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BM3: bank vs pad

what's the advantage of using a bank (with a maximum of 8) for an instrument against using a pad within a bank? the manual says that you usually will choose a whole bank to represent/contain one instrument.

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Comments

  • Easier track mixing on the mixer?

  • @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

  • @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Yes for Banks but also you can add audio tracks and fx channels.

  • @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

  • @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

  • @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    got it thanx!

  • @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

    It's actually literally that simple. Not sure a video would be needed. I might make a post with pictures though.

  • @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @fattigman said:

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

    It's actually literally that simple. Not sure a video would be needed. I might make a post with pictures though.

    Ok thanks for the tips.

  • @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

    It's actually literally that simple. Not sure a video would be needed. I might make a post with pictures though.

    I did as you said and created an audio track for each instrument in the same bank. It works great, so that's a simple "workaround" for the 8 tracks limitation. And when the patterns are converted to audio they are no longer tied together. It's a bit of extra work but I can live with that (for now). Thanks.

  • @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

    It's actually literally that simple. Not sure a video would be needed. I might make a post with pictures though.

    I did as you said and created an audio track for each instrument in the same bank. It works great, so that's a simple "workaround" for the 8 tracks limitation. And when the patterns are converted to audio they are no longer tied together. It's a bit of extra work but I can live with that (for now). Thanks.

    Banks are not to be confused with tracks... 1 bank is 128 tracks :#

  • @LucidMusicInc said:

    @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

    It's actually literally that simple. Not sure a video would be needed. I might make a post with pictures though.

    I did as you said and created an audio track for each instrument in the same bank. It works great, so that's a simple "workaround" for the 8 tracks limitation. And when the patterns are converted to audio they are no longer tied together. It's a bit of extra work but I can live with that (for now). Thanks.

    Banks are not to be confused with tracks... 1 bank is 128 tracks :#

    True. My fault :blush:

  • As I expressed my disappointment in the " need BM3 thread " , although each pad can have its own midi part , ALL those parts are nested in the single midipattern per Bank exposed in Sequencer view making individual triggering impossible in Scenes view & editing/arrangement a pita in Song view ; so from a midi sequencing point of view I think Bank is preferable to Pad , & BM3 is an only 8 part midi sequencer at the moment .
    I hope @mathieugarcia can add each Pad's midi part to the Sequencer individually , or add more Banks in the future .

    **
    also , btw , I've just reported a possible bug in Bug Thread ( unless user error ) whereby Pads are not correctly channelising incoming midi , so another reason for the moment why I'll be using my Banks individually .

  • Is it possible to mute a pad so it stops sending midi? That way you could build a pad with all the maximal tracks running, then duplicate it across timeline/scenes/whatever. Then for each one you'd mute the tracks you didn't want.

  • edited July 2017

    @5pinlink said:

    @LucidMusicInc said:

    @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @fattigman said:

    @gonekrazy3000 said:

    @dermichl said:

    @mireko_2 said:
    Easier track mixing on the mixer?

    i see, so it's an 8 track mixer for banks a to h?!

    Actually. You can add audio tracks and set source for then to each individual pad. So each bank can do 128 outs. Just mute the bank and set monitor on for each audio track to have 128 individual volume controls.

    Someone should do a video tutorial showing this.

    It's actually literally that simple. Not sure a video would be needed. I might make a post with pictures though.

    I did as you said and created an audio track for each instrument in the same bank. It works great, so that's a simple "workaround" for the 8 tracks limitation. And when the patterns are converted to audio they are no longer tied together. It's a bit of extra work but I can live with that (for now). Thanks.

    Banks are not to be confused with tracks... 1 bank is 128 tracks :#

    Not really, a bank is 128 pads with their associated patterns, while they feel 'trackish' they are all linked in time, so you cant move them around separately, for layering stuff up that's great, for arranging, not so much.

    That's not a track either. Your talking about a clip. A track is just that, a track, like a railroad track. It's a lane that can either hold one note or a group of notes or a loop or whatever. A clip can be an audio clip or a midi clip that can be moved in the song arranger. And a pattern is a sequence. With the banks you have 128 tracks and likely unlimited sequences/patterns and those sequences can have unlimited lengths.

  • edited July 2017

    @cian said:
    Is it possible to mute a pad so it stops sending midi? That way you could build a pad with all the maximal tracks running, then duplicate it across timeline/scenes/whatever. Then for each one you'd mute the tracks you didn't want.

    Export everything in your bank and then drag and drop arrange it in the song sequencer.

    Another way to do it is to make several copies of the same pattern and put those in the scenes. Unfortunately muting does not automate but you can automate the volume with the trigger pad or mixer fader per pattern. The key is having a different pattern for each scene.

  • @LucidMusicInc No , Pattern length seems to be set " Globally" for the Bank, & individual Pad Midi " Parts " as I'm calling them are the same length , unless you can show how to do differently .

  • edited July 2017

    @Wally said:
    @LucidMusicInc No , Pattern length seems to be set " Globally" for the Bank, & individual Pad Midi " Parts " as I'm calling them are the same length , unless you can show how to do differently .

    The patterns are independent of each other in terms of length, and they can be as long as 1-100+ bars. You could do an entire song with one bank and one pattern if you wanted.

    Just create a new pattern and set the length. If the other pattern lengths change it's a small bug and you can set them to your preferred length.

  • edited July 2017

    @LucidMusicInc I thought you were referring to each Pad's midi Part being independent length , which they arent . Sorry if that wasnt what you meant :

    "With the banks you have 128 tracks and likely unlimited sequences/patterns and those sequences can have unlimited lengths."

  • Forget about the scenes. Make some patterns and arrange them on the song sequencer. Then adjust the length of the patterns. It's just like Cubasis.

  • edited July 2017

    @5pinlink said:
    It's nothing like Cubasis, if you just arrange patterns, you have 8 overlaid maximum.

    Pads are tracks. Banks are groupings of tracks. You can have unlimited pattern per bank. Patterns contain any combination of events happening in the tracks be they loops, midi melodies or one shots. Therefore you only need one bank to make a song. The other 7 are there for the sake of convenience.

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • Is it possible to just copy a pattern to another pattern or into another bank? I just can't figure out how because it's only duplicates..

  • I and many others would be eternally grateful if someone would be willing do a video explaining all of this...

  • @hadje22 said:
    I and many others would be eternally grateful if someone would be willing do a video explaining all of this...

    True !

  • edited July 2017

    This thread is actually a great vessel for understanding the music making paradigm that we're dealing with here.

    Everyone in tech is talking about storytelling these days. Maybe they're barking up the wrong tree. They need to get on board with getting the message about their fancy business ideas across in the form of a good old fashioned argument .. and good luck to anyone who disagrees!

  • @marcuspresident said:
    Is it possible to just copy a pattern to another pattern or into another bank? I just can't figure out how because it's only duplicates..

    this is needed.

  • @marcuspresident said:
    Is it possible to just copy a pattern to another pattern or into another bank? I just can't figure out how because it's only duplicates..

    You can drag a pattern out of one bank's pattern list and place it on another bank's timeline. That will create a copied pattern in the second bank's pattern list.

  • @5pinlink said:

    @tja said:
    Very interesting to read.
    While I just don't understand BM3 at all, two people who sure do understand it, disagree about what means what and can be used in which ways.
    That says a lot.

    I would like to see the result of your discussion!

    The result of the conversation is this
    Lucid is stating things as he/she sees them, like so...
    A pad bank contains lanes of control for each pad, indeed each lane can have a full piano roll, now if you wish to completely ignore the pattern paradigm, you could create one song length scene, and then create your entire composition within that single length scene, this would give you 128 lanes in one bank, in which to compose.

    However, we live in the modern world and if somebody creates a 1 bar drum sequence for instance, they do not wish to select all events, then copy and paste them 159 times to get a repeated 160 bar drum sequence within one single item, we are much more used to creating an item that contains that 1 bar sequence and then moving/copying/pasting that item as we wish within an arrangement.

    BM3 is very much completely based upon the pattern paradigm, so it can only have a maximum of *8 patterns playing at the same time over the top of each other (Not withstanding the fact that these patterns do have 128 lanes of sequence events as discussed above)

    So in terms of mixing, BM3 has the ability to mix 1024 individual channels of audio just from patterns alone, however in terms of arranging, the arranger can only have *8 patterns playing at any one give time.
    It seems that this is backwards for the very paradigm that BM3 exists in, it wasn't designed as some powerhouse mix engine, but as a powerhouse groove/sequence engine, but by its very nature right now it is able to mix a whole lot more than it can arrange.

    So what Lucid said may be right in his/hers mind, but is in fact completely incorrect even looking at Intuas own explanation of THEIR OWN app.

    BM3 specs
    8 Tracks for pad banks
    Unlimited audio tracks
    8 Aux tracks

    This can not be argued or discussed, it is the specs of the app as supplied by Intua, however, what Lucid is considering tracks (And as discussed above, is understandable) is actually 1024 channels of audio to the mixer from the pad banks ;)

    *I added this star on the 8 patterns, because as has been shown elsewhere, you can create individual patterns for each and every of the 128 lanes in a single pad bank, however, they still don't have their own tracks (8 is still the maximum allowed pad bank tracks in the arranger) but you can overlay 128 individual patterns from each pad bank over each other on a single track in the arranger (Yes i know, ridiculous, but it does actually work)

    Good points. There's a discussion starting on the Intua forum about this.

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • @tja said:
    BTW, the quoting in this forum is just OFF.
    It just quotes too much and needs manual trimming :-((((

    oh yeah, and get people complaining bitterly that their comments are "censored". Maybe not such a good idea.

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