Listening to The Smiths tonight.. and feeling like I know NOTHING about making music

[Deleted User]

@Matt_Fletcher_2000 said:

@_mwallace said:

@telecharge said:
Keep practicing and make your music.

Yeah, I get it. I wasn’t saying I was trying to be like them. But listening made me realize how elementary my approach has been in comparison. I’ve only just started trying to make music in the last few years. So, definitely a lot more practice is needed. I have the tools, now I just need the skill. LOL

I definitely empathise. I also have all the tools, have a basic ability to put together a track, but...

It’s different when you’re writing songs in a band though - more heads to share the work.

For example last band I was in the guitarist had written the basic song, but I came up with a couple of bass lines that completely changed the dynamics and pace of the song. The keyboard player threw in some new chords, and later down the pub we thrashed through and tweaked the lyrics.

jwmmakerofmusic

@ecou said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:
I get the same feeling as the OP but in regards to lyric writing. Classic musicians like Jim Croce, David Bowie, Prince, Kurt Cobain, etc, and (for a more modern example) Sia all humble me as a wannabe lyricist. I can create melodies, chord progs, backing tracks just fine. However, lyrics often stump me. Last thing I want to do is fall into the trap of "kindergarten" lyrics as @ecou so succinctly put it, lol.

Succinctly 🤔🤔 I had to google that one 😂😂 Turns out its the exact same in French. I guess I’m a bit embarrassed now. 😳😳

No need to be mate. Most modern pop is cow dung/merde. Sia is an exception as most of her songs have layers to the lyrics. Many of Lady Gaga's tracks are exceptions too, although some of her metaphors are pretty transparent/on the nose. That's more of a nitpick though. Point is, I can recognise great lyrics from shite lyrics, but struggle to write my own great lyrics.

However, I read this one phrase yesterday that "you need fertilizer to grow a crop". In other words, I write lyrics like normal, and when I "farm" and tend to those lyrics, I can grow a decent crop of great words.

It may sound like I'm going off-topic, but this advice can equally apply to @_mwallace 's situation. Start with the fertilizer, and grow a complex crop of notes and beats and lyrics and the like.

Another way to look at it is you're creating a sonic painting. Most painters either begin with the sketch or with the underpainting (depending on the technique each artist has developed). This could be seen as laying down the initial outline of a track, or crafting an 8-bar loop to work off of, or however the individual begins their track. Then eventually a musician begins building up various passages with more complexity and detail much like an oil painter begins with bigger shapes and impressions on the canvas before pulling out the smaller brushes to pop in the details.

Don't ask me why I'm in an insightful mood at the moment. Perhaps it was that beer I enjoyed at lunch what did it.

ecou

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@ecou said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:
I get the same feeling as the OP but in regards to lyric writing. Classic musicians like Jim Croce, David Bowie, Prince, Kurt Cobain, etc, and (for a more modern example) Sia all humble me as a wannabe lyricist. I can create melodies, chord progs, backing tracks just fine. However, lyrics often stump me. Last thing I want to do is fall into the trap of "kindergarten" lyrics as @ecou so succinctly put it, lol.

Succinctly 🤔🤔 I had to google that one 😂😂 Turns out its the exact same in French. I guess I’m a bit embarrassed now. 😳😳

No need to be mate. Most modern pop is cow dung/merde. Sia is an exception as most of her songs have layers to the lyrics. Many of Lady Gaga's tracks are exceptions too, although some of her metaphors are pretty transparent/on the nose. That's more of a nitpick though. Point is, I can recognise great lyrics from shite lyrics, but struggle to write my own great lyrics.

However, I read this one phrase yesterday that "you need fertilizer to grow a crop". In other words, I write lyrics like normal, and when I "farm" and tend to those lyrics, I can grow a decent crop of great words.

It may sound like I'm going off-topic, but this advice can equally apply to @_mwallace 's situation. Start with the fertilizer, and grow a complex crop of notes and beats and lyrics and the like.

Another way to look at it is you're creating a sonic painting. Most painters either begin with the sketch or with the underpainting (depending on the technique each artist has developed). This could be seen as laying down the initial outline of a track, or crafting an 8-bar loop to work off of, or however the individual begins their track. Then eventually a musician begins building up various passages with more complexity and detail much like an oil painter begins with bigger shapes and impressions on the canvas before pulling out the smaller brushes to pop in the details.

Don't ask me why I'm in an insightful mood at the moment. Perhaps it was that beer I enjoyed at lunch what did it.

Very true. Most normal human need to work at something to become good. That 10000 hours rules. Am I missing a zero?

jwmmakerofmusic

@ecou said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@ecou said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:
I get the same feeling as the OP but in regards to lyric writing. Classic musicians like Jim Croce, David Bowie, Prince, Kurt Cobain, etc, and (for a more modern example) Sia all humble me as a wannabe lyricist. I can create melodies, chord progs, backing tracks just fine. However, lyrics often stump me. Last thing I want to do is fall into the trap of "kindergarten" lyrics as @ecou so succinctly put it, lol.

Succinctly 🤔🤔 I had to google that one 😂😂 Turns out its the exact same in French. I guess I’m a bit embarrassed now. 😳😳

No need to be mate. Most modern pop is cow dung/merde. Sia is an exception as most of her songs have layers to the lyrics. Many of Lady Gaga's tracks are exceptions too, although some of her metaphors are pretty transparent/on the nose. That's more of a nitpick though. Point is, I can recognise great lyrics from shite lyrics, but struggle to write my own great lyrics.

However, I read this one phrase yesterday that "you need fertilizer to grow a crop". In other words, I write lyrics like normal, and when I "farm" and tend to those lyrics, I can grow a decent crop of great words.

It may sound like I'm going off-topic, but this advice can equally apply to @_mwallace 's situation. Start with the fertilizer, and grow a complex crop of notes and beats and lyrics and the like.

Another way to look at it is you're creating a sonic painting. Most painters either begin with the sketch or with the underpainting (depending on the technique each artist has developed). This could be seen as laying down the initial outline of a track, or crafting an 8-bar loop to work off of, or however the individual begins their track. Then eventually a musician begins building up various passages with more complexity and detail much like an oil painter begins with bigger shapes and impressions on the canvas before pulling out the smaller brushes to pop in the details.

Don't ask me why I'm in an insightful mood at the moment. Perhaps it was that beer I enjoyed at lunch what did it.

Very true. Most normal human need to work at something to become good. That 10000 hours rules. Am I missing a zero?

That's about correct mate, lol.

BlueGreenSpiral

I like his new one, bit of a departure!

_mwallace

@jwmmakerofmusic said:
It may sound like I'm going off-topic, but this advice can equally apply to @_mwallace 's situation. Start with the fertilizer, and grow a complex crop of notes and beats and lyrics and the like.

Another way to look at it is you're creating a sonic painting. Most painters either begin with the sketch or with the underpainting (depending on the technique each artist has developed). This could be seen as laying down the initial outline of a track, or crafting an 8-bar loop to work off of, or however the individual begins their track. Then eventually a musician begins building up various passages with more complexity and detail much like an oil painter begins with bigger shapes and impressions on the canvas before pulling out the smaller brushes to pop in the details.

Don't ask me why I'm in an insightful mood at the moment. Perhaps it was that beer I enjoyed at lunch what did it.

Great advice. Thanks. I tend to take a fairly simplistic approach to begin with. So, with the 10,000 hours of practice I’m hoping I’ll eventually have that aha moment where it all comes together. And yeah, lyrics are another part of this creative process that will require some kind of miracle. As of yet, I have only just dabbled in writing them.

ecou

@_mwallace said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:
It may sound like I'm going off-topic, but this advice can equally apply to @_mwallace 's situation. Start with the fertilizer, and grow a complex crop of notes and beats and lyrics and the like.

Another way to look at it is you're creating a sonic painting. Most painters either begin with the sketch or with the underpainting (depending on the technique each artist has developed). This could be seen as laying down the initial outline of a track, or crafting an 8-bar loop to work off of, or however the individual begins their track. Then eventually a musician begins building up various passages with more complexity and detail much like an oil painter begins with bigger shapes and impressions on the canvas before pulling out the smaller brushes to pop in the details.

Don't ask me why I'm in an insightful mood at the moment. Perhaps it was that beer I enjoyed at lunch what did it.

Great advice. Thanks. I tend to take a fairly simplistic approach to begin with. So, with the 10,000 hours of practice I’m hoping I’ll eventually have that aha moment where it all comes together. And yeah, lyrics are another part of this creative process that will require some kind of miracle. As of yet, I have only just dabbled in writing them.

In my case I’m really quick to catch on. It usually only takes me 9999 hours to catch on. 😉

jwmmakerofmusic

@ecou said:

@_mwallace said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:
It may sound like I'm going off-topic, but this advice can equally apply to @_mwallace 's situation. Start with the fertilizer, and grow a complex crop of notes and beats and lyrics and the like.

Another way to look at it is you're creating a sonic painting. Most painters either begin with the sketch or with the underpainting (depending on the technique each artist has developed). This could be seen as laying down the initial outline of a track, or crafting an 8-bar loop to work off of, or however the individual begins their track. Then eventually a musician begins building up various passages with more complexity and detail much like an oil painter begins with bigger shapes and impressions on the canvas before pulling out the smaller brushes to pop in the details.

Don't ask me why I'm in an insightful mood at the moment. Perhaps it was that beer I enjoyed at lunch what did it.

Great advice. Thanks. I tend to take a fairly simplistic approach to begin with. So, with the 10,000 hours of practice I’m hoping I’ll eventually have that aha moment where it all comes together. And yeah, lyrics are another part of this creative process that will require some kind of miracle. As of yet, I have only just dabbled in writing them.

In my case I’m really quick to catch on. It usually only takes me 9999 hours to catch on. 😉

Lol!

haulin_notes

Thanks to this thread, i now have alternating ear worms going through my head:

“I’m human and i make mistakes... just like everybody else does” and
“I was happy in the haze of a drunken hour, but heaven knows I’m miserable now...”

Not the worst ear worms. Could be Katy Perry! 😄

_mwallace

@haulin_notes said:
Thanks to this thread, i now have alternating ear worms going through my head:

‘Typical me, typical me, typical me I started something.. And now I’m not too sure.’
‘She said, I know you and you cannot sing.. I said that’s nothing, you should hear me play piano...’