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Comments
really?.. why does it come across as the 'chicks' still being the ojects, isn't it the overtness that equates to the objectifying in your definition, somehow this ''male' objectifying maintains the mans dignity, what fun is that?
anyways I prefer this, agree they are so talented.
Now, for sure. Lydon also loves Kate Bush. So while I do believe that the anger he and Matlock articulated at the height of their fame was genuine, times and perspectives change. Also, as with every group, a lot of what we see is an act. Alice Cooper being the classic example. It's all showbiz.
I'd prefer to switch that around a little to there has always been shite pop music.
But there has also always been fabulous creativity, and brilliant songs. Never more so than in the 70's, where so many diverse types of music hit a peak simultaneously. Sure, there was still dross keeping the great stuff off number one, but at least great songs were being made. Whereas now, the only great songs are being made by people the industry won't sign and the radio won't play... much.
There's still good music around, but subcultures are more diffused, and mass media has a lot less influence to shape opinion.
Here's a very mainstream track from this year, and IMO it's pretty damn good:
Except, the man in question was a brawling, violent, inarticulate thug. So is the video actually promoting such people as being attractive to women?
you really misunderstood him - your own Dream Theater example is exactly how he describes the industry's method: forced listening and appreciation by a 'familiar feeling'.
In the end it doesn't matter if you force yourself or you are forced because you cannot escape a track that's played literally everywhere.
Imho the video is spot on and very comprehensive.
Most of this discussion here is NOT about it's content/conclusion, tho.
Which is ok, because there's not much to discuss about simple facts.
I didn't know about the dominance of just 2 major writers for most Top40 stuff and that whoo-whoo interval scheme.
But the idea of 'they took this from here and that from there' pops up time and again whenever some of that music reaches my ears. As stated above: impossible to escape.
I agree with those who mentioned it wasn't much different a few decades ago.
Most of the charts were mostly crap as long as I remember - it's always been cherry-picking and some classics simply remain regardless of genre.
I agree. It was a lot easier to find good music back before clear channel type stations took over in the late 80s. You didn't have to look as top notch music actually got played on the radio back then. And hosts like John Peel made it easy to keep up with whoever was on the cutting edge. The 'you just have to look for it' mantra doesn't wash with me. Having a broad selection of gatekeepers - labels- made it easy to find your own niche and when I got tired of pop/rock I just tuned in to student radio. So basically during my teens I had easy access to a wide variety of great artists at the flick of a dial and could put it on a cassette and listen to it anytime and pick up the records when I had the money. No crate digging through soundcloud or youtube to find the 'good stuff'. I lived in a big city, so those in rural areas may have had very different experiences.
not just rural areas - all Germany was a musical desert in the 70s... LOL
I waited on John Peel with the finger on the reel-to-reel trigger each and every weekend.
Local stations (all together) had a maximum of 2-4 hours per week regarding what was called rock or progressive back then.
Got most of my inspiration from (more wealthy) friends who sunk a small fortune into vinyl records collected from whereever places.
The current situation with all those Bandcamp, CD-Baby, YT and even Soundcloud is absolutely great in comparison.
I'd have no problem to discover great stuff there, but simply lack the time for listening.
Even on a way smaller scale there are phantastic releases in the song-of-the-month thread here in this board.
A feature unthinkable in those glorious days back then.
Kraftwerk got a record deal, while I sat at home with the very same DIY electronic stick drums at my tape recorder unnoticed... what a drag
Punk was a reaction to the tepid state of the mainstream at the time. Indie was again a reaction to the new mainstream a few years later. Grunge was similarly a kick back against hair metal etc... The mainstream is almost always turgid.
So to counterpoint some of the issues in the video (and BTW Sgt Pepper is hugely overrated, it only has one good song on it: A Day In The Life. I'm sorry but the Best Album Ever Made cannot contain tracks such as Lovely Rita, When I'm Sixty-Four, and Good Morning! Does anyone actually listen to this crap?), there are some decent mainstream artists around, despite all the dross.
Lana Del Rey is a far more interesting mainstream diva than Madonna ever was. You'd have to go back to Debbie Harry to find someone as cool, and she's not some manufactured puppet, she writes her own music which is often pretty subversive.
Lyrically (a point mentioned in the video) Father John Misty is pretty damn awesome. For example the opening line of Total Entertainment Forever:
"Bedding Taylor Swift
Every night inside the Oculus Rift
After mister and the missus finish dinner and the dishes"
That's as good as Morrissey IMO. And that first rhyme is genius. The lyrics to Ballad of The Dying Man are equally great.
So while there is a lot of crap around, that is kinda normal. When Nevermind came out it was at the same time as Vanilla Ice, MC Hammer, Michael Bolton and Garth Brooks were dominating the charts.
Sorry to hear that. I discovered a lot of great 'Krautrock', as they called it, through being introduced to stuff like Can and Amon Düül II by an older guy working in a record shop in the '80s and then bought it up used on vinyl. So I'm guessing that stuff didn't get much radio play?
Bit strong Richard, I think you'll find only a minority of listeners would agree with you that 'Lucy in the sky with diamonds' for example, was a crap record.
Overrated? Matter of opinion, but in context at the time it was ground-breaking work, and influenced generations of musicians.
Everyone's entitled to an opinion, but dismissing it as 'crap' is just inaccurate.
To be fair I'm just saying those 3 songs, Lovely Rita, When I'm Sixty-Four, and Good Morning, are crap. I stand by that statement
Lucy In the Sky is OK, but IMO only A Day In The Life really qualifies as a great song - it's the only one I come back to again and again.
Of course these things are subjective, and taste/toast come into it. But I think Sgt Pepper has been mythologised way beyond it's actual musical worth. And I love The Beatles (Abbey Road is a better album IMO, although it too has a couple of turkeys such as Maxwell's Silver Hammer).
no kidding Monzo - in those days I classified all FabFour stuff as 'crap' and it did turn me off indeed.
I still agree with Richard on the 'overestimated as there are tons of records from those days that weren't less sophisticated - just got no airplay and went unnoticed by a larger audience - so it's a verification of the initial video's statement
ps: to be fair (today) I admit the Beatles did some great songwriting and those records were cut really well, but that's craftmenship in the first place.
in fact - no airplay except 1 single event weekly (iirc)
Can got some fame for their TV music contributions, Spoon and Vitamin-C were their only major hits. Worth listening today for their outstanding mix quality...
Production wise, it was revolutionary. Could it be that you just don't get it? Two of the tracks you detest are very British culture. For sure, the single that teased the album, Strawberry Field's Forever, was magnificent.
Clever words, but it reminds me that Taylor Swift exists, and that risks giving me a migraine.
To me, Morrissey was a self-obsessed depressing git who couldn't sing in tune. Never did get why anyone thought he was any good. Johnny Marr, yes.
Strawberry Fields is fantastic. But it's not on Sgt Pepper
Ah yes, JP is still missed. Didn't like everything he played, but then that wasn't required. I certainly discovered some great music listening to his show, and loved his tireless championing of the underdog. And Undertones.
A bit like Morrissey then...
(sorry, couldn't resist...)
BTW I think Sgt Pepper was massively significant culturally, it obviously blew people's minds at the time, and hugely influenced what came next (early Floyd, Hendrix etc). But musically I don't think it has really aged well.
So not 'crap' then.
'Ok', 'crap', and 'only one good song' are
Used to be a brilliant radio show in the 90's on R3 once a week called Mixing It, with journalist Robert Sandall and musician Mark Russell. Really good selection of diverse music, I discovered masses of new artists that way.
@MonzoPro Do you listen to Late Junction Monzo? Similarly ecclectic. Also Stuart Maconie's Freak Zone plays a lot of music that you'd like (Radio 6).
And the Wire has a show on ResonanceFM, and I think a couple of their journalists do as well.
The limited 4 track mix down is what ages it I think. However, I feel the Mobile Fidelity version does it justice. I haven't heard the new mix yet. Productions do tend to age music for better or for worse. That's what makes today's pop even more susceptible to aging ... and fast ... as production is at the core of today's pop much more than in the past.
A Day in the Life never gets old for me.
John Peel (and his TopGear show) even got an hommage by Softmachine playing live there.
They re-texted Moon in June to be about that gig and the theme is quite related to this topic. Tbh it's the most stunning lyric thing I ever heard - the original track is an all-time favorite of mine and a timeless piece of music anyway.
ps: imho the 'crap' attribute to Sergeant Pepper is only applied in relation to the overwhelming praising of the record as so outstanding.
In some people's opinion it just isn't - the ranking is valid mainly in Top40 context.
I was the same way too, as I think were probably most people on this super niche forum. Our relationship with music is very different than most. The majority of pop culture sales/success tend to be the passive towing of the line, taking what you are given variety, which is what I was refering to. I think 'pop' success now is far less regional and more international. Hence the simple flat lyrics and err... uh oh, getting into dangerous non politicaly correct territory now, hehe.
Yes, it is exactly that. Same thing with publishing. Instead of being led by A&R men/ editors with the knack of spotting a good thing, or a coming trend, both industries are now run by accountants. Or as a best-selling author once told me - 'farts and hooligans in pin-stripe suits.'
These guys have zero imagination, and are not interested in developing talent. They just want to shift units, and the only way they know to do that, is to offer more like what has already sold loads. This results in dozens of sound-alike/ uncomfortably similar books until the market is sick to the back teeth of what's on offer. Then it's a scramble to find something else and, horror of horrors for them, take a creative leap.
For sure Morrissey reflected British culture at the time, but that doesn't necessarily mean he was any good. These were the days of Margaret Thatcher.
I didn't say it was, I said it was the taster single for the album.
I've listened to Stuart a few times, haven't heard Late Junction though - I'll check that out thanks.
I must remember to check the Wire show too. I buy the mag, and usually search YouTube for tracks by the bands reviewed.