OT: Behringer Poly D or Moog Subsequent 25?????

Strizbiz

Soooooo, I’m really feeling the urge to say f@#k it and buy a synth, lol. I want to get the Moog, which will definitely cost more and I’ll have to be really tight with money for at least a month or so if I pull the trigger on it,
But the Behringer Poly D might be another cheaper option, and it’s polyphonic ( kinda ) and it kinda looks like a lot of fun, and it has more keys.....but maybe the Moog would be a better investment in the long run? Especially if I end up selling it a few years from now?
I want to order today , but I’m also thinking wait and see if there’s a Black Friday sale?
Something tells me I’m not going to see a Moog Black Friday sale though.
Anyway any thoughts ? Which would you buy?

klownshed

I'd buy the Moog.

I'm sure the Behringer is much better value if you compare features, but the Moog is a Moog. And it's not that much more expensive. Even though you could buy another Behringer clone for the difference ;-)

The Moog will almost certainly keep its value better too.

FWIW I have a Pro-1 and love it so have no bias against Behringer whatsoever.

Strizbiz

@klownshed said:
I'd buy the Moog.

I'm sure the Behringer is much better value if you compare features, but the Moog is a Moog. And it's not that much more expensive. Even though you could buy another Behringer clone for the difference ;-)

The Moog will almost certainly keep its value better too.

FWIW I have a Pro-1 and love it so have no bias against Behringer whatsoever.

Yeah, I kinda feel the Moog will at least hold its value longer, The only synth I have now is the Microbrute and I’m starting to get this really loud noise when I plug it into my audio interface using the quarter inch out, I have to use the headphone output, I don’t know what that’s about, but I feel like it’s time to move up to a better synth now, I don’t suspect the Moog will start humming and acting up ( hopefully) anytime soon. That Pro 1 looks nice btw, I just checked it out after your comment, thanks for your input 🙏

klownshed

:-)

I love my Pro-1. Behringer fixed a couple of issues I had with it with firmware updates and i get instant nostalgia everytime I use it. I just wish I had more time to make music.

I’ve said this before on the forum but ever since I saw Vince Clarke of Yazoo play one on top of the pops and learning that it was the main synth used on Upstairs at Eric’s I’ve wanted a Pro-One.

The Behringer version does not disappoint.

I saw a fairly recent interview with Vince Clarke where he says the Pro-One is still his favourite synth — and I think he’s owned every synthesiser ever made. ;-)

FPC

Both lovely but that Moog is so desirable. I think you should treat yourself and stretch to the Moog.
PS please stop rekindling my synth hardware lust. You know iOS synths are awesome and all you ever actually need

Liquidmantis

I'd buy the Moog (if it was your money). I say that and I have a table full of the Behringer modules behind me, but I can't wait to replace the bOdyssey with the b2600. I hate the keybed on the Odyssey. It's not necessarily bad, per se, but there's nothing to it and it's clacky. I'd rather just have a module that I can control from my SL Mk3.

Maybe the Poly D has a more premium keybed, but given the price point I suspect that it's just a commodity keybed that they use in all their products. Hopefully their upcoming premium synths have a nice one.

Jocphone

Nick Batt does a good overview of the Behringer

Difference with the Moog seems to be greater paraphony and another octave on the keyboard but the Moog has much greater MIDI control. The Moog is more expensive but is it only strictly analogue you will consider? The new Modal Cobalt8 looks pretty tasty..

kinkujin

I think if you want a Moog, then no non-Moog will do. Even if you really love what you're using, if you've got your heart set on something nothing else will do. At least, in my experience.

That being said, that Beri looks pretty cool.

*edit - I also think it sounds beautiful. It just seems to me that in this day and age (and yeah I know they are going for vintage vibe here) I'd want to be able to save some patches.

Paydaylukie

I got a sub37 and it truly is a modern classic. I got other mono synths and this one still isn’t going to go anywhere. I’m a huge mono synth guy for performance, layering, melodies, and sequencing. TBH for me synth chords and things I just use Arturia, or omnisphere primarily because I’m not doing so much tweaking performance wise when I’m playing a poly synth... Probably because I’m using both hands ;P.

Sub37 is darker sounding than model d.

That being said behringer has been putting out bangers. If you can demo it somewhere I would.

aleyas

Depends on what you want in your instrument. I don't think the manufacturer really matters much. To phrase the question differently you could ask yourself if you want a minimoog or a sub25? While they both sound great, they also have significant differences.

-The oscillators are the first difference. Poly D has 4 VCOs with essentially 6 variations of 3 waveforms (tri, saw, pulse), while the subsequent has 2 VCOs (and a sub) with continuously variable wave shapes from triangle through pulse. The subsequent also has oscillator sync and pwm, both of which the Poly D (minimoog) lack.
-Moving on to the filter, the Poly D has the classic 24db diode ladder filter. A characteristic of this filter is steep bass loss when resonance is increased. The subsequent 25 has a similar diode ladder filter, but with 4 slopes selectable (6, 12, 18, 24db). The filter has bass compensation so you won't get the same kind of bass dropouts as the Poly D. Subsequent 25 also has a great sounding multi-drive. To get overdrive on the Poly D you need to patch from the headphone out to the external in. Of course, there's a built in DS-1 distortion on the poly D too. Doesn't sound that great though.
-The VCA on the minimoog was engineered in a way which pushed the filter in hot. This gave the minimoog the extremely saturated and fat sound its known for. Theres something magic in that VCA I can't quite express. It's dirty and alive, and responsible for a lot of the minimoog character. The Poly D shares all of these characteristics. The VCA on the Subsequent has much higher headroom, so instead the VCF multidrive is the tool to achieve a more saturated sound.
-Both synths have very snappy envelopes. Poly D has two 3 stage ADS envelopes. The Subsequent has two 4 stage ADSR envelopes with optional loop function and extended ranges.
-The Poly D doesn't have an lfo, but oscillator 4 can be used as an lfo. Subsequent has 1 lfo with 6 shapes and can be synced to midi clock.
-Theres a number of more routing differences I won't go over. Not to mention 4 osc paraphony vs 2 osc parophony. Subsequent also has full midi control and patch storage making it more ideal for use with a daw, or if you like to use midi automation.

However at the end of the day, the Poly D is the fatter synth. Both in build stature and in sound. Its a honest to god Minimoog clone, with a couple of extras. Forget what everyone else is saying about the brand, or the manufacturer. Look at the specs to determine what your needs are, what kind of sound design is possible on either instrument, and then finally, which instruments sound moves you the most. You honestly couldn't make a bad choice between the two.

TonalityApp

@aleyas This is a great comparison – thank you! I'm also looking at these synths

Strizbiz

@aleyas said:
Depends on what you want in your instrument. I don't think the manufacturer really matters much. To phrase the question differently you could ask yourself if you want a minimoog or a sub25? While they both sound great, they also have significant differences.

-The oscillators are the first difference. Poly D has 4 VCOs with essentially 6 variations of 3 waveforms (tri, saw, pulse), while the subsequent has 2 VCOs (and a sub) with continuously variable wave shapes from triangle through pulse. The subsequent also has oscillator sync and pwm, both of which the Poly D (minimoog) lack.
-Moving on to the filter, the Poly D has the classic 24db diode ladder filter. A characteristic of this filter is steep bass loss when resonance is increased. The subsequent 25 has a similar diode ladder filter, but with 4 slopes selectable (6, 12, 18, 24db). The filter has bass compensation so you won't get the same kind of bass dropouts as the Poly D. Subsequent 25 also has a great sounding multi-drive. To get overdrive on the Poly D you need to patch from the headphone out to the external in. Of course, there's a built in DS-1 distortion on the poly D too. Doesn't sound that great though.
-The VCA on the minimoog was engineered in a way which pushed the filter in hot. This gave the minimoog the extremely saturated and fat sound its known for. Theres something magic in that VCA I can't quite express. It's dirty and alive, and responsible for a lot of the minimoog character. The Poly D shares all of these characteristics. The VCA on the Subsequent has much higher headroom, so instead the VCF multidrive is the tool to achieve a more saturated sound.
-Both synths have very snappy envelopes. Poly D has two 3 stage ADS envelopes. The Subsequent has two 4 stage ADSR envelopes with optional loop function and extended ranges.
-The Poly D doesn't have an lfo, but oscillator 4 can be used as an lfo. Subsequent has 1 lfo with 6 shapes and can be synced to midi clock.
-Theres a number of more routing differences I won't go over. Not to mention 4 osc paraphony vs 2 osc parophony. Subsequent also has full midi control and patch storage making it more ideal for use with a daw, or if you like to use midi automation.

However at the end of the day, the Poly D is the fatter synth. Both in build stature and in sound. Its a honest to god Minimoog clone, with a couple of extras. Forget what everyone else is saying about the brand, or the manufacturer. Look at the specs to determine what your needs are, what kind of sound design is possible on either instrument, and then finally, which instruments sound moves you the most. You honestly couldn't make a bad choice between the two.

Yeah, the Poly D sounds really great, but I went ahead and ordered the Moog, I think down the line I’ll pick up the Poly D also but I think the sound of the Sub 25 is what I’m after for the music I plan on recording over the next several months, also neither selling point is that you can save 16 preset in the Sub 25 and also save 256 presets via the patch editor. I want to be able to come up with some crazy patches and recall them, especially if I want to go back to a track and add more using the same sound.
I like the Microbrute but I always have to take a pic of the knobs if I want to get back to a sound if I really like it lol.
Thanks for your input though, you definitely have me wanting to get the Poly D maybe in a few months 👍🏽👍🏽🙏

Strizbiz

Thank you all for the feed back, I pulled the trigger on the Moog, I can’t wait until it gets here! I also bought a Boss ME 80 a week ago that I’m loving and I definitely want to run the Moog thru that and see what happens, I literally never heard about the Boss 2 weeks ago , it’s really affordable as far as multi effect pedals go and for what it does imo but I’m loving all the KNOBS on it !!!!!!! No menu diving 😁😁😁😁

klownshed

Cool.

Now that you have a keyboard you could get the little behringer Model D and get a rack with room for the Pro-1 and MS-20 clones :-)

aleyas

Cool you already placed an order! I have a sub phatty in my hometown, and have experience with the Behringer model D. The Model/Poly D truly sings. There's a reason the OG's used to be the most coveted synth. But the sub/subsequent is just so much more convenient to use with daws and other midi gear. If I was in your position I'd probably choose the subsequent also.. mostly because I think a synth with such a mature midi spec would play insanely good with Drambo (random number generators triggered by a beat synced clock to every subsequent parameter? yes please!). Although, the large keybed of the Poly D looks sooo nice to play on. Love the tilting panel also.

Have fun with the new toy man!

@Strizbiz said:

@aleyas said:
Depends on what you want in your instrument. I don't think the manufacturer really matters much. To phrase the question differently you could ask yourself if you want a minimoog or a sub25? While they both sound great, they also have significant differences.

-The oscillators are the first difference. Poly D has 4 VCOs with essentially 6 variations of 3 waveforms (tri, saw, pulse), while the subsequent has 2 VCOs (and a sub) with continuously variable wave shapes from triangle through pulse. The subsequent also has oscillator sync and pwm, both of which the Poly D (minimoog) lack.
-Moving on to the filter, the Poly D has the classic 24db diode ladder filter. A characteristic of this filter is steep bass loss when resonance is increased. The subsequent 25 has a similar diode ladder filter, but with 4 slopes selectable (6, 12, 18, 24db). The filter has bass compensation so you won't get the same kind of bass dropouts as the Poly D. Subsequent 25 also has a great sounding multi-drive. To get overdrive on the Poly D you need to patch from the headphone out to the external in. Of course, there's a built in DS-1 distortion on the poly D too. Doesn't sound that great though.
-The VCA on the minimoog was engineered in a way which pushed the filter in hot. This gave the minimoog the extremely saturated and fat sound its known for. Theres something magic in that VCA I can't quite express. It's dirty and alive, and responsible for a lot of the minimoog character. The Poly D shares all of these characteristics. The VCA on the Subsequent has much higher headroom, so instead the VCF multidrive is the tool to achieve a more saturated sound.
-Both synths have very snappy envelopes. Poly D has two 3 stage ADS envelopes. The Subsequent has two 4 stage ADSR envelopes with optional loop function and extended ranges.
-The Poly D doesn't have an lfo, but oscillator 4 can be used as an lfo. Subsequent has 1 lfo with 6 shapes and can be synced to midi clock.
-Theres a number of more routing differences I won't go over. Not to mention 4 osc paraphony vs 2 osc parophony. Subsequent also has full midi control and patch storage making it more ideal for use with a daw, or if you like to use midi automation.

However at the end of the day, the Poly D is the fatter synth. Both in build stature and in sound. Its a honest to god Minimoog clone, with a couple of extras. Forget what everyone else is saying about the brand, or the manufacturer. Look at the specs to determine what your needs are, what kind of sound design is possible on either instrument, and then finally, which instruments sound moves you the most. You honestly couldn't make a bad choice between the two.

Yeah, the Poly D sounds really great, but I went ahead and ordered the Moog, I think down the line I’ll pick up the Poly D also but I think the sound of the Sub 25 is what I’m after for the music I plan on recording over the next several months, also neither selling point is that you can save 16 preset in the Sub 25 and also save 256 presets via the patch editor. I want to be able to come up with some crazy patches and recall them, especially if I want to go back to a track and add more using the same sound.
I like the Microbrute but I always have to take a pic of the knobs if I want to get back to a sound if I really like it lol.
Thanks for your input though, you definitely have me wanting to get the Poly D maybe in a few months 👍🏽👍🏽🙏

Strizbiz

@aleyas said:
Cool you already placed an order! I have a sub phatty in my hometown, and have experience with the Behringer model D. The Model/Poly D truly sings. There's a reason the OG's used to be the most coveted synth. But the sub/subsequent is just so much more convenient to use with daws and other midi gear. If I was in your position I'd probably choose the subsequent also.. mostly because I think a synth with such a mature midi spec would play insanely good with Drambo (random number generators triggered by a beat synced clock to every subsequent parameter? yes please!). Although, the large keybed of the Poly D looks sooo nice to play on. Love the tilting panel also.

Have fun with the new toy man!

We are cooking with gas now!!!!! 🤪 Poly D is next on the list but I have to say, being able to save presets with the Sub 25 is bananas!!!!! I definitely have to dig a lot deeper than I have with Drambo so far, I can build insane synths but I know it goes much deeper lol

Liquidmantis

Awesome! Enjoy.

Also :

Strizbiz

@Liquidmantis said:
Awesome! Enjoy.

Also :

😂😂😂 and I just plugged in the power plug for my ME 80 that just came, 😂😂😂 you don’t even want to see all the other power strips I have plugged in lol

klownshed

@Strizbiz said:

@Liquidmantis said:
Awesome! Enjoy.

Also :

😂😂😂 and I just plugged in the power plug for my ME 80 that just came, 😂😂😂 you don’t even want to see all the other power strips I have plugged in lol

Nice. You might want to get a fire extinguisher before you add a Model D 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥