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ID700 IS HERE

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Comments

  • craftycuratecraftycurate
    edited July 2023

    +1 ...

    @modosc ID700 is a real gem and has its own unique sound and character I can't emulate with anything else. It is so good for creating long-form, slowly shifting and evolving sounds and textures which I use a lot and love to use for centering meditation and things like that.

    I completely understand the need for financial viability, as well as being a labour of love, so if you continue to work on it, as we all hope you do, I hope you find a way to charge for it.

  • GavinskiGavinski

    One thing worth mentioning to devs who feel they haven't sold enough is - have you done much marketing, both at the time of release and after? This is so crucial but it seems that very few devs are marketing savvy.

  • JES000000JES000000

    @modosc — to echo others, I would happily pay an IAP for over sampling just to support you…and then I’d go modulate the waveshaper at audio rate anyway. :smile:

    I really appreciate your explanation. So it sounds like this is a problem for all FM synthesis? In other words, would Dexxed or any modern hardware FM (Digitakt, OpSix etc) also have the aliasing issue, or do they have other workarounds? Just curious as like many others, my understanding of fm is limited compared to other kinds of synthesis.

  • rototomrototom

    is the aliasing not part of the emulation?
    i havent heard the "original" synth...

  • modoscmodosc

    i redid the oversampling support. here's a demo of playing C8 on an extremely noisy patch and cycling through the oversampling levels:

    you can definitely hear/see the difference. there's still a lot of nyquist folding present but it's certainly improved.

    i need to do some more testing so it's going to be a few days before i get this out to the app store.

  • JES000000JES000000

    Nice!

  • HotStrangeHotStrange

    @modosc said:

    @JES000000 said:
    @modosc Thanks for the reply. wow. I totally assumed I was wrong! I’d love to have the option for extra octaves. As it is now, what’s the highest “safe” octave?

    i've started writing this post like 4 times and it keeps veering off so i'll try to keep it concise - it really depends on which algorithm you're using and how you're using it.

    i oversimplified before when i implied that N octaves required 2^N oversampling. that's the best case scenario for fm but it's not a given, especially if you're using a complex algorithm with feedback and you've got modulators running at frequencies higher than the carriers. in the end it'll help somewhat but there's no guarantee how much it'll help.

    basically the rule is - the product of the modulator and index cannot modulate the carrier wave by more than half of the carrier wave's frequency (this page has a more in-depth explanation of the math behind this). once that happens you're going to get aliasing.

    so to prevent aliasing you can use very slow modulator frequencies or very low index values, but both of those are kind of boring :/

    another technique is to scale down your index values relative to the note you're playing. in a given index, select pitch as the modulation source and set the mult to some negative value. this means the higher the midi number of a given note, the lower the index value (the dx-7 called this "key tracking" iirc). you may need to adjust the keyboard range in the midi settings to get appropriate values for your keyboard since the scaling is based on this range rather than the full midi note range.

    note that the oversampling i implemented only ran for the fm synthesis section - fm'ing the waveshaper (aka timbre modulation) introduces another source of aliasing and there's very little in the literature about how to improve this.

    And does this issue also affect the desktop plugin?

    both the desktop and ios version use apple's accelerate parallel processing library under the hood so the implementations may differ in terms of speed based on your hardware but the underlying algorithms themselves are identical and patches should sound identical on both (if it aliases on ios it also does on desktop).

    I absolutely love this synth otherwise. Thanks for making and maintaining.

    thanks for the kind words. from a business standpoint it's not financially viable to keep developing something like this without charging for it via upgrades/subscriptions/etc but i don't care. i think this weekend makes it exactly six years since i generated the first sounds out of it (in a hotel room in vegas for defcon) and i can't let it go.

    Glad to hear you’re just as big of a fan of the app as we are. It’s far and away one of my favorite iOS synth apps. It just sounds fantastic and for us experimental musicians, it offers a lot of range. Have you considered adding a tip jar? I can’t do much but I’d happily tip to help support!

  • HotStrangeHotStrange

    @Gavinski said:
    One thing worth mentioning to devs who feel they haven't sold enough is - have you done much marketing, both at the time of release and after? This is so crucial but it seems that very few devs are marketing savvy.

    Kinda makes me wish I’d finished my advertising degree so I could focus on helping promote iOS apps I love 😂

  • GavinskiGavinski

    @HotStrange said:

    @Gavinski said:
    One thing worth mentioning to devs who feel they haven't sold enough is - have you done much marketing, both at the time of release and after? This is so crucial but it seems that very few devs are marketing savvy.

    Kinda makes me wish I’d finished my advertising degree so I could focus on helping promote iOS apps I love 😂

    Ah damn! That would have been cool. Tbh, I don't think it even needs an advertising degree though. More just a little thought and perhaps some reading online about how to leverage social media and maybe reading some guerilla marketing book or the other

  • HotStrangeHotStrange

    @Gavinski said:

    @HotStrange said:

    @Gavinski said:
    One thing worth mentioning to devs who feel they haven't sold enough is - have you done much marketing, both at the time of release and after? This is so crucial but it seems that very few devs are marketing savvy.

    Kinda makes me wish I’d finished my advertising degree so I could focus on helping promote iOS apps I love 😂

    Ah damn! That would have been cool. Tbh, I don't think it even needs an advertising degree though. More just a little thought and perhaps some reading online about how to leverage social media and maybe reading some guerilla marketing book or the other

    Oh for sure. There’s more than a handful of apps I’ve turned some friends into that never would’ve heard about it otherwise just due to lack of marketing. Not trying to say I’m personally an expert, just using that to point out what even a little bit more advertising and marketing could do.

    Kind of a double edged sword though as I’ve seen some people lay into Devs for promoting their apps on social media. There’s s very fine line between when it becomes “cringey” lol

  • modoscmodosc

    i submitted the oversampling build to the app store - hopefully will go out today or tomorrow.

  • HotStrangeHotStrange

    @modosc said:
    i submitted the oversampling build to the app store - hopefully will go out today or tomorrow.

    Sweet! I’ll keep an eye out!

  • JES000000JES000000

    Outstanding, thank you!

  • TelefunkyTelefunky
    edited August 2023

    I‘m not through the manual yet, but have already added ID700 to my „Keepers“ category B)
    (SamplR, Sparkle, Synclavier, CMI, the PPGs, Hilda, iVCS, Nambu, M3000, DRC, Zeeon)

  • wahnfriedenwahnfrieden

    Anyone using ID700 together with Buchla hardware (or VST)? Do they work well together? I have an Easel coming and want to dive in

  • TelefunkyTelefunky

    I‘m afraid that doesn‘t work out... Easel and ID700 are as distant as Tokio and New York o:)

  • wahnfriedenwahnfrieden

    @Telefunky said:
    I‘m afraid that doesn‘t work out... Easel and ID700 are as distant as Tokio and New York o:)

    Ah well having lived in both I think I will find a synthesis of the two ;)

  • TelefunkyTelefunky

    That would be a great solution B)

  • JES000000JES000000

    @wahnfrieden said:
    Anyone using ID700 together with Buchla hardware (or VST)? Do they work well together? I have an Easel coming and want to dive in

    I haven’t yet used them at the same time but love them both, and it would be trivial to run ID700 through the 2nd LPG.

  • JES000000JES000000

    I opened up ID700 tonight, remembered this thread and went to settings and there was over sampling. Thank you @modosc !

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User]
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • rs2000rs2000

    Sorry to say that @modosc but isn't the point of oversampling getting rid of the aliasing effects? Or is oversampling only done in a certain stage of ID700?

  • HotStrangeHotStrange

    @ehehehe said:
    Always nice to have the ability to oversample, thanks! My absolute favourite "noise-making"-synth, with totally unique sounds, now sounding even better!

    Agreed! It’s one of the iOS greats.

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User]
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • HotStrangeHotStrange

    @tja said:

    @Telefunky said:
    I‘m not through the manual yet, but have already added ID700 to my „Keepers“ category B)
    (SamplR, Sparkle, Synclavier, CMI, the PPGs, Hilda, iVCS, Nambu, M3000, DRC, Zeeon)

    My top 5, without order:

    ButterSynth
    Tera Pro
    Nambu
    ID700
    Mela 4

    and I still like

    Zeeon
    Animoog
    and lots and lots of others, incl. Thor 😅

    Ooo a top 5 synths list? For me I’d say Buttersynth, Mela 4, id700, FRMS, and either Sunrizer or Poison-202.

    And that’s leaving a lot off. Zeeon, Animoog Z, Alpha/Omega/Megalit, Electribe Wave, VAPoly, LowTone, etc. I could go on 😂 and Nambu and Laplace of course.

    Glad to see Mela on your list! It’s probably tied with BS right now for my favorite. Love the sound of Tera Pro as well but have yet to click with the Ui.

  • scrapescrape

    ID700 is my most regretted ‘not available on iPhone’ app.

  • jazzmessjazzmess

    Looking to buy this for my Mac m1. Are there sales, as the price is considerably higher than the iPad versions ?
    Thanks !

  • modoscmodosc

    @rs2000 said:
    Sorry to say that @modosc but isn't the point of oversampling getting rid of the aliasing effects? Or is oversampling only done in a certain stage of ID700?

    yes - it's only done for the fm/waveshaping stage (which is where the aliasing comes from). it does not remove 100% of the aliasing but with certain patches it can improve the sound of higher octaves.

  • modoscmodosc

    @JES000000 said:
    I haven’t yet used them at the same time but love them both, and it would be trivial to run ID700 through the 2nd LPG.

    the next synth i release will have lpgs. they didn't make sense in id700 because the original doesn't have them.

  • sevenapesevenape

    @modosc said:

    @JES000000 said:
    I haven’t yet used them at the same time but love them both, and it would be trivial to run ID700 through the 2nd LPG.

    the next synth i release will have lpgs. they didn't make sense in id700 because the original doesn't have them.

    you have my attention!!

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