostic generic PC-system in a mobile box :#

    I think @brambos is right in terms of why iOS was designed the way it was, but Apple has actively promoted the iPad Pro as an alternative to PC platforms for professionals. In order to meet this need, they'll have to improve how apps share resources with each other, other people, network resources, and other devices. This doesn't mean a return to a traditional multi-layered directory system that users have to manage but will mean Apple will have to be creative about applying a GUI and other tools in their iOS that facilitate resource networking which aren't adequately addressed now when the focus is primarily every app being an island unto itself.

    Ultimately, I think @brambos will be proven wrong if he thinks Apple will let Android and/or Microsoft dominate professional mobile applications without doing anything to facilitate professional apps and workflows. This will be a significant pivot for Apple as mobile markets become saturated with devices having enough computational power for professional applications and the opportunity to expand beyond media consumption, social media, games, and isolated standalone app usage. If Apple fails to address professional usage beyond superficial marketing claims, they'll increasingly lose out to devices that can. At the very least, their shareholders will press them on creating an iOS which supports professional workflows.

  • @InfoCheck said:
    Ultimately, I think @brambos will be proven wrong if he thinks Apple will let Android and/or Microsoft dominate professional mobile applications without doing anything to facilitate professional apps and workflows. This will be a significant pivot for Apple as mobile markets become saturated with devices having enough computational power for professional applications and the opportunity to expand beyond media consumption, social media, games, and isolated standalone app usage. If Apple fails to address professional usage beyond superficial marketing claims, they'll increasingly lose out to devices that can. At the very least, their shareholders will press them on creating an iOS which supports professional workflows.

    Don't get wrong, I'm not saying it is what they should do.. it's just my analysis of what they have been doing from the beginning. But quite frankly I don't see a lot of things hinting at change so far. The 'pro' moniker in iPad Pro is just paying lip service to professional workflows other than those of illustrators and visual artists who need a pen and a calibrated wide-gamut display.

    They will certainly lose out on some marketshare if they don't address that. But Apple have often shown that that doesn't bother them necessarily if it doesn't mesh with their product filosophy.

    We'll see where they'll take it. Not much any of us can do to influence it ;-)

  • @ltf3 said:
    Are you kidding? I'm on a plane ... A PLANE.. bought WIFI just for this post which i saw at the boarding gate ... I'm playing with 2 moog synths ... A wild guitar similar ... with some drums !

    Sure i wish it all connected up better but

    I'M ON A PLANE...

    'Course its exciting

    Love this. Not just talking the talk.

  • @brambos said:

    @InfoCheck said:
    Ultimately, I think @brambos will be proven wrong if he thinks Apple will let Android and/or Microsoft dominate professional mobile applications without doing anything to facilitate professional apps and workflows. This will be a significant pivot for Apple as mobile markets become saturated with devices having enough computational power for professional applications and the opportunity to expand beyond media consumption, social media, games, and isolated standalone app usage. If Apple fails to address professional usage beyond superficial marketing claims, they'll increasingly lose out to devices that can. At the very least, their shareholders will press them on creating an iOS which supports professional workflows.

    Don't get wrong, I'm not saying it is what they should do.. it's just my analysis of what they have been doing from the beginning. But quite frankly I don't see a lot of things hinting at change so far. The 'pro' moniker in iPad Pro is just paying lip service to professional workflows other than those of illustrators and visual artists who need a pen and a calibrated wide-gamut display.

    They will certainly lose out on some marketshare if they don't address that. But Apple have often shown that that doesn't bother them necessarily if it doesn't mesh with their product filosophy.

    We'll see where they'll take it. Not much any of us can do to influence it ;-)

    I think they have about a two year window to move beyond the lip service in terms of pro functionality or else they'll be paying a very heavy price and will be marginalized in the market place to the point where it will take a long time to recover if they ever do. I don't know how much of the pro flow will be focused on music but a lot of the resource sharing aspects would benefit pro music apps too.

    Basically it will be why should I buy this more expensive mobile device when it won't support the functionality I need for work? If they can't say yes you can and it just works, Apple will begin to implode. Until this point people haven't really asked this because it wasn't expected of mobile devices. This will change with the more powerful devices and any company including Apple who doesn't have a viable solution will fall by the way side.

  • On desktop I don't recall trying to use so many separate standalone music apps to accomplish a project. There was Gigasampler and Reason/Rewire...but it wasn't long before plugins became the way forward.

    iOS has been slow to transition this way. But since I've gone 100% AUv3 the iPad has smoked the desktop for productivity and enjoyability. Would love to see AUv3 evolve to include larger screen estate suitable for 3rd party touch instrument plugins.

    But as it stands my iMac 5k and MacBook Pro 15 inch have been relegated to mere furniture. iPad is that good, bring on iOS11 and the next set of DAW updates.

  • I also don’t see the word “Pro” in Apple’s marketing of the newer iPads as an obligation they’re taking to uphold any so-called professional standard. I think of the iPad Pros as more powerful devices on which to run iOS, which is a platform built for ease of use and security, the same OS people are familiar with on their phones. I haven’t seen any indication that Apple has plans to compromise there, for whatever that’s worth.

    I don’t know how viable the market is. As professional users become more demanding, though, maybe MacOS evolves into a system for a new line of Real Pro tablets. :)

  • I think a big part of the "Pro" monikor is just marketing too. People get excited when they see something marketed towards artistic professionals, and find it easier to justify the added expense over the standard version. "If it's good enough for video editing, surely it's good enough for my needs". That sort of thing.

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