Rosario in Korg Gadget: how to improve my sound?

dokwok2

This afternoon I tried to add some guitar to a Gadget track. I plugged my Telecaster into my Apogee Jam, set the Jam's gain so that it wasn't clipping, and selected the AC-30 model. I really struggled to get a passable sound. I wanted a clean chime or jangle,* but everything I tried seemed muddy. I turned down the amp sim's bass control, which helped, but it still sounded muffled and distant, even without reverb or effects.

Any tips? (I have Tonestack and the old Bias FX, but stopped using them once I got a couple of real amps and some stomp boxes.)

McD

For this case I would add a Joyo JF-14 "American Sound" pedal for about $40. There are also Vox, Mesa Boogie and Marshall variants at the same price.

You could also put the OverLoud TH-U amp sim app on an iPhone and use it as a front end to an iPad running Gadget. TH-U is amazing for getting clean chime-y Fender tones.

The TH-U App is free and the best Fender sound comes from a ChopTones iRig IAP.

dokwok2

@McD said:
For this case I would add a Joyo JF-14 "American Sound" pedal for about $40.

I have that pedal and the Vox one. Like 'em both.

Is the consensus that Rosario's amp sims just aren't any good? The sound is so poor that I really suspect user error...

McD

@dokwok2 said:
Is the consensus that Rosario's amp sims just aren't any good? The sound is so poor that I really suspect user error...

Never tried them... are they free with the Gadget product. I haven't opened it in a long time.

espiegel123

@dokwok2 said:
This afternoon I tried to add some guitar to a Gadget track. I plugged my Telecaster into my Apogee Jam, set the Jam's gain so that it wasn't clipping, and selected the AC-30 model. I really struggled to get a passable sound. I wanted a clean chime or jangle,* but everything I tried seemed muddy. I turned down the amp sim's bass control, which helped, but it still sounded muffled and distant, even without reverb or effects.

Any tips? (I have Tonestack and the old Bias FX, but stopped using them once I got a couple of real amps and some stomp boxes.)

It isn’t a great amp sim, but I also don’t think it’s terrible. Here is something I threw together a clean-ish rhythm sound and dirtier lead. I didn’t spend a ton of time tweaking (I am sure better sound is possible) but did find that all the knobs including the cabinet mix and both gain controls needed tweaking:

McD

@espiegel123 said:
It isn’t a great amp sim, but I also don’t think it’s terrible. Here is somethingI threw together a clean-ish rhythm sound and dirtier lead. I didn’t not spend a ton of time tweaking but did find that all the knobs including the cabinet mix and both gain controls needed tweaking

Sounds good but I suspect most of the goodness is in your hands.

I've always thought Korg didn't have the best tone compared to Roland and Yamaha.
But then they would create something like the WaveStation and blow me away. The
new WaveState SE sounds impressive.

dokwok2

@espiegel123 said:
It isn’t a great amp sim, but I also don’t think it’s terrible. Here is something I threw together a clean-ish rhythm sound and dirtier lead. I didn’t spend a ton of time tweaking (I am sure better sound is possible) but did find that all the knobs including the cabinet mix and both gain controls needed tweaking...

Thank you for sharing that. I didn't even consider the cabinet MIX. If you don't mind, could you tell me two things:

1. Which amp did you use for the first, cleanish sound?
2. Are you playing with single coils or humbuckers?

I'm not expecting Rosario to be as good as a dedicated guitar app. I'm just trying to keep things simple right now while I focus on classes.

espiegel123

@dokwok2 said:

@espiegel123 said:
It isn’t a great amp sim, but I also don’t think it’s terrible. Here is something I threw together a clean-ish rhythm sound and dirtier lead. I didn’t spend a ton of time tweaking (I am sure better sound is possible) but did find that all the knobs including the cabinet mix and both gain controls needed tweaking...

Thank you for sharing that. I didn't even consider the cabinet MIX. If you don't mind, could you tell me two things:

1. Which amp did you use for the first, cleanish sound?
2. Are you playing with single coils or humbuckers?

I'm not expecting Rosario to be as good as a dedicated guitar app. I'm just trying to keep things simple right now while I focus on classes.

Here are the settings on the clean guitar. I was using a humbucker-equipped guitar. FWIW, I did not find the AC30 muddy (after some adjustments) but found the twin easier to dial in something I liked.

Perhaps you could upload what the recorded guitar sounds like with all options turned off and then with the amp settings you chose. Knowing what the unmodified guitar sounds like in Rosario (you can turn off the amp, cab, and effects) will help you figure out good settings. Rosario is capable of sounds not far different from Bias and ToneStack with a little care.

Make sure to play with each dial over the dial’s full range to figure out how it impacts the sound. The interaction between the two gain knobs is important as is the presence/mid/treble. For the lead sound I also found a little Eq as an iFX was helpful.

espiegel123

@dokwok2 said:

@espiegel123 said:
It isn’t a great amp sim, but I also don’t think it’s terrible. Here is something I threw together a clean-ish rhythm sound and dirtier lead. I didn’t spend a ton of time tweaking (I am sure better sound is possible) but did find that all the knobs including the cabinet mix and both gain controls needed tweaking...

Thank you for sharing that. I didn't even consider the cabinet MIX. If you don't mind, could you tell me two things:

1. Which amp did you use for the first, cleanish sound?
2. Are you playing with single coils or humbuckers?

I'm not expecting Rosario to be as good as a dedicated guitar app. I'm just trying to keep things simple right now while I focus on classes.

Here is the same guitar recording with different settings (the dry guitar is what is recorded...so you can change amp settings after the fact). This clean guitar uses the AC30. The dirty guitar is the Tweed (used in first recording) with different gain and Eq as the first one. Settings shown below

espiegel123

@McD said:

......

Sounds good but I suspect most of the goodness is in your hands.

Thanks. You are too kind. Not absolutely sucking is my current aspiration.

I've always thought Korg didn't have the best tone compared to Roland and Yamaha.
But then they would create something like the WaveStation and blow me away. The
new WaveState SE sounds impressive.

Odyssei is my favorite viritual analog fwiw.

dokwok2

@espiegel123 said:
Here are the settings on the clean guitar...Perhaps you could upload what the recorded guitar sounds like with all options turned off and then with the amp settings you chose. Knowing what the unmodified guitar sounds like in Rosario (you can turn off the amp, cab, and effects) will help you figure out good settings...Make sure to play with each dial over the dial’s full range to figure out how it impacts the sound. The interaction between the two gain knobs is important as is the presence/mid/treble. For the lead sound I also found a little Eq as an iFX was helpful.

Thank you for those samples, and especially those screenshots. I hadn't realized there was an INPUT slider until I saw yours full up! Your posts have given me a number of different things to try, and your examples show that what I'm aiming for IS possible within Gadget.

I do wish Korg had made the controls on this Gadget easier to read. The reflections on the dials are pretty, but sometimes I really have to hunt for the black dots that indicate dial position...

dokwok2

@espiegel123 said:
Odyssei is my favorite viritual analog fwiw.

I like Korg's polyphonic synths too (M!, PolySix, Mono/Poly). They sound great in Gadget! That's what made me think: surely Rosario can sound good, or Korg wouldn't have included it.

espiegel123

@dokwok2 : here is a recording with my strat (middle pickup , tone at 10) rendered with two amp settings. One with the AC30 and the other with the Tweed. The AC30 could probably use some additional Eq to boost the high mids. That amp model is not as strong in my opinion as the tweed and twin sims. I haven’t explored beyond that

espiegel123

@dokwok2 said:

@espiegel123 said:
Here are the settings on the clean guitar...Perhaps you could upload what the recorded guitar sounds like with all options turned off and then with the amp settings you chose. Knowing what the unmodified guitar sounds like in Rosario (you can turn off the amp, cab, and effects) will help you figure out good settings...Make sure to play with each dial over the dial’s full range to figure out how it impacts the sound. The interaction between the two gain knobs is important as is the presence/mid/treble. For the lead sound I also found a little Eq as an iFX was helpful.

Thank you for those samples, and especially those screenshots. I hadn't realized there was an INPUT slider until I saw yours full up! Your posts have given me a number of different things to try, and your examples show that what I'm aiming for IS possible within Gadget.

I do wish Korg had made the controls on this Gadget easier to read. The reflections on the dials are pretty, but sometimes I really have to hunt for the black dots that indicate dial position...

The dials are hard to read. It is probably worth going through each amp to see which is closest to what you want at the onset and tweak from there. You might try different cabs with the AC30. It might be the cab that is the biggest culprit in the lack of sparkle with the AC30. The Tweed 1x12 seems good for jangle. Also, I find that I have to roll the bass almost all the way off

dokwok2

Thank you for those additional clips and tips, @espiegel123.

espiegel123

@dokwok2 said:
Thank you for those additional clips and tips, @espiegel123.

Were any of these improvements on what you were getting?

dokwok2

@espiegel123 said:

@dokwok2 said:
Thank you for those additional clips and tips, @espiegel123.

Were any of these improvements on what you were getting?

Thanks for asking. Now that the week has started, I am chained to my desk! (I teach college students, and since the pandemic started we have been doing everything over video and email.) I'm going to try your suggestions later in the week.

McD

@espiegel123 said:
Odyssei is my favorite viritual analog fwiw.

Good tip... I was skeptical before buying iWaveStation due to my anti-Korg bias.
So, since I love analog synths I'll probably love Oyssei. Is it still on sale?

UPDATE: No. $30. It's Korg's Arp product. I'll wait for the next Korg sale.

Doc_T

I do wish Korg had made the controls on this Gadget easier to read. The reflections on the dials are pretty, but sometimes I really have to hunt for the black dots that indicate dial position...

Absolutely. Same with the Durban Gadget. I do not understand how something like this can pass any beta test...