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FIRST IOS SYMPHONY EVER!/ THE BATTLE OF BEATHAWK
I actually believe that I am the first musician to create a full four movement symphony on the iPad. I googled a bunch and could not find any. Please correct me if you know of one! I call it a Synthony as it does not completely conform to the rules of symphonic creation. Mine starts with a slow movement... Not the way it is done. But it is orchestral, has themes and echoes. Synthony No.1 in Gminor/ the BEATHAWK
Synthony!
I call it that because I used UVI instruments extensively, Beathawk acoustical instruments and the Ravenscroft 275 piano. All top notch sounds. In addition, iSymphonic strings and woodwinds, Thumbjam flutes, iFretless brass and basses, Sopranotron and Cubasis microsonic instruments. Recorded in seven eight hour sessions over ten days with AB3 and Cubasis. The music was not composed in a traditional manner but improvised on the spot ( or spots, more accurately).
However, Beathawk was a bitch to use and regularly destroyed my workflow, froze Cubasis solid and threatened to disappear entire irreplaceable and unreproducable improvised movements. But Cubasis and the iOS gods were with me. I worked around the technical difficulties of Beathawk by doing regular stereo mixdowns and adding one track at a time,
As to FX, not a lot. Waves Ultramaximizer presets and Q10 EQ, Cubasis channel strip for hi and low pass filters, Cubasis reverb and chorus. Special mention to Caitlin Downie's beautiful soprano voice of the Sopranotron. Though a fragile sound, when built up with chorus and reverb became a beautiful fourth movement element. iFretless synth brass was memorable for me as the lead voice in the second.
The length is 24 minutes. Please find a peaceful time to listen. And please
( I am begging you!) listen to the entire piece. If you can do that please comment, good or bad. Perhaps there will be a second Synthony, and I don't want to make the same mistakes twice! Thanks so much!
Comments
I’m stunned, first that you’ve written it (grats on the theory skills) but that’s you’ve also squeezed it out of an iPad.
As a huge fan of classical I loved it!
Have not had a chance to hear the whole thing, but I like the first few minutes a lot.
Great!
Beautiful and well done!
WOW! Awesome!! I'm glad Cubasis was used to produce this
What an achievement!! Nice work 🎼🎶🎵
A wonderful piece of music dear @LinearLineman !
Unbelievable that everything is realized on a iPad! 👍
Your music now also shows the IOS sceptics what is musically possible on an iPad. And I don't think that's the end of the line. Imagine you had the full iSymphonic orchestra at your fingertipps.
The four parts of your symphony go well together. I particularly like Part 2, the brasses (ifrettles brass?) are really good. The piano lines in Part 3 behind the strings are also great. In Part4 (I already knew the topic from one of your previous posts) I really like the new version. I especially like the soprano solo part, it’s amazingly beautiful. I'll buy Sopranotron today! 👍
All in all a very inspiring piece of music which was masterfully realized on an iPad. Wonderful, congratulations, great work! 😊
P.S. Which iPad you was using, an Air2?
@EDB, thank you so much. Glad a classical music fan digs this!
Thanks, @Multicellular, please listen to the rest😇.
@AlleycatLA, thanks for the kind words. First time I saw you on the forum. Welcome!
@MobileMusic, coming from you those words are so appreciated. Question, you are a big advocate of Cubasis and seem to know what's going on with their development team. I know you are a software designer. Do you have a direct relation with Cubasis?
@gusgranite, thank you, that is high praise indeed! Your musical notes remind me that I need to see what Symphony Pro notation app does with my midii tracks. I don't know whether to be proud that this piece was improvised, not composed and that I couldn't score it if my life depended on it!
@Dawdles, yes, please listen. Glad to see you here.
@chandroji, it was kind of you to accept my personal invitation to listen, and for your generous words and detailed reactions. I used iFretless synth brass in the second movement. Don't remember which but it sounds the most real to me of the several horns on iFretless. Ironic that it is a synth patch,
The third movement was a surprise. Only thought to have three movements, but could not order the three I had and make them work cohesively. The third was the glue I needed to connect the second and fourth movements.
Yes, the fourth movement was posted separately and then remixed. I especially tried to improve the Sopranotron track to make it less automaton like. Caitlin's soprano voice is great, but a single voice is difficult for realism as compared to a choir. Do get the app, just 7 bucks standalone outside of Melloton. However the voice is surprisingly weak or fragile sounding but very workable with FX to tweak to something very satisfying.
If I have made some contribution to the progress of iOS as a viable platform that is the most satisfying comment I could get!
Never having created on desktop I know no other platform than this and a hardware workstation, as a result there is no negative comparison from my experience with something more stable, with better instruments. I can only approach the limits that apps like Cubasis have. Their capacities will always exceed my abilities so for me I am 100% satisfied with the iOS experience. Would like a bit more integration between apps like Beathawk and Cubasis so that there are less technical difficulties but I am sure that will come. It is all still pretty new adaptation of the technology. I am sure that two years ago I could not have dealt with the tech issues. I began three months ago and compared to early days, as I understand it, things are much much better now. Thanks again for listening Chandroji. And yes, ISymphonic downloads are probably coming my way! It is a lot more stable and user friendly than Beathawk for usage of sounds, as has been discussed.
You might find this interesting.
https://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/youcompose/id690183662?mt=8
@BiancaNeve I checked this out. Quite an old app. Doug did a demo of it on YouTube. Have you done anything with it you might post?
It is pretty old but it’s seen regular updates most recently 6months ago. I’ve only played with it rather than creating anything I would want to share/impose on others.
@LinearLineman I was hoping the name of the Synthony was "The Battle of BeatHawk." Looking forward to listening!
Quite an achievement to get this done in a short time (despite the recording issues) and an excellent result. I’m sure you feel very proud of it.
I think Beethoven also took a vacation and left his sustain pedal at home but he didn't finish a symphony on that vacation. (I know you brought a sustain pedal... just the wrong polarity). Anyway, I can't imagine suddenly loosing the pedal and still being able to play anywhere near the top of your game let alone to improvise a 25 minute project.
I've said it before and I'll way it one more time: how do you make great music on demand... practice, practice, practice. You did and now you can.
Congratulations Mike.
Now... finish the Ballet I commissioned.
Commission might too strong (implies payment). I suggested you work on a ballet 'cause you're gettin' jiggy with it and I see dancers. 7 Dancers dancing...6 lords a leapin'... 5 Golden Rings.
Really love when the strings and horns come in. What’s interesting is that it has a very southwest feel to it...not western...but definitely some Spanish/Latin moodiness to it.
Very cinematic in feel...i can definitely hear this as an accompaniment to a play of some kind...
Beautiful work and congrats...thanks for expanding our minds.
Wow...this is beautiful work!
Very very Nice...incredible stunning work.
Congrats on a beautiful work! And Don’t worry about improvising and not notating. I know of a few who do that and quite well. One being this guy http://mattiaswestlund.net/ (creator of Sonatina Symphonic Orchestra)
@mjcouche, yes, sorry for the shameless marketing! Was not certain a classical work would draw a crowd. Had to put in the controversy! Please listen and comment!
Thank you very much @PhilW. Wouldn't have been possible without this forum!
@McDTracy, creator of the humor font, Thanks for your support. It means a lot to me.
@echoopera,Thanks for your kind words. You definitely are right, a Spanish feel in the first two movements, a Beethovanic pulse in the last and the third? Haven't a clue where that came from, but it joined the 2nd and 4th. That was my aim.
Thank you @thatguysmitty for taking the time to listen. Much appreciated!
@JenaMu6, thank you, keep posting your own good work!
@Jmcmillan, much appreciated, thank you. I have heard of SonatinaSymphonic. Will look into the website.
I just joined a classical music forum. Youch! A pretty scary place! Will post a thread about it. There's no place like home! Thank you @Michael.
Really nice composition and i like the piece really. I guess you make close to the best out of iOS in this genre.
In general if you compare it with non iOS classical themes it lacks more in the mixing part. Spacing instruments, dynamics, realistic non synthetic sounds.
So beware if you post that in a classical forum where people use large Kontakt libraries and stuff.....they also tell you the hard truth while iOS community here is mainly more euphoric and amazed about most things
Take these words not too serious but i got my salt in wounds as well in the big world. Nothing is more hard than the truth.
@Cib, thanks for your concern. It is much appreciated. As to the truth, what is it, really? Especially when it comes to opinions about music. I read a thread today about fanatical Mozart lovers ( hissss) and those who delight in insisting Clementi was better than Mozart! I mean! Is Kauldron better or Thor? Of course it Is! I know many sensitive people are hurt by the hard truth, and for many the hard truth is get your CPA degree!
But for me, at 70, what people say about my stuff is not something I take too seriously. Of course, I love when people like something I have made. But as you say, it is a very supportive and enthusiastic audience here in this paradise. I am grateful.
@mAxjUlien, thank you so much for the praise! And to want to listen twice, that makes my day! It took around fifty hours to complete. Seven sessions, mostly all nighters. All improvised. @kuhl showed me a video of someone playing choirs on a Yamaha Tyros. I listened and thought, hmmm I can do better than that! That was as much of a concept as I had! It is all improvised, mostly in one pass, but sometimes two or three improvised pieces of a whole.
Big respect for such an endouring 'improvisation'
What Cib refers to is probably the same that made it difficult for me to listen to the full track in one go.
An orchestra has a consistent ambience and also style of playing - which you know of course.
But as these sounds are from all over the place they cannot fulfill such expectations.
The best approach would probably be exporting the (dry) Cubase tracks and remix them in Auria with focus on ambience and dynamic.
You already gave an indication yourself: the 4th movement is the most balanced imh ears and that was kind of remixed according to your comments above.
But that doesn't devaluate the music in any way.
If you develope your workflow this way you can get pretty far. You may save some fx actions in Cubase and apply them in an Auria stage, not that much more effort - but Auria has a great mix engine. Pro-R is a very 'tunable' reverb and Pro-L will ease to get the impact right. You can apply it in sections and/or use automation.
Mattias Westlunds articles on his website details Orchestral panning and reverb techniques. It’s a lot to digest and definitely doable on iOS, but not without a lot of work! It helps add realism, that is, if you’re going for a realistic “ MIDI Orchestra” which is no small feat! On the PC, you could spend multiple thousands getting a realistic Orchestral library. But as Mattias points out in his articles, it’s a sampled orchestra trying to sound real...how much do you want to spend for that 2% more realism? I guess it depends on if you are working for Film and TV scores...me? I’m just a hobbiest so iPad is ok for me.
That‘s true but also that you could get some good libraries for the same or less than f.e. iSymphonic with IAP. But libraries also changed a lot in the last years. Things getting better.
Sure these things would work on iOS too if there would be a market.
Even as hobbyist myself i would like more of these tools for iOS.
But yeah, i learned that especially a good and right use of reverb can change a lot. There is not always a 200GB library needed
@Telefunky, thanks for the praise and the very sagacious advice. Appreciated as always. Now I am sorry that I didn't buy Auria Pro when it was on sale, though I think it is beyond me at the moment. Still, I understand what you are saying, my lack of perfectionism is a disadvantage with the subtle art of mixing.
I agree the fourth is the best mixed of the lot. I am okay with the first as it is not too complex instrumentally. The second and third movements gave me a lot of tech problems with Beathawk, and I do not even have all the midi tracks for a remix. I was just glad they weren't deleted! Well, it is a long and winding road. I'll just keep on truckin'.
BTW, you may hear from my friend @EDB. He is looking for some expert advice which I know you could provide and will help him enormously. Thanks again for listening to my stuff.
This is very nice symphony Mike, you’ve done a great job, congratulations
Your playing is as always very professional, but how you put things together still needs some work IMO.
Four movements are mixed very differently, and that could sounds like a medley to me. Mixing everything with the same approch could helps to give some homogeneity between movements.
Using proper spacialisation with panning and EQing is very important. This helps hear everything and gives that huge symphonic sound. Same thing with reverberation.
Also, I think in this musical genre dynamics are very important. You could try to use more variations here, from ppp to fff.
Something difficult with all symphonic sampled instrument is to use strings and horns with medium to fast legato articulations. They often sounds not realistic at all which can kills composer intention. Desktops plugins offers for example round robin variations which helps creating realistic sound behavior, on the whole they do better here. New iOS AudioLayer offers more features including that one, but there are no built-in banks so we need to do them by ourselves. But things again can be improved with better spacialisation, reverberation and dynamics, like a good make-up can helps hiding some faulty skin ;-)
I really think your musician sensibility, pianist skills, harmony knowledge could benefit a lot from a deep personal work/learning on mixing. That should be more refined and controlled, your music deserves it!!
I know you also search for such constructive criticism, so I hope this helps.
Absolutely, @janosax. I appreciate your comments. It is hard to believe I have only been at this four months. @telefunky has the same message. My impatience can get the better of me and my willingness to accept less than perfect results are a hindrance, but it also frees me to create in a rush and I love the rush! I don't expect anything significant to arise from my creative efforts, but they can always be better and certainly better mixed! Also, I am not a classical composer by any stretch of the imagination. It was a wonderful challenge. I am grateful I produced this much!
Thanks for your generous sharing of suggestions!
I don't get along with Auria's arrangement and external signal handling, but the mix engine is flawless. You'll have to IAP those Fabfilter Pro plugins, too, but no need to hurry - next sale will come...
Auria's advantage is the internal bus system (which Cubasis lacks) so you can treat instrument groups accordingly. Pro-R should give you enough options to compensate for (potential) room differences in your samples from variozs sources.
You may first treat (some) individual instruments to their desired room response by rendering the track 'in place', before you go on to the group ambience treatment.
It's about subtle modifications like 5-10% wet part, but this adds up a lot for the overall result.