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iOS/hardware DAWless hybrid midi 5Pin din/USB setup?
I am trying to set up my studio (again)
I like to jam and play without having to go through my interface/computer studio monitors etc. when writing.
I picked up a 16 channel mixer used and plugged that into some powered PA speakers. I run 9 hardware synths
- Yamaha V2 (DX11)
- Roland System 8
- Korg TR
- Behringer Pro 1
- Roland SE-02
- Behringer TD3
- Behringer MS-1
- Behringer Odyssey
- Behringer Deep Mind 12D
Then I also have a Yamaha RX11 drum machine and a Roland TR 8 drum machine both just stereo
Finally I have a 2017 12.9 iPad Pro with a stereo line out of the headphone jack running mostly
Poison-202, unique, iM1, and NanoStudio 2 for obsidian synth and the powerful sequencer. Sometimes AUM
I also use a Yamaha QX3 hardware sequencer
I am attempting to control everything from an M Audio Oxygen Pro61 controller that I just got (before, I was running from keyboard to keyboard using multiple controllers, 1 for each module)
Most of my gear has usb midi, some does not
I have a 10 port powered usb hub that I was using with the iPad as the main sequencer and additional synths.
I just got a Roland A-880 midi patch bay
I have two m audio UNO 5 pin DIN to USB midi adapters that I used to run the drum machines from the hub sequenced by the iPad but that was a real pain because the Roland drums do not match the midi notes for drums in nano studio 2
My question is has anyone done a set up with old/new gear iPad and hardware sequencers and synths?
Can I run both USB and DIN midi?
I have this wacky idea…I keep all the usb midi gear and iPad plugged into the usb hub which is powered by a power block plugged into an outlet. (The iPad is just in one of the USB ports like all the other gear)
I plug a usb to Midi DIN adapter into one of the USB ports and then the DIN into an input and output on the Roland A-880 midi patch bay.
Then the QX3 sequencer, drum machines, older synths and the new Oxygen pro61 all get plugged into the Roland Midi patchbay
I would then; In theory, control all the synths and iPad from the Oxygen. Be able to program the drum machines themselves and have them triggered by the QX3 sequencer or the iPad as well as the QX3 sequencing some synths, while I play live on the controller and trigger sequences on the iPad from the pads on the controller.
I could then, write riffs on different synths via the controller and record these as sequences into the QX3 and or Ipad NanoStudio2 ?
Is all this possible or am I dreaming.
I just want to be that mad musician thrashing out synthonic songs with all the stuffs all the time!
Comments
Most of that was too much for me to visualize. However, I think where the plan falls to the ground is right here. I think the iPad has to be connected to the hub uplink port in order to work. I don't think you can just plug it into one of the other USB ports and have the MIDI get routed anywhere.
If I'm wrong and the iPad can work in a non-uplink port, what would the uplink port be plugged into? It has to be plugged into something that can do the routing. Hubs don't route between ports, only to the uplink port.
Hmmmm, I am using the “Uplink” port as the “power port” it is plugged into a power charger block then to an outlet to power the hub
I don't think you're going to be able to route MIDI between devices plugged into that hub then.
I have various hardware synths, I bought an ESI M4UeX MIDI interface to work with them - any class compliant MIDI interface should work, the benefits of this one are 8 ports which can either be in or out (I use more as out) and a built in powered USB3 hub, so I can use just a CCK, this and an audio interface, but also a couple more USB-MIDI devices if wanted.
You said it was a "powered" hub. That means it has a separate power connection, independent of the USB port. The one I use has a power brick that connects through one of those round connectors that used to be very common. If the hub does not have a separate power connection, it is not a powered hub.
Anyway, a USB hub is not like an Ethernet hub, with a bunch of equal participants. The uplink port must be connected to a computer, which is the USB master. The USB-A ports are for the slaves. The slaves talk only to the master, and the master talks to them. Any port-to-port routing must be done by the computer, using AUM, or maybe MidiFire.
And an iPad, using the Camera Adapter, is configured to be a USB master. It will not work in a slave port. That would require a USB-A to USB-A cable, which is very non-standard. All normal USB cables have different connectors on each end, to prevent you breaking these rules.
Seems like I would need the 16 port version, just my drum machines and sequencer would eat up 6 ports
Some hubs have a special kind of connector that can act as a host uplink and also supply power if the device it's connected to supports it. I have one. I don't know what the type of cable is called though.
Thank you this is correct and I am such a Dumb A$$! I just ran out to the studio and I had indeed plugged two yes 2! Power supplies into my usb hub…I hope I did not do any damage.
There is a dedicated power supply input on the side!
I had plugged a charger block in the the USB master, it was late I was tired I am an idiot.
But…I was thinking as I just looked at it…
I could, with a CCK3, plug the iPad into the Roland A-880 midi patchbay using the 5 pin din to USB adapter. I just need a way to go from the Midi Patchbay to the usb hub.
I do have an M-Audio Midi sport 2x2 usb interface but I don’t think that will help me.
https://m-audio.com/products/view/midisport-2x2-anniversary-edition
I an just trying to use the gear I have already purchased
If there's only one iPad, it should be connected to the USB hub via CCK. All the USB gear connects to the hub. You can connect the USB/5-pin converter (not just an adapter, there's a li'l computer in there) to the hub and the iPad will see it along with everything else. If you want more 5-pin to USB flexibility, there are specific interfaces for that, and they'll present multiple MIDI In and Out ports to the iPad. I checked your M-Audio, and it's one of those. It goes into the hub with the others. Remember, all your routing (except will be handled by the iPad, so it will be the center of everything.
I am trying to make the Oxygen Pro 61 Controller the center of everything with the Yamaha QX3 as my main sequencer even to the usb synths, but I guess I will have to run 5 pin Din to them all and only use the Ipad as a synth module that I play live until I get a different usb/midi interface
Luckily i am done buying hardware synths and drum machines for awhile
Sell all your midi boxes, buy a mio xl, set it up once with your computer, then you can use it with your iPad and all your gear. The ipad an act as the host machine for the mio and send/receive to every device, plus every device can talk to each other in a myriad of way. I’d be happy to tell you more and help you set it up if you go that route.
I am trying to get away from the computer!
That is why I bought a Yamaha QX3 Sequencer, An RX11 drum Machine and the Roland A-880 Midi patch bay. I want to jam and compose without a computer and i may only use the ipad for the IOS Synths as a sound module. The computer will only be for final recordings
I'm sure not a good solution for you, but for pure geekiness I gotta say that I think this also would work: https://wiki.audiob.us/doku.php?id=diy_bluetooth_midi_bridge
Everything but the iPad would be plugged into that device. The iPad would connect via Bluetooth. Everything would be able to talk to everything else, with the device acting as the router.
I'm not recommending it though. It's more for nerds like me than for practical use.
Well that is interesting! You wouldn’t happen to have one would you
I don’t see any way to hook up the 5 Pin DIN midi gear with that
You’d need to use Midi-DIN to USB cables.
One thing about a setup where everything can talk to everything else is you have to be very careful about midi channel management, midi through, and preventing loops.
I can make you one of those boxes. Regular price $500, but only $499.95 with your special Audiobus Forum discount.
I am figuring out some things, if I stick with 5 Pin DIN I can have the M Audio Oxygen Pro as the master keyboard on midi out Channel 1 and all the other synths on Channel 1 midi in. I can just select the midi ports that are on or off Via the Roland A-880 midi patch bay.
This way I can play one synth at a time or multiples together. I can even “record” midi to the Yamaha QX3 sequencer this way.
The problem comes in when I want to play different sequences on different synths at the same time and play along live as well as syncing the drum machine
I can use the ipad as a sound module only not a sequencer
He just said you need to set it up with the computer. That would be a one-time step to store the configuration on the device. You would not need the computer again, ever.
Right. You only need it to set up your routing. Afterwards, it works totally without a computer unless you need to change routing. I don't use my computer for jamming, either. This is the easiest that fits most of your requirements.
@ralis With so many HW synths, I'd also consider using Bluetooth MIDI dongles.
Maybe connect them to the synths with the lowest latency?
You can connect to more than one simultaneously with your iPad and that would take some load off the MIDI stream to non-USB-MIDI synths - If you're using only one USB MIDI interface to the A-880 then it will sure become a bottleneck at some point, introducing more latency than BT MIDI would add.
That MIOXL sounds very impressive. I guess you can route any MIDI stream (5-pin or USB) to any other, without involving iPad or computer. And you can create up to 32 different presets with different configurations. And of course, you can include the iPad if desired. Pretty amazing.
Setting it up was a bitch, but now it’s flawless and rock solid. I have so many things talking to so many other things all at once.
Thinking about the retrokits rk06 to get everything connected
AH! I thought I had to use the computer all the time with this. I am going to check it out now. Thank you
Nope. The computer let's you set everything up. You can store multiple presets and routings on it for standalone use. You can also do some basic midi filtering. Feel free to message me if you have questions. It's def one of the most useful things I have.
Also, have a look at the MRCC from Conductive Labs..
https://conductivelabs.com/
interesting unit