Korg Gadget 2 !

MrSmileZ

@caspergomez said:
Yup. Agree. In BM3, I think I could open ODYSSEi and 1 or 2 others. Can’t recall at the moment. But, I’m not sure they’d do that from a business perspective unless they charge individually for in the box Gadgets that are not currently standalone.

With the current Collection for Mac/PC, you have to pay like $200 for the entire bundle right?

If they do covert all non-AU gadgets to make them work in other iOS daws, do you feel we should have to repay (for let’s say BILBAO) to use it in BM3 or Cubasis?

If you paid for all the gadgets on iOS you paid nearly the same or more than gadget costs on pc/Mac, why the hell would you pay more? Gadget on iPad/iPhone is over 400.00 usd in total.

I don’t know where I stand on it really, but I don’t think Korg would want to see users stray from iOS KG2 by AU-ifying all existing Gadgets since they’d want to keep us dependent on the KG2 ecosystem, on iOS specifically.

Korg Gadget is on pc, Mac, iPhone, iPad, and Nintendo switch...I don’t feel as though it’s a lose money ordeal? Why do they allow AU on OS X and windows?

Remember, MAC/PC is different. Korg entered “their world” so they had to accommodate Ableton and Logic users by offering the collection as a plugin bundle option. On iOS, Korg feels they’ve got the big ecosystem and so they call the shots.

Are you a Korg employee?

MrSmileZ

@Shabudua said:

@DMfan said:

@Peter321 said:
If KORG would just make all gadgets, including gadgetized versions of stand alone apps, available as AUv3 (like they are on MacOS) anyone looking for a linear DAW could then use one of the other options available on iOS = best of both worlds.

+1 and start with the standalones!

They’ll have to if they want to keep selling them in a post-IAA market.

Nailed it.

MrSmileZ

@caspergomez said:
Hope for the best. I started using Garage band on my Mac. Didn’t even consider it until someone told me it’s a stripped down version of Logic but very capable. And he was right. Probably going to grab Logic any day for the dirt cheap $200 price tag.

You should, Alchemy and sculpture alone are worth the price

MrSmileZ

@JohnnyGoodyear said:

@AtticusL said:

@caspergomez said:
Hope for the best. I started using Garage band on my Mac. Didn’t even consider it until someone told me it’s a stripped down version of Logic but very capable. And he was right. Probably going to grab Logic any day for the dirt cheap $200 price tag.

Do it man, best deal in music software history.

Any immediate why Logic as opposed to Abelton, Reason etc etc?

Reason 10 is a fun playground...mixing in Reason stinks! It lacks the proper toolset to do simple without extra steps. I stem out from Reason and mix in Logic Pro x the 10 times I use Reason a year. I have ableton, but I never use it...not my thing at all...I only bought it to work with my Force

maxwellhouser

@caspergomez

Ableton has a timeline as well as the clip launching fyi. Audio editing is not great however imho.

I personally love working in Ableton Live even though it’s not my main DAW. Logic is great too. Both great tools.

ExAsperis99

@caspergomez said:
I’ve sat down with an Ableton user. Couldn’t stand the look of it and just made me feel it was inferior in terms of quality even if it’s not the case. I cannot stand the concept of clips and simply need a traditional timeline... and even though some people do use Ableton’s traditional linear timeline by itself, the constant talk about this need for “clips” along with my negative impression of its cheesy look collectively put an irreversible bad taste in my mouth.

Logic is HQ, visually, and WAV editor is top notch, overall very robust production suite with great sounding stock sounds and once I add some specific plugins and import all my Gadget stems I’ll be back in business.

You are so preposterously categorical. Ableton has a fantastic timeline! Its great innovation is that it is a complete linear DAW — plus it invented this magical way of creatively sequencing with clips! Clips that you don’t have to use AT ALL.

As for it’s “cheesy” look — I think a lot of people would consider the skeuomorphism of Logic to be far cheesier, but to each his own.

caspergomez

Clearly, you didn’t read what I said. I admitted that some people do use Ableton linear timeline.

Ableton btw even cheesed on their meters. But if you enjoy working in that environment, then more power to you. Hey look, even deadmau5 uses it so to each his own.

ExAsperis99

@ExAsperis99 said:

@caspergomez said:
I’ve sat down with an Ableton user. Couldn’t stand the look of it and just made me feel it was inferior in terms of quality even if it’s not the case. I cannot stand the concept of clips and simply need a traditional timeline... and even though some people do use Ableton’s traditional linear timeline by itself, the constant talk about this need for “clips” along with my negative impression of its cheesy look collectively put an irreversible bad taste in my mouth.

Logic is HQ, visually, and WAV editor is top notch, overall very robust production suite with great sounding stock sounds and once I add some specific plugins and import all my Gadget stems I’ll be back in business.

You are so preposterously categorical. Ableton has a fantastic timeline! It’s great innovation is that it is a complete linear DAW — plus it invented this magical way of creatively sequencing with clips! Clips that you don’t have to use AT ALL.

As for it’s “cheesy” look — I think a lot of people would consider the of Logic to be far cheesier, but to each his own.

You blow a LOT of smoke, man.

@caspergomez said:
Clearly, you didn’t read what I said. I admitted that some people do use Ableton linear timeline.

Ableton btw even cheesed on their meters. But if you enjoy working in that environment, then more power to you. Hey look, even deadmau5 uses it so to each his own.

You simply don’t know what you’re talking about. As you have proved over and over in this thread.

BlueGreenSpiral

The thread is comedy gold 😂

maxwellhouser

@BlueGreenSpiral said:
The thread is comedy gold 😂

Should we bite at this DAW vs that DAW “quality”. That’s always fun. It’s kinda up there just waiting...

BlueGreenSpiral

I have spectator mode enabled for this thread @maxwellhouser

espiegel123

@MrSmileZ said:

@busker said:
1> @MrSmileZ said:

If Gadget also featured a linear style sequencing workflow, it would be my 2nd biggest wish

My wish would be the complete opposite: Ableton-style clip launching. Would be a perfect fit for the spirit of the app I think.

For a linear workflow with Gadget, Xequence 2 fits the bill nicely.

I don’t use xequence, and find it bizarre to use a different sequencer for a sequencing app. Not knocking it, just not doing it. If the gadgets become auv3s on iOS, I will just sequence them from beatmaker3...if not I may move that way and remove gadget shortly

Using a sequencer with not Gadget is not bizarre at all. To many people, Gadget is more virtual instrument rack than sequencer. While I get that the sequencer is fine for a lot of EDM, it is pretty limited for people whose compositions don't consist of neatly lined up phrases of 16 measures or less without overlapping notes.

I find the Gadget sequencer handy for quickly capturing motifs and themes and the occasional composition but mostly I use it for the instruments -- it is the only way to get multiple Odysseis and MonoPoly's at once. And a lot of the instruments are nice, too.

Rather than fight the sequencer, I just use a sequencer that I like better.

It's great that you like the sequencer. But it isn't weird at all that people like Gadget instruments but not its sequencer.

JohnnyGoodyear

@espiegel123 said:

@MrSmileZ said:

@busker said:
1> @MrSmileZ said:

If Gadget also featured a linear style sequencing workflow, it would be my 2nd biggest wish

My wish would be the complete opposite: Ableton-style clip launching. Would be a perfect fit for the spirit of the app I think.

For a linear workflow with Gadget, Xequence 2 fits the bill nicely.

I don’t use xequence, and find it bizarre to use a different sequencer for a sequencing app. Not knocking it, just not doing it. If the gadgets become auv3s on iOS, I will just sequence them from beatmaker3...if not I may move that way and remove gadget shortly

Using a sequencer with not Gadget is not bizarre at all. To many people, Gadget is more virtual instrument rack than sequencer. While I get that the sequencer is fine for a lot of EDM, it is pretty limited for people whose compositions don't consist of neatly lined up phrases of 16 measures or less without overlapping notes.

I find the Gadget sequencer handy for quickly capturing motifs and themes and the occasional composition but mostly I use it for the instruments -- it is the only way to get multiple Odysseis and MonoPoly's at once. And a lot of the instruments are nice, too.

Rather than fight the sequencer, I just use a sequencer that I like better.

It's great that you like the sequencer. But it isn't weird at all that people like Gadget instruments but not its sequencer.

Stop that immediately, altogether far too rationale, polite, decent and full of sense.

LucidMusicInc

Logic is hard to learn. If you got started on something like Ableton you will probably hate Logic for the first year. After that maybe you will adjust. I find Logic probably runs better than any other Daw on a MacOS and doesn't require any damn dongle, and yes it's cheaper than the rest too, so that's why I use it. I like the sounds. I can't understand the workflow and there isn't a damn manual. The online help doesn't help either.

Re Ableton, clips are useful for recording live sessions which can then be copied onto the timeline. DJs and stage performers also use clips in Ableton for great effect, which is why it's called LIVE.

Clam

"preposterously categorical."

I SOOOoooo want that on my headstone!

AtticusL

@JohnnyGoodyear said:

@AtticusL said:

@caspergomez said:
Hope for the best. I started using Garage band on my Mac. Didn’t even consider it until someone told me it’s a stripped down version of Logic but very capable. And he was right. Probably going to grab Logic any day for the dirt cheap $200 price tag.

Do it man, best deal in music software history.

Any immediate why Logic as opposed to Abelton, Reason etc etc?

I have them all, love them all. Logic is 200 dollars, Ableton 449 and Reason 400, hence “deal”.

caspergomez

It’s funny when people get all bent over a comment. Jesus. So I don’t like the feel of Ableton and think it’s inferior in many ways. Why does that equate to me not knowing what the hell I’m talking about lol. Society is becoming way too soft man. Definitely not the crowd I grew up around.

caspergomez

This has become the “every DAW is a winner” society

caspergomez

@AtticusL said:

@JohnnyGoodyear said:

@AtticusL said:

@caspergomez said:
Hope for the best. I started using Garage band on my Mac. Didn’t even consider it until someone told me it’s a stripped down version of Logic but very capable. And he was right. Probably going to grab Logic any day for the dirt cheap $200 price tag.

Do it man, best deal in music software history.

Any immediate why Logic as opposed to Abelton, Reason etc etc?

I have them all, love them all. Logic is 200 dollars, Ableton 449 and Reason 400, hence “deal”.

Logic is underpriced for what you get. Let’s face it. One FabFilter plug-in is $150+ alone.

The only reason that Logic is now $200 is because Apple could afford to practically give it away.

See, if you didn’t grow up in this biz in a pre-SW world, you’ve got no reference point or appreciation for how cheap shit is these days. FabFilter Pro-Q3 should be $1-3000. Logic should be like $500-1000

rs2000

@LucidMusicInc said:
Logic is hard to learn. If you got started on something like Ableton you will probably hate Logic for the first year. After that maybe you will adjust. I find Logic probably runs better than any other Daw on a MacOS and doesn't require any damn dongle, and yes it's cheaper than the rest too, so that's why I use it. I like the sounds. I can't understand the workflow and there isn't a damn manual. The online help doesn't help either.

Re Ableton, clips are useful for recording live sessions which can then be copied onto the timeline. DJs and stage performers also use clips in Ableton for great effect, which is why it's called LIVE.

Not anymore. Logic felt quite "un-logical" in its earlier versions but they've done a lot to make using it more intuitive (should I say GarageBand-alike? ) for people used to working with other DAWs.
And I can say that both Ableton Live and Logic Pro X run rock-solid on MacOS.
I like the pattern concept of Live a lot (and I'm one of the few weirdos who feel perfectly at home with the Gadget sequencer) but I prefer Logic for timeline work including MIDI editing, automation and time stretching.

@AtticusL said:

@JohnnyGoodyear said:

@AtticusL said:

@caspergomez said:
Hope for the best. I started using Garage band on my Mac. Didn’t even consider it until someone told me it’s a stripped down version of Logic but very capable. And he was right. Probably going to grab Logic any day for the dirt cheap $200 price tag.

Do it man, best deal in music software history.

Any immediate why Logic as opposed to Abelton, Reason etc etc?

I have them all, love them all. Logic is 200 dollars, Ableton 449 and Reason 400, hence “deal”.

Ableton Suite is 749 and that's the one Logic would be closer to compare with.
Indeed, all three are fantastic and quite different products that can complement each other well.

caspergomez

@rs2000 said:

@LucidMusicInc said:
Logic is hard to learn. If you got started on something like Ableton you will probably hate Logic for the first year. After that maybe you will adjust. I find Logic probably runs better than any other Daw on a MacOS and doesn't require any damn dongle, and yes it's cheaper than the rest too, so that's why I use it. I like the sounds. I can't understand the workflow and there isn't a damn manual. The online help doesn't help either.

Re Ableton, clips are useful for recording live sessions which can then be copied onto the timeline. DJs and stage performers also use clips in Ableton for great effect, which is why it's called LIVE.

Not anymore. Logic felt quite "un-logical" in its earlier versions but they've done a lot to make using it more intuitive (should I say GarageBand-alike? ) for people used to working with other DAWs.

That’s exactly right. You know because you probably used it back in the late 90’s.

And I can say that both Ableton Live and Logic Pro X run rock-solid on MacOS.
I like the pattern concept of Live a lot (and I'm one of the few weirdos who feel perfectly at home with the Gadget sequencer) but I prefer Logic for timeline work including MIDI editing, automation and time stretching.

I agree that Gadget is easy to create quick ideas, but once you enter arrangement phase, it’s not that it becomes difficult to understand, but it’s just a time-waster. Simple tasks that are done on a linear timeline take 2-5x as long. When you multiply that times all the actions you take during the phase it could be hours of wasted time. I used to program in Flash, so the vertical concept was already familiar to me.

@AtticusL said:

@JohnnyGoodyear said:

@AtticusL said:

@caspergomez said:
Hope for the best. I started using Garage band on my Mac. Didn’t even consider it until someone told me it’s a stripped down version of Logic but very capable. And he was right. Probably going to grab Logic any day for the dirt cheap $200 price tag.

Do it man, best deal in music software history.

Any immediate why Logic as opposed to Abelton, Reason etc etc?

I have them all, love them all. Logic is 200 dollars, Ableton 449 and Reason 400, hence “deal”.

Ableton Suite is 749 and that's the one Logic would be closer to compare with.
Indeed, all three are fantastic and quite different products that can complement each other well.

rs2000

@caspergomez said:
... You know because you probably used it back in the late 90’s.

Oh yes and I hated it! I only used it for a few environment tricks and ES2, EVP88 and EXS24

caspergomez

@rs2000 said:

@caspergomez said:
... You know because you probably used it back in the late 90’s.

Oh yes and I hated it! I only used it for a few environment tricks and ES2, EVP88 and EXS24

Haha, well at least ya used it. I couldn’t deviate from DP and used it up until 2005.

Samu

Neither Logic Pro X or Gadget 2 have anything that comes even remotely close to easy workflow of Ableton Simpler.
It' so simple but still plenty flexible for sample-mangling it would make a perfect AUv3 on iOS...

Sure I don't have the full Ableton Live but stick with the Lite version that comes free with many apps and for most of my cases the 8 audio and 8 midi-tracks are more than enough.

caspergomez

@Samu said:
Neither Logic Pro X or Gadget 2 have anything that comes even remotely close to easy workflow of Ableton Simpler.

Uh, Flex Time?

It' so simple but still plenty flexible for sample-mangling it would make a perfect AUv3 on iOS...

Sure I don't have the full Ableton Live but stick with the Lite version that comes free with many apps and for most of my cases the 8 audio and 8 midi-tracks are more than enough.

Samu

@caspergomez said:

@Samu said:
Neither Logic Pro X or Gadget 2 have anything that comes even remotely close to easy workflow of Ableton Simpler.

Uh, Flex Time?

Seriously, you can't use Logic's 'flex time' to play a sample as a polyphonic instrument or trigger slices using notes on the keyboard, add filters and pitch-envelopes etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

caspergomez

Ok. So it’s more comparable to BM3?

Surprised Apple hasn’t implemented same thing. Obviously they’re capable.

Samu

@caspergomez said:
Ok. So it’s more comparable to BM3?

Yeah, and desktop Cubase also has something they call 'Sampler Track' that is similar.
(Ie. just drag any audio to the sampler track and treat it as a playable instrument).

Surprised Apple hasn’t implemented same thing. Obviously they’re capable.

I think Apple relies on Alchemy and ESX24 for the sampling.
ESX24 is 'dated', can't do time-stretch and things like that.
Also it's tedious work to set up slices in both ESX24 and Alchemy.

BM3's Pad Sampler is the closest we have to Ableton Simpler but it's still a bit quirky.

caspergomez

Well I could see how those who rely on sampling would be sold on that feature alone. Sounds very deep.

silent1

@LucidMusicInc said:
Logic is hard to learn. If you got started on something like Ableton you will probably hate Logic for the first year. After that maybe you will adjust. I find Logic probably runs better than any other Daw on a MacOS and doesn't require any damn dongle, and yes it's cheaper than the rest too, so that's why I use it. I like the sounds. I can't understand the workflow and there isn't a damn manual. The online help doesn't help either.

Here are the manuals: https://support.apple.com/en_US/manuals/professionalsoftware