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Cubasis 3 vs Cubasis 2 - Issues and Thoughts
Apologies in advance for the length of this post, and for my long absence, but I think this may be a place where these observations could be of use.
I’ve spent the last month working extensively with Cubasis 2 and 3, on my preferred platform of choice, in this case a 2018 iPad Pro, and I have some thoughts on the two iterations of Cubasis.
Some time ago I did migrate my work to Cubasis 3, but I found it somewhat unreliable and flakey, with crashes and audio glitches getting in the way of a smooth workflow. But, when I started a new project about a month ago I decided to commit to Cubasis 3, given that there had been a number of updates.
I successfully completed that project, but not without some crashes and glitches, of a different kind than before, but seemingly just as prevalent.
Another project came along shortly after, and this time I decided to revert to Cubasis 2. The ease of use and familiarity was a welcome relief, even though I was bereft of the use of important functions like groups, which I had made good use of in the previous project on Cubasis 3.
Again, that project was completed successfully, but without the many pains of Cubasis 3.
That’s the background to these thoughts.
1) Cubasis 3 has a much better audio engine. This can be heard during mixing, where Cubasis 2 begins to “mush out” when multiple tracks are blended together. The difference can be seen on a spectrum analyser in the form of visible “grain” in the release elements of grouped sounds.
2) Cubasis 3 allows for a much higher resolution of editing, which is especially useful when compiling percussion tracks. Where Cubasis 2 will force a decision about locating the hits either before or after the musical division, Cubasis 3 will allow for near sample perfect precision.
3) Cubasis 3 has several tools not available in Cubasis 2, like group tracks and a brick wall limiter.
Cubasis 3 still has many flaws that were not a problem in Cubasis 2, such as
Glitches and crashes.
4) Failure to mixdown or freeze sensibly. Rendering an effect tail seems to place a huge amount of empty space at the end of the rendered file.
5) Changes to clips are not recognised when the play button is active. I do much of my dynamic mix using the clip volume handles, and I often want to hear the effect of muting a clip as the track is playing. Neither function is recognised until playback is restarted.
6) Clip transparency. In Cubasis 2, clips which overlap can be seen fully, but in Cubasis 3 clips are opaque and can completely obscure clips on the same track. This is a huge problem for me, and the main reason I cannot easily do detailed editing work on Cubasis 3.
7) Latency. I have yet to get to the bottom of this, but I’ve never had a problem with severe latency on Cubasis 2. Cubasis 3 reports the latency values in milliseconds, but they bear no relation to what I’m hearing.
Cubasis 2 has one major flaw, which I have tested and confirmed this week, which is significant timing and synchronisation issues. During playback I often tweak the mixer or the clip handles. Doing so when running a number of audio tracks will introduce timing errors between the tracks. This can be easily heard when compiling percussion. You will adjust the mix, only to hear one of the percussion tracks drift out of sync with the rest.
The problem does not persist to the final render, but it means that making live adjustments is a pretty unpleasant experience.
Having used both applications in recent weeks I am now working on a new project, one which requires both great audio precision and the ability to edit accurately. So, my workaround is to record, arrange and edit as far as possible in Cubasis 2, and then export that project to Cubasis 3 for the final mix.
I can confirm that the increased audio quality is immediately apparent, but I’m sure further gains could be made if I was confident in recording straight to Cubasis 3. The Cubasis 2 synch issues are not apparent, but at the cost of not being able to make adjustments to clips during playback.
My conclusion is that neither versions of Cubasis are robust enough to absolutely rely upon in a professional arena, but between them you can achieve most things if you are prepared to adjust the workflow to suit.
I don’t know if the problems with Cubasis 3, which make it difficult for me to use it (clip transparency, live clip volume handles and latency) are resolvable, but I really do hope so. Thinking about the future, I’m just about ready to retreat to PC land and treat the iPad as a tool for sketching and preparation rather than finished work.
I hope you find this useful, and I’d love to hear your thoughts.
Comments
The effect trail length seems to be inconsistent. My hypothesis is that it depends on the effect(s) on the channel. For the most part, mine are reasonable. But I have had a couple instances of super long tails.
Never experienced the issue you’re reporting where parameter changes aren’t heard until playback is restarted. I frequently change parameters and plugins during playback and immediately hear the differences.
4) You can mix down between Locators to workaround the empty space at the end of the rendered file. This is a known issue - it was working fine in the past in v2 but got introduced sometime in version v2.
Timing errors with using Drum tracks was reported here - I also found it while using headphones -
https://forums.steinberg.net/t/make-producing-music-easier-100-issues-suggestions/156430
Starting a project in v2 and finishing/mastering it in v3 is what I do for now as a workaround.
Yeah, mobile music is always in a flux for any serious music production - iOS issues, AU issues, crackles, glitches, crashes, battery issues... with every update of iPadOS
Can we imagine using an iPad in live performance?
Feel free to add your issues to the above thread on Steinberg. They've already addressed some issues/enhancement suggestions like Zoom track heights and widths, persist track heights across sessions, persist zoom factor in MIDI and Automation editor, etc. from the list. Still a very long way to go.
@periurban wow it is good to see you on the forum again. I agree with your observations, except I’ve really had no real problems with CB3 after it’s made st recent update. But I’m using an Air 4 which seems to work well with everything. I think the Cubasis people could tweak that transparency issue for you if you ask them. Hang in there and I’m glad you’re ok.
@MobileMusic : Wow , my iPad bricked and I’m just now deciding between a new one or just scrapping the iOS idea and getting a proper laptop with a DAW. I’m getting the feeling iOS still is not yet ready for prime time ?
Yes I hear you. I love the messing around factor, cheap software etc but I recently went back to desktop Cubase for a project. Huge relief… much less friction. As much as I love my iPad I think I’d spring for a laptop ( M series maybe ? ) for music next time I have to update.
@ltf3 Aw NO WAY.. I’d get an HP Envy 17 or something g like that . M1 out of my price league . Or even a Roland Mv1 versalab in which case I’d just use Zenbeats.
To be clear, the ONLY parameters that don't change in real time are muting of clips and volume changes in clips.
Yes, it's been a horribly long time! I will suggest the change on the Cubasis forum.
I hear you and agree with you on pretty much everything but, I’d like to share my own experience in that, the biggest problems I’ve had have been with projects I started in 2 and finished in 3. It’s something about the transfer process - I dunno but those projects always seem to be disastrous. But also, since the last update I’ve made many projects in Cubasis 3 with hardly an issue. As long as you’re realistic about AUV3’s and you focus on the task of getting things down to real audio sensibly, it is extremely good now. For me, it’s the premier DAW on iOS. There are a few things I feel it desperately needs like mono export and tempo track but having had a certain amount of contact with Steinberg I believe in their commitment to the app. There’s more to come.
Is Cubasis 3 more stable and less glitchy now?
I use it every day now…. I have about 35 tracks in one project with audio and midi. Runs SOLID!!! For me.
Has anyone tried to record midi multible midi tracks from the drambo sequencer?
I can’t get it to work proberly.
I give each track their own midi ch but it seems like Drambo either sends on all midi ch or cubasis recieves on all midi ch.
So i arm and record on track 1 in cubasis it will record all midi comming from Drambo regardless of their midi ch.
I have been over the midi settings in both apps again and again but i can’t figure it out
Please help. This is getting frustrating.
I used to use Cubasis 2 and wondering if upgrading to 3 is worth it? I’m mainly wondering about the sound quality.
Also, is there a way to run audio from AUM into Cubasis?
I think I won’t go back this road again. I will just do my mixes live from AUM.
Thanks
I used to be able to run AUM and Cubasis 2 together but Am unable to with Cubasis 3 as it distorts all audio when both apps are open , tried tweaking the audio settings but nothing seems to work. Is anyone able to have both apps open at same time ? I’m on an 5 gen iPad Pro . Thanks in advance 🥰👍
I remember the midi editor being better. But I can’t remember why.