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Envelope filter amout; help me understand
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Ok i got the hang of filter cutoff and grasp the filter envlope. However when increasing the envlope amount, why does the sound get significantly brigher.
Its as though im raising the frequency cutoff via ENV AMT.
School me please.
Comments
Huh? Thx for replying will experiment.....anyone else?
Scrubbed my reply.
Yeah, if you have the cutoff at zero this will help with understanding increasing the env amount effect.
Think of the envelope like a hill. The higher up the hill you go, the higher the cutoff frequency is. Increasing the envelope amount is like making the hill steeper and higher.
At low settings, the hill is pretty flat. The frequency just climbs a little then goes back to the starting point. At high settings the hill is really steep. Not only does the frequency go higher, but it's a more dramatic sweep up and back down.
When you hit a key, the filter envelope raises (or lowers) the cutoff using a combination of the filter envelope amount control and the Attack Decay Sustain Release controls that are the same as on a normal amp envelope.
The first important control is the filter envelope amount, which controls how much the cutoff will go up by (or go down by, if the envelope amount is set to a negative value). So if your cutoff is set at 50 and the filter envelope is set to +50, then when you press a note the filter envelope will make the cutoff go from 50 to 100. How quickly it does this, though, and whether or not (and how quickly) the cutoff goes back to 50 is governed by the ADSR controls of the filter envelope.
So if you have a long attack value on the ADSR controls of the filter envelope in the above example, the cutoff will take a while to get from 50 to 100. If you have a long decay, then it will take a while to get back down to 50. If you have zero sustain, then the cutoff will go all the way back down to 50 after the decay stage. If you have sustain set to maximum, though, then it won’t go back down from 100 at all, similar to how max sustain on an amp envelope keeps a sound’s volume at its maximum level.
Conversely, low attack and decay values would snap the cutoff to 100 and back down to 50 very quickly, which can create interesting transient effects. Also, think about how having a high resonance would affect your sound if the cutoff is sweeping between values quickly or slowly. The filter envelope is another tool in your sound sculpting arsenal.
But imporant thing - there are 2 APPS where filter envelope is implemented completely wrong
i reported both issues, they are there from very first version of both apps - Intua never didn't responded to my report and Caustic developer said something like "ok, i know, but will not fix it becuase it will atlter existing people patches"
:-) So beware of those 2 apps, filter envelope there works wrong way !
Just one thing to add, if you use a negative Filter Env Amount it effectively flips the Filter envelope upside down, so instead of the env amount increasing the cutoff it will decrease it.
While experimenting with Attack and Decay in the Env settings, turn sustain and release all the way down...you will hear better then what the Attack and Decay are doing.
Someone posted a query about Groovebox Env amount being labelled in semitones, which seemed strange until explained.....it is controlling a frequency amount relative to the start point, so semitones made sense when trying to set frequencies a fifth apart etc.....
It's what makes a filtered sound go 'bow', 'wow' or 'ooww' depending on the EG settings
Awesome responses, thx yall!!!
Think of the envelope as an automation curve for the filter cutoff when you hit the key, and the amount as a multiplier of that value
So, Mr @brambos..not only do you make apps that make great sounds, you make posts that make great sounds too....
Sound designing like a bos.
I see what you did there
One more thing while i got ur attention....regarding korg gadget berlin.....So the envelope generator 1 is actually a filter envelope of which the amount can be applied to the low freq cutoff via 'eg1' and the oscillator via 'mod'. About correct?
-thx
It's just an envelope, it's a filter envelope when it controls the cutoff frequency of the filter via the EG1 'amount' of the 'VCF' (
) on the 2nd panel.
On the 'VCO' (
) it can be used to control a cross modulation effect. Berlin is simplified, on most synths you use a 2nd oscillator and set it to sync the 1st. This causes a shifting of the waveform start point, which, because of maths, produces overtones/harmonics. This effectively changes the waveform of the 1st osc. If you keep changing the 2nd osc., this can sound similar to a shifting filter cutoff but is different in that the low pass filter removes sound above the cutoff frequency, but sync adds harmonics to the oscillator (which are then passed through the filter). Berlin's trick is to hide the 2nd oscillator and just focus on getting those lovely shifting harmonics by dynamically modulating the sync, either by the lfo or EG1.
God, after typing all that I hope I've got it right
I bet @Cib could explain it better. Cross modulation can mean different things, I think Berlin is using it for 'hard sync'
https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/articles/115001030803-Synth-gadgets#01
Very nearly, that's what it can sound like, but there is a nitpicky difference. It's just an envelope, it's a filter envelope when it's controlling the cutoff frequency of the 'VCF' (
) via the EG1 amount on the 2nd panel of Berlin.
On the 'VCO' (
), Berlin includes a cross modulation effect, known as sync. Sync is modulated by MOD.
https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/articles/115001030803-Synth-gadgets#01
Berlin is simplified, on most synths you use a 2nd oscillator to sync the 1st. This changes the waveform of the 1st oscillator by restarting it. Because of maths, this produces overtones/harmonics, in the same way that a sawtooth sounds fuller than a triangular wave. It's expanding the palette of the oscillator waveform by changing the frequency of the sync oscillator.
If you keep changing the 2nd osc., this can sound like a shifting filter cutoff, but it is different, because a low pass filter removes sound above the cutoff frequency, while sync adds harmonics to the oscillator (which are then passed through the filter). Berlin concentrates on creating those lovely sweeping harmonics, by hiding the 2nd osc. and modulating the sync effect, either by the LFO or EG1; it might be more obvious if you start with LFO on slow and filter open. Try MOD off and move the TONE control up and down, then turn up MOD on a slow triangle LFO; that is what MOD is doing, turning TONE up and down, which behind the scenes is changing the frequency of oscillator 2, which is retriggering oscillator 1.
God, I hope after typing all this (twice) that I've got it right
. @Cib could probably explain it better. Cross modulation can mean different things, I think Berlin uses 'hard sync', it isn't specified in the manual.