Single Cycle Waveforms! Does anyone have any recommendations for packs?

sevenape

Hey there, I've been getting into SCWs recently and with the new Koala update, it's more fun than ever turning a sampler into a synth! I have the adventurekid pack, it's really awesome, but I was wondering does anyone have any recommendations for good packs?

I found this one: The demos are nice, but if anyone could say if it's worth the money?

https://www.designersound.com/67-waveforms-2010

Cheers big ears!

jonmoore

My go-to commercial pack is the Galbanum architecture collection of 25,000 waveforms. It's by far the most exhaustive collection I've encountered and it comes in a wide variety of formats.

https://www.galbanum.com/products/architecturewaveforms2010

sevenape

@jonmoore said:
My go-to commercial pack is the Galbanum architecture collection of 25,000 waveforms. It's by far the most exhaustive collection I've encountered and it comes in a wide variety of formats.

https://www.galbanum.com/products/architecturewaveforms2010

Thanks! This really looks gargantuan. I think I might have to get it!

jonmoore

@sevenape said:

@jonmoore said:
My go-to commercial pack is the Galbanum architecture collection of 25,000 waveforms. It's by far the most exhaustive collection I've encountered and it comes in a wide variety of formats.

https://www.galbanum.com/products/architecturewaveforms2010

Thanks! This really looks gargantuan. I think I might have to get it!

It's definitely worth the asking price. The wavetables in Serum were created by Galbanum, so that speaks volumes ref its value.

And for maximum flexibility, it's worth buying the collection pack for $60 as you not only get the wavetables that are most useful on iOS. Each wavetable has up to 256 individual single-cycle waveforms and this is packaged as 200 wavetables. That's a far more flexible way of exploring the 25,000 waveforms. If you want to save money you can pick up the WT format alone for $25 but many synths across modular hardware, desktop plugin, and iOS apps default to using the 64bit WAV files as a default.

The $60 collection also has Absynth, Alchemy and Image Synth format files and I find that a real bonus beyond the wavetable and 64/32bit format files.

sevenape

@jonmoore said:

@sevenape said:

@jonmoore said:
My go-to commercial pack is the Galbanum architecture collection of 25,000 waveforms. It's by far the most exhaustive collection I've encountered and it comes in a wide variety of formats.

https://www.galbanum.com/products/architecturewaveforms2010

Thanks! This really looks gargantuan. I think I might have to get it!

It's definitely worth the asking price. The wavetables in Serum were created by Galbanum, so that speaks volumes ref its value.

And for maximum flexibility, it's worth buying the collection pack for $60 as you not only get the wavetables that are most useful on iOS. Each wavetable has up to 256 individual single-cycle waveforms and this is packaged as 200 wavetables. That's a far more flexible way of exploring the 25,000 waveforms. If you want to save money you can pick up the WT format alone for $25 but many synths across modular hardware, desktop plugin, and iOS apps default to using the 64bit WAV files as a default.

The $60 collection also has Absynth, Alchemy and Image Synth format files and I find that a real bonus beyond the wavetable and 64/32bit format files.

Blimey! Thanks! So yeah Im going to have to research this. Downloaded some demo waveforms will have a play around... thank you!!!

ik2000

Been mentioned in another thread, but this pack contains a few SCW designed for poly tracker, but work well in iOS as well. Free and worth a look: https://polyend.com/whats-up/michael-west-tracker-wavetables-pack/

sevenape

@ik2000 said:
Been mentioned in another thread, but this pack contains a few SCW designed for poly tracker, but work well in iOS as well. Free and worth a look: https://polyend.com/whats-up/michael-west-tracker-wavetables-pack/

Thanks very much!

colonel_mustard

I can recommend Taro Kimura's epic free wavetable pack:
https://www.kimurataro.com/free-wavetables.html

Have only kept the 2048 wavetables myself, but I'm pretty sure a full set of single-cycle waveforms was included, along with various other formats.

Like Jon, I have that Galbanum set. I went for the 64-bit ultra-hi-res overkill version some time ago, but I needn't have (not that it isn't excellent).

Also, I recommend getting comfortable with an audio editor and making your own, from your own recordings. I really like the freeware ocenaudio on Mac, but many audio editors are available.

sevenape

@colonel_mustard said:
I can recommend Taro Kimura's epic free wavetable pack:
https://www.kimurataro.com/free-wavetables.html

Have only kept the 2048 wavetables myself, but I'm pretty sure a full set of single-cycle waveforms was included, along with various other formats.

Like Jon, I have that Galbanum set. I went for the 64-bit ultra-hi-res overkill version some time ago, but I needn't have (not that it isn't excellent).

Also, I recommend getting comfortable with an audio editor and making your own, from your own recordings. I really like the freeware ocenaudio on Mac, but many audio editors are available.

Brilliant thanks, I'm really just beginning to dip my toes into this, I saw some people messing around with waveforms and digitakts on youtube and now I wanna give it a go myself in Koala.

Thank you!

jrjulius

I downloaded the Adventure Kid packs and have been having quite a bit of fun with them: https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/waveforms/

The only issue is they’re all pitched to D2 and two cents flat, so you need to adjust the base tuning. This can be a big hassle depending on your device — I loaded 100 of them into an Electribe 2 Sampler and had to bring them up by 10 semitones one-at-a-time. And the E2S (inexplicably) doesn’t support fine-tuning in the Sample Edit menu, only from the front panel. But if you’re using Koala it SHOULD be a little easier.

sevenape

@jrjulius said:
I downloaded the Adventure Kid packs and have been having quite a bit of fun with them: https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/waveforms/

The only issue is they’re all pitched to D2 and two cents flat, so you need to adjust the base tuning. This can be a big hassle depending on your device — I loaded 100 of them into an Electribe 2 Sampler and had to bring them up by 10 semitones one-at-a-time. And the E2S (inexplicably) doesn’t support fine-tuning in the Sample Edit menu, only from the front panel. But if you’re using Koala it SHOULD be a little easier.

Thanks very much! Funnily enough, I was looking at the ES2 as a hardware mess about thing. I'd really like a digitakt, but the ES2 looks like a much cheaper way to mangle samples and stuff. Can you do unsynced loops with it? Having said that Koala does so much I can't really justify it!

colonel_mustard

@sevenape said:

@colonel_mustard said:
I can recommend Taro Kimura's epic free wavetable pack:
https://www.kimurataro.com/free-wavetables.html

Have only kept the 2048 wavetables myself, but I'm pretty sure a full set of single-cycle waveforms was included, along with various other formats.

Like Jon, I have that Galbanum set. I went for the 64-bit ultra-hi-res overkill version some time ago, but I needn't have (not that it isn't excellent).

Also, I recommend getting comfortable with an audio editor and making your own, from your own recordings. I really like the freeware ocenaudio on Mac, but many audio editors are available.

Brilliant thanks, I'm really just beginning to dip my toes into this, I saw some people messing around with waveforms and digitakts on youtube and now I wanna give it a go myself in Koala.

Thank you!

Have fun

As @jrjulius says, playing in tune can be a bit tricky when using SCWs in samplers. This is because 2048 and 1024 are computer memory numbers, not musical note numbers.

To get C notes at 44.1k, you can try rejigging them to:

C0 - 2697 samples per cycle
C1 - 1348
C2 - 674
C3 - 337
C4 - 169
C5 - 84
C6 - 42
C7 - 21

It's different at 48k. I don't have the numbers to hand, but they're easy enough to work out. You just need the piano key frequencies, which are here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_key_frequencies#List

Then divide your sample rate by whatever the note frequency is. For example, C1 has a frequency of 32.70320 Hz, so I got that 1348 by dividing 44100 (samples per second) by 32.70320 (cycles per second).

jonmoore

This link details a range of resources you can use to create your own custom wavetables

https://www.subaqueousmusic.com/making-your-own-epic-custom-wavetables-in-live/

I've used all of the utilities mentioned in the post at some point in time, but the one I use on most occassions is Synthtech Waveedit. This is a glorious free app that was created to support a hardware Eurorack wavetable synthesis module, but the wavetables it creates can be used in a multitude of places, inclusive of iOS wavetable synths. The limitation of 256 single cycle waves in a single wavetable isn't a problem, as there have been very few occasions when I wanted to create larger tables.

jrjulius

@sevenape said:

@jrjulius said:
I downloaded the Adventure Kid packs and have been having quite a bit of fun with them: https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/waveforms/

The only issue is they’re all pitched to D2 and two cents flat, so you need to adjust the base tuning. This can be a big hassle depending on your device — I loaded 100 of them into an Electribe 2 Sampler and had to bring them up by 10 semitones one-at-a-time. And the E2S (inexplicably) doesn’t support fine-tuning in the Sample Edit menu, only from the front panel. But if you’re using Koala it SHOULD be a little easier.

Thanks very much! Funnily enough, I was looking at the ES2 as a hardware mess about thing. I'd really like a digitakt, but the ES2 looks like a much cheaper way to mangle samples and stuff. Can you do unsynced loops with it? Having said that Koala does so much I can't really justify it!

Electribe doesn’t do unsynced loops, unfortunately. Actually, looping is probably the biggest disappointment on the E2S — loop points are meant to create a sustain phase on pitched samples and aren’t very useful for anything else. You have to set the loop point in the Sample Edit menu and, once set, it overrides the Start knob. It’s very disappointing compared to the Volca Sample, Digitakt, etc. where the start, length, and loop controls all interact to give you creative surprises. However, IMO the Electribe’s synth engines, off-the-wall effects, Kaoss Pad, chord triggers, and groove templates help it overcome a ho-hum sequencer and a few poorly-thought-out features. They’re also VERY affordable used (and sometimes new — I caught a pricing error on Amazon and got mine new for under $400 CAD). My current setup is OP-Z for sequencing; Electribe for live-play and hands-on jamming; Beatmaker 3 or AUM for recording. Still haven’t spent time getting the E2S and OP-Z playing nice together but I think that’ll be today’s project.

In general, the Digitakt is going to be worth the extra money for most people. It’s very thoughtfully designed and offers an extremely polished, rewarding workflow. I sold my Digitakt last week but my circumstances are specific:

1) My OP-Z developed severe double-triggering issues last year. I picked up the E2S on deep discount and loved the sounds on offer, but the sequencer was a letdown so I decided to sell it and buy a Digitakt. I saved up enough money before finding a buyer for the E2S, and since they only sell for a couple hundred bucks used, I just decided to keep it as a synth module. Then about six weeks ago I fixed the OP-Z keys with Deoxit D5. The OP-Z’s sequencing capabilities are more varied (key-aware polyphonic variation, three levels of conditional triggering, etc.) and I found myself reaching for it before the DT.
2) I transferred ~600 MB of samples onto the +Drive but never actually loaded more than a few MB at a time into RAM. Listening back to my projects, I tended to use the same handful of samples over and over. This meant that the 24 MB limit on the E2S and OP-Z weren’t actually holding me back. Also, I got a little bit sick of sampling chords for the DT when my other devices had polyphony.
3) I thought Overbridge was going to revolutionize my workflow but after initial setup I never actually used it. I only ever recorded stereo audio into AUM, which I can do with the OP-Z.
4) Both the OP-Z and Electribe have battery options. I have a newborn at home so I’m not able to spend much time at my desk; I do most of my music-making on the couch while my wife watches Doctor Who and the baby naps. I considered ordering a MyVolts Ripcord for the DT but I already had two battery-powered grooveboxes and an iPad.
5) The Digitakt retains like 90% of its value on the used market, so I was sitting on close to a grand worth of largely-redundant gear. It felt silly.

Sorry for the long explanation but this has been on my mind for a few weeks now. Basically, I have NOTHING bad to say about the Digitakt except it didn’t quite fit my life right now. The E2S and OP-Z each have a lot of trade-offs but jive better with me. Happy to answer any questions you may have!

sevenape

@jrjulius said:

@sevenape said:

@jrjulius said:
I downloaded the Adventure Kid packs and have been having quite a bit of fun with them: https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/waveforms/

The only issue is they’re all pitched to D2 and two cents flat, so you need to adjust the base tuning. This can be a big hassle depending on your device — I loaded 100 of them into an Electribe 2 Sampler and had to bring them up by 10 semitones one-at-a-time. And the E2S (inexplicably) doesn’t support fine-tuning in the Sample Edit menu, only from the front panel. But if you’re using Koala it SHOULD be a little easier.

Thanks very much! Funnily enough, I was looking at the ES2 as a hardware mess about thing. I'd really like a digitakt, but the ES2 looks like a much cheaper way to mangle samples and stuff. Can you do unsynced loops with it? Having said that Koala does so much I can't really justify it!

Electribe doesn’t do unsynced loops, unfortunately. Actually, looping is probably the biggest disappointment on the E2S — loop points are meant to create a sustain phase on pitched samples and aren’t very useful for anything else. You have to set the loop point in the Sample Edit menu and, once set, it overrides the Start knob. It’s very disappointing compared to the Volca Sample, Digitakt, etc. where the start, length, and loop controls all interact to give you creative surprises. However, IMO the Electribe’s synth engines, off-the-wall effects, Kaoss Pad, chord triggers, and groove templates help it overcome a ho-hum sequencer and a few poorly-thought-out features. They’re also VERY affordable used (and sometimes new — I caught a pricing error on Amazon and got mine new for under $400 CAD). My current setup is OP-Z for sequencing; Electribe for live-play and hands-on jamming; Beatmaker 3 or AUM for recording. Still haven’t spent time getting the E2S and OP-Z playing nice together but I think that’ll be today’s project.

In general, the Digitakt is going to be worth the extra money for most people. It’s very thoughtfully designed and offers an extremely polished, rewarding workflow. I sold my Digitakt last week but my circumstances are specific:

1) My OP-Z developed severe double-triggering issues last year. I picked up the E2S on deep discount and loved the sounds on offer, but the sequencer was a letdown so I decided to sell it and buy a Digitakt. I saved up enough money before finding a buyer for the E2S, and since they only sell for a couple hundred bucks used, I just decided to keep it as a synth module. Then about six weeks ago I fixed the OP-Z keys with Deoxit D5. The OP-Z’s sequencing capabilities are more varied (key-aware polyphonic variation, three levels of conditional triggering, etc.) and I found myself reaching for it before the DT.
2) I transferred ~600 MB of samples onto the +Drive but never actually loaded more than a few MB at a time into RAM. Listening back to my projects, I tended to use the same handful of samples over and over. This meant that the 24 MB limit on the E2S and OP-Z weren’t actually holding me back. Also, I got a little bit sick of sampling chords for the DT when my other devices had polyphony.
3) I thought Overbridge was going to revolutionize my workflow but after initial setup I never actually used it. I only ever recorded stereo audio into AUM, which I can do with the OP-Z.
4) Both the OP-Z and Electribe have battery options. I have a newborn at home so I’m not able to spend much time at my desk; I do most of my music-making on the couch while my wife watches Doctor Who and the baby naps. I considered ordering a MyVolts Ripcord for the DT but I already had two battery-powered grooveboxes and an iPad.
5) The Digitakt retains like 90% of its value on the used market, so I was sitting on close to a grand worth of largely-redundant gear. It felt silly.

Sorry for the long explanation but this has been on my mind for a few weeks now. Basically, I have NOTHING bad to say about the Digitakt except it didn’t quite fit my life right now. The E2S and OP-Z each have a lot of trade-offs but jive better with me. Happy to answer any questions you may have!

Thanks for all the info! That's a shame about the ES2, as What I'm looking for (I think!) is something that could do tape-style loops but digitally. The Digitakt seems able to do that plus lots of interesting modulation and sequencing? The main thing that doesn't really jive with me is the fact that Digitakt is deskbound as you say, I also have kids ( 9 and 5) and I'm sorry to say most of my music stuff is done on the sofa too! I've heard a lot of good things about the OPZ but the crazy interface is scary to me! I've also looked a bit at the Circuit rhythm and the blackbox.

Honestly though I think the iPad is probably best, it's not very hands on, knob twiddly, but It can do everything I want already. And much more. Having said that, if the battery packs on the Model Samples hadn't been recalled, I might have considered one of those!

sevenape

@colonel_mustard said:

@sevenape said:

@colonel_mustard said:
I can recommend Taro Kimura's epic free wavetable pack:
https://www.kimurataro.com/free-wavetables.html

Have only kept the 2048 wavetables myself, but I'm pretty sure a full set of single-cycle waveforms was included, along with various other formats.

Like Jon, I have that Galbanum set. I went for the 64-bit ultra-hi-res overkill version some time ago, but I needn't have (not that it isn't excellent).

Also, I recommend getting comfortable with an audio editor and making your own, from your own recordings. I really like the freeware ocenaudio on Mac, but many audio editors are available.

Brilliant thanks, I'm really just beginning to dip my toes into this, I saw some people messing around with waveforms and digitakts on youtube and now I wanna give it a go myself in Koala.

Thank you!

Have fun

As @jrjulius says, playing in tune can be a bit tricky when using SCWs in samplers. This is because 2048 and 1024 are computer memory numbers, not musical note numbers.

To get C notes at 44.1k, you can try rejigging them to:

C0 - 2697 samples per cycle
C1 - 1348
C2 - 674
C3 - 337
C4 - 169
C5 - 84
C6 - 42
C7 - 21

It's different at 48k. I don't have the numbers to hand, but they're easy enough to work out. You just need the piano key frequencies, which are here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_key_frequencies#List

Then divide your sample rate by whatever the note frequency is. For example, C1 has a frequency of 32.70320 Hz, so I got that 1348 by dividing 44100 (samples per second) by 32.70320 (cycles per second).

Thanks for this!!

sevenape

@jonmoore said:
This link details a range of resources you can use to create your own custom wavetables

https://www.subaqueousmusic.com/making-your-own-epic-custom-wavetables-in-live/

I've used all of the utilities mentioned in the post at some point in time, but the one I use on most occassions is Synthtech Waveedit. This is a glorious free app that was created to support a hardware Eurorack wavetable synthesis module, but the wavetables it creates can be used in a multitude of places, inclusive of iOS wavetable synths. The limitation of 256 single cycle waves in a single wavetable isn't a problem, as there have been very few occasions when I wanted to create larger tables.

Thanks!!

StudioES

More Freebies:
Dean has some here (plus a lot more freebies): https://www.electronisounds.com/freedownloads
Elektron has some from the OSCar here : https://www.elektron.se/soundpacks/oxford-overdrive/
Elektron has some from the Moog Model D here: https://www.elektron.se/soundpacks/immortal-waves/
ToyBox has some for the Model:Samples here (scroll down): https://www.toyboxaudio.com/
WaveEdit (Synthesis Technology) has a bunch here: https://waveeditonline.com/

Plus if you have Arturia Analog Lab or CMI Fairlight, Cakewalk Dimension Pro or Rapture or z3ta+, or Waves Codex desktop plugins, search through their folders for lots of SCWs.

michael_m

@jonmoore said:
My go-to commercial pack is the Galbanum architecture collection of 25,000 waveforms. It's by far the most exhaustive collection I've encountered and it comes in a wide variety of formats.

https://www.galbanum.com/products/architecturewaveforms2010

Ditto - definitely worth the price for this collection.

Poppadocrock

@jrjulius said:
I downloaded the Adventure Kid packs and have been having quite a bit of fun with them: https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/waveforms/

The only issue is they’re all pitched to D2 and two cents flat, so you need to adjust the base tuning. This can be a big hassle depending on your device — I loaded 100 of them into an Electribe 2 Sampler and had to bring them up by 10 semitones one-at-a-time. And the E2S (inexplicably) doesn’t support fine-tuning in the Sample Edit menu, only from the front panel. But if you’re using Koala it SHOULD be a little easier.

This is the motherload right here from adventure kid. So so many and categorized in several ways. Great free pack.

I did not know they were all tuned to D2 & - 2 cents thanks for that info.

StudioES

Those Galbanum Architecture Waveforms are amazing.

Here's a noisy non-musical experiment with them in 2 instances of Audio Damage Quanta, with one dry, the other with Alteza. Both driven by Rozeta Collider.

sevenape

@ocelot said:
More Freebies:
Dean has some here (plus a lot more freebies): https://www.electronisounds.com/freedownloads
Elektron has some from the OSCar here : https://www.elektron.se/soundpacks/oxford-overdrive/
Elektron has some from the Moog Model D here: https://www.elektron.se/soundpacks/immortal-waves/
ToyBox has some for the Model:Samples here (scroll down): https://www.toyboxaudio.com/
WaveEdit (Synthesis Technology) has a bunch here: https://waveeditonline.com/

Plus if you have Arturia Analog Lab or CMI Fairlight, Cakewalk Dimension Pro or Rapture or z3ta+, or Waves Codex desktop plugins, search through their folders for lots of SCWs.

Brilliant thank you 🙏

sevenape

@ocelot said:
Those Galbanum Architecture Waveforms are amazing.

Here's a noisy non-musical experiment with them in 2 instances of Audio Damage Quanta, with one dry, the other with Alteza. Both driven by Rozeta Collider.

Oh wow love it!!!

Simon

@colonel_mustard said:
Also, I recommend getting comfortable with an audio editor and making your own, from your own recordings. I really like the freeware ocenaudio on Mac, but many audio editors are available.

Didn't know about Ocenaudio for Mac. Thanks for posting the link.

colonel_mustard

@Simon said:

@colonel_mustard said:
Also, I recommend getting comfortable with an audio editor and making your own, from your own recordings. I really like the freeware ocenaudio on Mac, but many audio editors are available.

Didn't know about Ocenaudio for Mac. Thanks for posting the link.

Yeah, it's a good one. Windows and Linux versions too. Not iOS, but I'm at least 10x faster with a mouse and keyboard for that kind of stuff. Enjoy.

StudioES

Amit's new web-based SCW Pitch Finder:
https://midi.amitszone.com/PITCHFINDER/

StudioES

Did Ocenaudio ever get sample-loop support? That can be helpful when working with SCWs.

Here's another free one: https://www.bjoernbojahr.de/endlesswav.html

colonel_mustard

@ocelot said:
Did Ocenaudio ever get sample-loop support?

Making loops takes 2 steps.

1. "Create region"
2. "Convert region to loop".

Needlessly convoluted, perhaps, but it is there.

StudioES

@colonel_mustard said:

@ocelot said:
Did Ocenaudio ever get sample-loop support?

Making loops takes 2 steps.

1. "Create region"
2. "Convert region to loop".

Needlessly convoluted, perhaps, but it is there.

Thanks! Good to know. Does it write the loop info into the file's metadata?

colonel_mustard

@ocelot said:

@colonel_mustard said:

@ocelot said:
Did Ocenaudio ever get sample-loop support?

Making loops takes 2 steps.

1. "Create region"
2. "Convert region to loop".

Needlessly convoluted, perhaps, but it is there.

Thanks! Good to know. Does it write the loop info into the file's metadata?

Yes

I've used ocenaudio to bake in thousands of loop points, for use with Obsidian, SunVox, TAL-Sampler, Reason's NNXT etc. I find it's really quick to work with when you get going. Hopefully Drambo's sampler will be updated to read loop points at some point.

dendy

there is one thing, which most people aren't getting properly, when we are discussiong about so called single cycle waveforms..

very often, especially with analog synths, just plain single cycle is not enough for preserving whole oscillator character becuse of subtle changes in oscillator sound during note is played.. subtle movements in sounds, which may sooind minuscule, but with crucial impact after additional modulation and filtering is applied ...

that's why i always use as "single cycle" waveforms not really single cycle, but more like from 10 to even 100 cycles, of course properly looped