Midi automated transposing with asymmetrical timings question

Gavinski

I want to set up automatic transposing of several instances of Rozeta Scaler in AUM. One is set to 0 semitones the other to - 24. Every 6 bars I want both to go up one semitone and then after 2 bars come down again. What's the easiest way to set this up? Cheers folks.

Calverhall

Im not sure about easiest but I’d imagine the most precise way would be with something coded in Mozaic.

_ki

Did you set the input or output transpose of scaler ?

If you used the input transpose (one to 0, the other to -24), you could automate the output transpose of both with the same CC stream.

Setup with StepBud:

• setup 8 slots, the note doesn‘t matter
• set the rate of each step to 1/1, so a bar each
• set modulattion for the first 6 steps to exactly 0.50, the last two steps to 0.53
• In AUMs midi matrix, route StepBud to midi control
• For both Rozeta Scaler, set the Au parameter automation of Post Transpose to CC-1 CH 1

This will transpose both scalers by one semitone after six bars and go back to no transpose after bar 8.

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If you need to use the output transpose for the -24, you can setup a second StepBud instance with a modulation setting of 0.0p for 6 steps and 0.03 for the last two steps.

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Besides StepBud there are of course several other possibilities to create such a simple 8 step CC sequence, I think there is already something for Mozaic.

_ki

But you should be aware of one thing - since the automation happens right on the beat and there might be a note issued in the exact same timeslot, the settings applied to the very first note on each bar depends on the order the midi signals arrive at rozeta scaler. And you can’t afect that order as it depends on the hosts internal implementation and the order of execution of the midi AUv3 plugins.

What this means: The first note of bar 0 might play 1 semitone too high and the first note of bar 6 might be one semitone too low.
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Ideally AUv3 parameter automation for pattern changes needs to happen just before the bar change, perhaps 1/128 before so that its unlikely that there will be another note in the very last timeslot of the previous bar. This applies to all AUv3 with pattern change commands, which are controlled by other midi AUv3 with their output routed to control the AUv3 parameter.

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There is no method to ensure which midi generator (the one for the note to be played or the one for the note or CC to control the pattern change) will be processed first in that timeslot and therefor its undetermined which signal will arrive first - note or pattern change. Thats why one needs to fire the pattern change a tiny bit earlier.

Gavinski

@_ki Thanks for the lengthy reply. One problem though would be that if I automate output transpose in the way you are suggesting, then they will no longer be quantized to scale. The point about the first beat being on the wrong note also makes this a less than ideal solution. This would be a good problem to solve though, as it would give potential for more interesting jams in AUM without actually having to lay down sequenced tracks.

Gavinski

But I suppose I can use the same method you described to automate the input transpose?

_ki

Off course you can automate the input transpose in the same way.

Just try it out, maybe put stepbud on the first track and the rozeta scalers in track two and their note input generators starting on a midi track 3. IIRC AUM processes left to right, maybe even from top to bottom in midi tracks.
Do the setup, save it and then reload it. Now check if the order of events is working. If not: reorder the tracks, so first generators, then scaler then stepbud - save and reload. The save/reload is to ensure a defined plugin load order, which might influence the execution order.

All setups should run stable and deterministic, so you just need to find out correct order.

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I already have something cooking in Moazic quite a while now, but didn‘t yet find the time to develop it further.

Gavinski

_ki, apart from as you said, the lag on the first beat, this actually works very well, and order is not important. Great tip, I’ll be using this in a short vid I’ll put out later and will definitely name-check you and mention this great technique, thanks a lot bro, really super, super useful for me.

Gavinski

If I set one up with more steps, I’ll be able to avoid that lag, too, by programming the change to happen on the 4th beat of the bar too.

Gavinski

Don’t seem to be getting lag on the transpose actually

_ki

Yeah thats a good idea for a work-around 👍🏼

I did some test with my idea of putting the plugins of different midi tracks and the changing the order, save & reload... but it didn‘t work out, in all orders i tried, the first note did not get transposed correctly, but with the previous setting.
It seems that either Scaler needs some minimal time to process the AUv3 parameter change or the routing first to AUMs midi control and then to the AUv3 parameter produces a tiny delay.

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It is very cool that you have simply spun the basic idea further and found a working solution. I

would like have an easier setup with StepBud for this cas. If i want for instance do the change in the last 1/32 of the bar, i need to a add a 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8 + 1/16 + 1/32 and then the 1/32 with the change place the single one-bar step. I also didn‘t find an interaction to insert or re-order steps - so the whole sequence must be planned and input with some thought

Gavinski

This really makes me think how nice it would be if AUM had inbuilt CC automation tracks, but I suppose it would be something similar to this anyway, so maybe doesn’t matter

Gavinski

Ended up having to put the mod setting on step bud to 0.51 for the parts where I wanted it to stay at the original transpose level btw @_ki

enkaytee

So @Gavinski what's the video going to be covering later? (It's Nigel T here by the way - I snuck on to Audiob.us incognito but shhh - it's our secret!)

Gavinski

@enkaytee Hey Nige! This is how I used this, and I mentioned you in the vid btw _ki

enkaytee

Yep - just seen it @Gavinski - great use of Stepbud - thanks @_ki...!