Loopy Pro: Create music, your way.
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Comments
Remaster eq was The best for me but strangely it Works properly in aum but have no sounds in The main daw (auria , cubasis, modstep) .It looks like remaster is abandonned. This goose eq is not that bad too but i didnt understand too why a subscription is needed.Does it Worth it ? Is it every year or lifetime (unlimited) ?
@grego68 I'm glad you like Goose EQ. We are proud of what we have been able to do so far and want to keep making it better for years to come. We want to become the "obvious" answer to "What EQ should I get?" That is what we aspire to.
I have to say, we have been surprised with the difficulty we have had communicating our intentions. Ether by our bad communication skills or by people not bothering to read, we are not on the same page.
Let me have another crack at it. There are several good reasons to do subscriptions. Please read the second half of our app description about the revenue model, if you haven't yet.
Trial period. With subscriptions Apple has provided the possibility of a demo. When you subscribe you can use the full app for two weeks before you pay a penny. Like has been mentioned on the forum before, is this not an iOS app holy grail? I don't even want to think about how many apps I have purchased only to try out for a few minutes and realize I was sold a bill of goods. Not going to happen with subscriptions.
Price. We are new here as developers. We still need to gain customers trust. We thought using a subscription would be a great way to do that. What do I mean? We thought charging $10-$15 upfront for an app by the developer you have not heard of would be a tall order. With subscriptions you can use the app for one year and if we are not keeping up our end of the deal you can drop us. Really no risk for you. This also seems, to us, to be more honest.
Longevity. This is why you were seeing subscriptions happening in most professional situations. The pay upfront model works fine for a little game you're going to play for a few minutes or a few hours or a few days but not for something that you would like to last for years. Developer of games build a game sell it and move onto the next game to make a living, that is not ideal in our situation. This should be readily apparent especially with iOS 11 64 bit thing happening.
Finally can I just point out again, just in case it has been missed. The subscription is $3.49 a year. NOT a month. If you master one song a year with it and enjoy it, I would call that a deal!
lucas,
My trial period expires tomorrow, and I am very happy for you to have my money for the next year.
Before, I was against subscriptions on principle, but principles, like rules and china, are often made to be broken.
You make a quality app, and I can't wait to see what else you have upcoming.
You do nice work and I anticipate more.
I'd be very happy to pay you $10-$15 up front just to give you a chance. If that's what Goose EQ is worth to you, I'd be more than happy to add Goose EQ to my collection of Audio Units. One can never have enough good AUs, and yours is very good. It's the "subscription-only" problem that's blocking me from going all in. If you were able to offer a hybrid pricing option, you'd win over more customers with your first foray into the world of iOS music apps. Those who are on the fence would go with the subscription model, and those of us who are really sure would invest good money.
I know you're worried about possible backlash if you decide to no longer develop Goose EQ and people paid you a fee of $14.99 or something like that, but most customers understand they paid the price they thought an app was worth at the time. You seem to be a very motivated developer, and I'd have no doubts you'd keep developing good products for us to use.
However, the problems that could arise if all apps were to suddenly become subscription based would be:
-Spending hundreds to thousands of dollars/pounds/euros per month/year to maintain a professinal set-up on the iPad. A lot of us aren't able to afford that.
-Not being able to keep track of all of the upcoming payment dates. (This being my biggest issue/fear.)
You mean with situations like Adobe, Microsoft Office 360, and Autodesk? Why do you think I don't bother with Microsoft Office anymore, dumped Sketchbook, and have sought out other alternatives?
We know you are a Goose, not an Angry Bird.
The pay upfront model works perfectly fine for audio software/vst plugins in a desktop environment. Look at FL Studio (desktop version) for instance. Image-Line has a "lifetime free updates" policy for all their software, and yet they still continue to thrive as a company without the need for subscription pricing models. (Oddly enough, Image-Line started off as a company that produced videogames for the PC.
You'd never realise it given the fact their name is synonymous with PC EDM music production and beatmaking.)
I am just saying, maybe you can offer a hybrid pricing option. Those of us who are unable to pay a subscription would be glad to pay you a full fee. Just food for thought. Thanks.
Go to settings>iTunes&AppStore>tap on your Id>Settings>subscriptions
I didn't know that was there.
Thanks for the tip.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsive_buying_disorder
Wanna buy some snake oil?
Sorry.
You're charging an subscription for an EQ.
Not even a "suite" of ...well, anything else along side with it.
An EQ? Come on, save that rubbish for the full-on computer folks.
SMH
What are you implying?
I (politely) disagree with your post completely (not just the part I quoted) and am finding it incredibly difficult to not be angered by this trend of repetitious attacks at someone I feel is acting morally and practically sound in both a business and ethic. You may not agree with him - just don't buy the app.
@OscarSouth Apologies. I can agree about the not argeeing with him just don't buy the app bit.
I won't agree with the other stuff. He may be speaking sincerely, but it is the principle of it that I find difficult to understand.
I can definitely understand the resistance to subscriptions, and have experienced all of those emotions myself. That's why I was relieved to see this app leading the charge (aside from a few other mastering and production based apps which I haven't crossed paths with). Even on a subscription the price is a STEAL as a yearly payment for a quality EQ! (disclaimer - have not tried it).
I can see two possible futures for iOS audio:
We continue as we are as a niche, with devs being primarily (somewhat?) supported by the charity of a tightly knit community. Yeah - this has been great, but will it continue forever? I fear a future where essential tools in professional workflows will become outdated and unreliable, because the business model didn't provide any sustainable opportunity to grow and flourish. I'm greatly saddened that we're (seemingly) about to lose Samvada - a unique and special app which has no substitute, to exactly this situation. There's an ominous spectre looming over other apps such as Samplr and FLUX:FX (in the more distant future) too.
We find a middle ground where we can support small teams, individual developers and large corporate efforts equally and sustainably, based on real value and not consumerist habits.
I use probably two dosen apps regularly in live performance (you can actually see them listed in this thread - https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/19476/recent-inspirefest-concert-in-airbnb-hq-follow-up-pics-video-clips#latest)
I'd love to reach a point where I can pay reasonable subscriptions to fund the upkeep of all of those and enjoy the continued development of my favourite tools along with the peace of mind that there's at least some sort of ethically sound business relationship between their makers and myself, to (somewhat) ensure all of our continuing and mutual survival!
Even if all the individual apps together added up to a decent amount - let's be pessimistic:
In my list is 20 apps and I'm sure there's a few more I use regularly. Let's (completely) unrealistically assume that every app is charging a subscription and that the price is much higher than the €3.49 per year here. Let's say it averages out as €10. That's €250 per year, which is what - One concert? One professionally produced track? Couple of mixed or mastered tracks? Couple of tracks on a remote session? Sounds like a pretty viable business model to me. I easily pay (far past) that for instrument upkeep over the course of a year. Guess what? Tax deductible!
I don't want to buy the new 'hip' tool that just came out because the dev needs to sell something new to earn a living. I want to use my regular and reliable tools which I use every day and I'd like them to receive as much love and attention as the new trendy thing. There should be a price model to reflect this. Currently it's simply a case of 'buy, forget, repeat, consume'. If you don't buy the new thing it's guilt trip time, because you don't need it but you'd actually quite like an update to your long used tool which is starting to show a few signs of age.
Otherwise we'll probably just hit a point (soon now that the tech is becoming ridiculously powerful) when the 'big names' steamroll in with desktop priced 'one size fits all' performance and production solutions and flatten all the individual creativity and sparks of genius that currently set iOS apart from the crowd, as a platform.
We've got to keep moving forward, so rather than these reactionary rejections of change, why don't we maintain an open dialogue as to exactly what direction and idealistic outcome we'd like the future to take?
Oscar
Well written and thought out comments Oscar. I think we all have some inherent resistance to repeated payments but if I look around then I find that many things I have to pay for have gone in that direction.
Clearly you are seeing this through the eyes of a professional musician, only fair as that is what you are. There are many of us here on the forum who make music as a passion, a hobby if you like, but I do think your argument still holds. If we want to be playing with the same instruments, or an enhanced version of them in the coming years then there needs to be some way to compensate further development.
I have heard the argument that a user should be able to buy an app once and use it forever, which you CAN do at least for the life of your current iOS device if you never upgrade it, but even moving an app to a newer version of the operating system will cost the developer in development and testing time.
Difficult to imagine any other product where the vendor trots up several months later and says 'Hey! here's some more stuff for that product you bought a while ago, free of charge'.
It's a mad system and it will probably have to change for its own good.
The main problem as I see it is that Apple don't provide app developers with a good upgrade mechanism. It should be possible for developers to say - this app is an upgrade. We will charge new purchasers X dollars, and people who already have it Y dollars. You can sort of do it with the bundle stuff, but it's clumsy and confusing. I have no problem with paying upgrade prices for IOS updates, Audiobus 3, AU, whatever. I do rather object to paying a subscription price for something that may see no significant work after I buy it.
Agreed and this sounds like Goose's attempt at working something like that. All you have to do is set a date in your Calendar for just before the renewal date. If you're using the app then fine, otherwise cancel the subscription. If you cancel the subscription you get to use that version and that years updates for as long as your iPad will support it.
It really isn't rocket surgery.
You do make several good, solid points mate. I wish I was as thoughtfully well-spoken as you.
Anyways, my problem is how much will people charge per month/year for their apps? If app devs started charging $9.99/month/app, that's about $300/month which I cannot afford (given I use about 30 apps on a regular basis). People like me who are still trying to find steady work doing what we love, still trying to break into the business, and/or who love producing music that won't bring in the big bucks (whether ambient or outdated stuff that won't come back into fashion for another good 5-10 years), will be left out in the cold. This is a "dangerous" trend and could discourage a lot of people from even wanting to try.
The other issue is with keeping tabs on when my charge card will be charged next. It's easy to keep track of a small handful of bills and timing all of them to come due on one day out of the month (which is what I've done). However, with subscriptions, one developer may make the recurring charge come due once a month, once every three months, once every six months, and once per year. If I'm not careful and plan all charges to come due on one day out of the month, I'll end up with many "surprise" charges I literally forgot about.
I still say the best solution is a hybrid pricing system where the subscription price is low and the one-time-fee is higher. People who want to use the subscription model can purchase the subscription model while people like me who don't want to have a panic over a ton of recurring charges can save up and pay the higher one-time fee. This could also work for taking an app for a test run. Pay a subscription and immediately cancel it in order to test drive an app, and if one likes the app, save up the cash and buy it outright.
For instance, one app I enjoy using here and there is Enlight photo editor. They released a new version dubbed Photofox and started charging a monthly fee of $9.99 for a subscription. They also have a one-time payment of $39.99, which is reasonable for desktop quality software in a mobile environment. If photography was my main profession, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase the one-time fee option.
Bottom line to this particular post - I wish Apple would offer a decent upgrade system for devs. Meantime, I'm willing to save up my money and pay a higher one-time price for the software I use. I mean, I paid $29.99-$39.99 per Fabfilter plugin (and Auria Pro), invested a ton of money into Gadget and the apps associated with Gadget, so why wouldn't I be willing to pay that much for an EQ AU?
Then I say we compensate them. For their talent and their willingness.
However, to assume that people should pay around 40€ yearly for an 3.49€ app is slightly absurd being that having the option to rescind the subscription doesn't change the fact that not everyone is going to claim tax-exemption.
I wager we pay upfront and/or pay for upgrades.
Not everyone is going to be willing to pay 40€ and/or more times the number of apps on subscription when the numbers add up yearly.
To ask an subscription for the upkeep of a single application (numberous shoes stepped on here), an single EQ app in this case is brow raising in my opinion.
That's why I said to offer both payment options in an app. That way, everybody wins.
I'd actually rather pay 10-15$ on an app that I might use a few times than pay 4$ a year for something I use every day. I'm just wired that way. The moment there is a sub I bail. Its mainly why I moved to PC gaming from consoles. And stopped using office and switched to open office. I ain't paying subs when I don't need to. In my opinion the best option would be to do both. Keep subs for those willing to pay them. And keep a one time payment. Even if it's 10-15$ you might actually get sales from people like me that hate subs.
@jwmmakerofmusic sorry if that post was an inadvertent dig on your last post. Was editing my post longer than I wanted to.
@lucas @OscarSouth if this seems like an irrational attack I apologize as well, nothing personal. But I also believe I'll have to retain my stance on the matter as well.
Thanks for apologising mate, but not really necessary.
I just didn't know if you understood my "bottom line summary" clear enough in that everybody wins when both payment options are offered and that Apple's app update system as it currently exists sucks for devs.
@jwmmakerofmusic that bottom line sounds a bit more logical.
Indeed, that was the bottom line I was going for in the long post you initially responded to.
So, OT, how's your day going so far?
I don't get subscription apps.
A good start of the day eating breakfast and drinking some Joe. Tending to an broken foot from an recent sports injury. But I've got the Audiobus forum, so I can't complain
How's your morning going? (If it's morning where you are)
Like this
@mschenkel.it
Envious!