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Digital piano for beginner
My lovely partner Mel has got an urge to learn piano lately and we’ve been trying to figure out the best route to go. Thought we’d both like a real one, we’ve ruled it out for now for a couple of reasons; space/practicality, and noise - she wants to be able to get over the first steps using headphones rather than feeling like she’s disturbing anybody nearby (we’re in UK terraced housing with quite thin walls)
I’d probably get in in the action too as I’ve regretted donating my old midi controller to a charity shop a while back and been hankering after something with a bigger range than my wee old alesis 25 key thing...
I think a full 88 keys with proper action is the right way to go so have whittled down to these:
Yamaha P45 (solid quality but a little long in the tooth? - limited connections and polyphony)
Roland FP30/10 (Looks perfect either way but I’ve read a few reports about the keys getting clicks after a few months, and I think realistically we’d go for the 10 as funds aren’t unlimited - but the Bluetooth would be ace for iOS I guess?)
We have looked at others from Casio and Korg but their feature set doesn’t seem to tally that well with the two I’ve mentioned, perhaps I’m wrong, or my priorities need straightening 
Any thoughts? (Oh and a side one, I’m all for learning by ear etc but I think she’d like some basic help, she’s tried a few of those hit the note as it a descends type training apps but they all seem flawed in some way so any recommendations there most welcome too)
Cheers
Chris
Comments
On the app front I gave them all a good go over lockdown. I went mostly with Skoove as I found a free 3 month trial in an old midi controller box and I was doing well with it until I got un-furloughed. I also liked Flowkey, but that was relatively expensive. My daughter (10) went with Simply Piano with gusto for at least the first month of the 3 month subscription I got her (then I got an unlimited data plan and we mostly lost her to Minecraft and Youtube). It's a bit frustrating you can't have more than one user in most of them, you can with Simply Piano, but you have to pay more to do so.
I'd say try the free week trials (Yousician as well to add to the above list) and go from there - and see what's bundled with your keyboard. I found the screen arrangements made a difference - keys above notes or notes above keys, they are all slightly different in that respect.
Skoove are currently offering lifetime subscription for €149 until Oct 6th, that's 2 years worth at their normal price. I was tempted, but not tempted/dedicated enough. As most things here, Black Friday may be your friend, but in the last 6 months I've not had any of the others sending me a deal of any kind, nor did any try to seduce me with offers once the trials expired.
Before I tried the apps I learnt Bach's prelude no.1 with James Rhodes's book:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Play-Piano-James-Rhodes/dp/1786482401
It was one of the best things I've ever done both for playing and learning to read sheet music. I often practised on an old Roland pc-200 midi controller (5 octaves I think) into a Korg Module piano on my phone with headphones (though I also have access to a proper electric piano). I did though put in the full recommended 45 minutes a day for 6 weeks (and then some) to go from zero to piano hero, unprecedented focus for me and only possible because I was in hibernation mode (i.e. no proper work). When I found the notes of Brakes 'All night Disco Party' within Bach things really started to rock (or disco).
Bluetooth is great for iOS, I've stuck a Yamaha MD-bt01 in my partner's big piano mentioned above (Casio PX-3). I like secretly hooking it up to an iOS synth across the room and then leaning on it as a party piece... not that anyone comes anymore (pre or post covid)... still, I enjoy it.
Thanks @steve99 , lots of answer in your reply, I’ll definitely pass on that to her, and your party piece sounds fun 😆
Maybe this could hellp you:
Thanks @fjcblanco , I’d already watched a few of these vs things but he had some interesting new insights for me 👍
I've been looking at pianos myself and found the kawai es110 and the Yamaha p125 are two I go between.
This guy does some great reviews and comparisons.
Cheers @Bootsy I thought there must be a nice Kawai to look at, thought I think we've already upsold ourselves a bit to the p45 / fp30 level without stepping up another level for now
Casio PSX1000, 3000 (pitch wheel, more sounds) a good feel playing (tho some have disagreed) and a beautiful look with decent connectivity. Kawai ES520, brand new with a great action, upgraded speakers, great piano sounds. Not a fan of Yamaha but others love them.
Cheers @LinearLineman the Kawai a bit out of our reach but the Casio is interesting as it’s available in our price range at various places in the UK, I foresee a trip to a big music store to get a feel of some of these very soon
I do own a Roland FP-10, and I'm very happy with it...
The Kawai ES110 has no audio in and no pitch wheel or knobs. Same for the FP10. The quality of sounds on the Casio is good for piano (especially the PSX3000 which has more piano sounds) but the other sounds are so so. Can’t say any others in the price range are much better. But then you have iOS to draw from.
The Roland FP-10 is a steal. All your money is going to a great keybed in a super-compact package. I have an HP-503 that I paid $1300 during a massive sale and it has the same keybed, and the same SuperNatural synthesis engine. Obviously you aren't getting much for bells and whistles, or room filling audio, but you can't beat the price for headphone practice.
One unmarketed thing about the FP10 is that it actually has all the same sounds as the FP30, you just have to access them through the app rather than the panel.
The Roland is certainly seeming attractive to me, the only thing that was putting me off was reading about the clicking keys thing, but the more I dig into that, the less it bothers me as it’s just the grease working its way around the keybed and either wouldn’t happen in this climate, or is fairly easy to remedy, or even just ignore... it’ll like as not come down to us having a good go on a few of them and feeling which one is right...
One thing for certain, any discussion on which piano feels better to play is totally subjective. You have to play it.
Also, make sure you adjust the touch sensitivity (also known as a velocity curve). If the setting is on heavy and you prefer a light, easily triggered, sound, you can disqualify an instrument over a bad setting.
There has been a big argument over the Casio PSX action... that it is harder to play at the top of the keys because of the short pivot point of the keys (it has the shortest key length on the market. I have one and I noticed no significant issue.of those being considered, IMO, the Casio 3000 is the best choice for features and coolth. Very tweakable, Bluetooth, good connectivity.
Lots of great lessons on youtube for piano at all levels and styles. Once I find something I want to learn I paste the url into the PlaySections app for slowing down and looping a section of the video until I get it. With weighted keys pay attention to the physical aspects of posture, chair at the right height and posture of the hands to get into good habits from the beginning.
Thanks all, some great advice here and much appreciated by Mel and I 🙏
We picked up a Roland FP-10 yesterday, Mel very happy, she spent the rest of the day playing on it, and was very reluctant to go to work today. I then I had a go at recording stuff into xequence, which was just a lovely experience, and I think it'll help my composing a lot.
Thanks to everyone for the advice, and a shout out to Aaron at PMT in Manchester for being such a lovely sales guy, and well on top of covid procedures
Nice choice. I have a Yamaha P 45, and I am happy with playing piano parts with it. But theRowland seems really good too.
Glad it worked out. I think the sounds on the FP 30 are available thru the Roland app.
@Krupa, gratz! And thx for the thread, I got similar questions. Now I think that Roland is the best pick
@Audiomaniac11. I am selling my Casio PXS3000. Might interest you. $550 plus shipping. That’s about $200 off SweetWater with tax. 1 yr warranty left.
Casio PXS3000 seem a good option
A little background, my 12 year old son has electric guitar lessons, and also had a few piano lessons from the same teacher. He was enthusiastic, so I have bought a Yamaha NP-12 for him (and myself), 61 keys. It runs on batteries too, for a long period.
https://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/musical_instruments/keyboards/piaggero/np-32_12/downloads.html
He learned a few basic songs, and used the Synthesia app on Ipad, with USB cable, to learn a few songs (for example Lucas Graham, 7 years). But in the end you have to learn to read the music script to play piano, learning by muscle memory is not the way. So he does´t use the piano that much at the moment. I have no regret, a piano in the house is always a positive thing. I think a 88 key version is not needed when you just start. Yamaha NP has 76 or 61 keys.
I come from a synthesizer background, I think the NP-12 sounds good and feels good (enough). And if you want to cheat, playing only the white keys is C major/A minor, just fool around and improvise. For another key, you have to transpose the keyboard with + or -. The Yamaha can do this, and a lot more, for example dual voices, octave shift, set reverb level, etc. I have not yet a sustain pedal connected, that might be a nice extension for a digital piano.
I can understand your reasons why you don't want to get a real piano but I would urge you to reconsider.
I've had a few old uprights over the years and nothing beats the sound of sitting in front of one. The sound is amazing even if they are a bit out of tune. Full of life and character.
And imagine the joy of your neighbours as they slowly hear your partner improves.
Trust me, I’m working on it 😁
Separately, I’m getting a workspace to do the homemade sound making gear soon, and I’m thinking I really should get a piano in there, there’s always free ones round here, just need man and van to help…
Yamaha NP12 for me too when the old upright is too loud for the neighbours