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Generative sequencers in 2022. Can anything do odd time signatures yet?
Or even 3/4!?!
So I've been mainly a Cubasis guy for the past several years (and Reason on the PC) with only occasional dips into generative stuff - unless you count Band-in-a-Box which I've used extensively.
But I've just recently picked up Ooda which so far is pretty cool but still hangs notes in Cubasis. So I (finally) picked up AUM and I'm diving down the rabbit hole... trying to learn Rozeta, seeing what else is out there, etc.
I'm doing a lot of searching and YouTube walkthroughs and I'm seeing a lot of cool apps (Polyphase, Euclidean, etc.) But so far I'm not finding anything that explicitly handles anything other than 4/4 (or multiples or divisions of that). Really?
How does one program a simple waltz with these things? I gotta be missing something simple. Right?
Comments
I think Cykle would be right up your alley. It's a bit semi generative rather than fully, but you can program it to do any time signature you desire in a sense.
Maybe not specifically what you’re asking for but would like to recommend checking out Poly 2 as an amazingly cool generative tool for polyrhythmic phrases: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/poly-2/id1477029326
Ioniarics - again semi generative - can do all kinds of weird timings and polyrhythms and gets results super quickly
"Weird timings", "polyrhythms". Dammit Gav, now I'm out seven quid. 🤣
😂 Lemme know how u like it. My spoken tutorial goes through the functions a lot better than the official pagefall tutorial which is seriously mumbly and poorly explained
I'll give it a watch! 😃 Your videos are always tops mate.
I will definitely look into Cykle and Ioniarics. Gav's video got me to jump on Ooda. I'm holding off on Polyphase for the time being.
Euclidean Sequencer by 4 Pockets, I think it’s still on sale too…
Ionarics, drambo, cykle, Rozeta has 1 or two that would work.
Yea, I took awhile to pick this one up because several videos I watched looked great but the results didn’t always sound as good as I expected. I saw @Gavinski video, talked to a few people and decided to grab it a few months ago. Glad I did since it’s unique. Sometimes takes a little fiddling to get something you like but that’s part of the fun I think…
Euclidean has 3 different sequencer play features too. I think all of the 4Pockets apps, at least those with sequencers, Strummer, Digikeys, Digistix 1/2, etc… have a detailed randomize feature for quick inspiration.
See I'm finding most of Rozeta doesn't work. For example, Cells seemed like the obvious choice but "bar" is always 4 beats even if AUM's transport says otherwise. I can get Rhythm to do a 3/4 beat, e.g. set all the lanes to 12 steps. Actually that's probably less important than just using the Loop Sync button. But not all the Rozeta apps have a loop sync.
Drambo is another one I've been avoiding because it's so deep and I have so many other irons in the fire. :-)
As expected, I learned a LOT from watching your video about Ioniarics. What an amazing sequencer! I'll definitely use that in my next mad music science experiment.
Does euclidean have an “arp mode” like ioniarics?
Whoa, that’s the best UI from 4Pockets that I’ve seen! When I hear 4Pockets I see 90s era components skeuomorphism and an analog VU meter.
I have found that combining the output of Ioniarics with its input makes the weirdness fit better. So for example, run the output of ZOA or Fugue Machine into Ioniarics, and also into the synth that Ioniarics is feeding.
I made these in Drambo a while back @jimhanks using the Euclidean module:
Atom 2 the piano roll recorder and sequencer can be set to do any time signature. Not generative but a good way to capture odd times properly.
Good idea will definitely try this. Thanks.
I’m not sure it’s called an Arp mode but you can send midi in and have it respond to the chord you are playing. There’s also a basic piano roll below that that adds tons of possibilities.
Yea GUI is one of their best yet, just the 4 lane circle sequencer moving around looks cool. Watch the recent videos from Paul the Musicman youtube, there’s been several updates each adding some really cool features. He does a quick video each time.
Cool stuff!
Look for generative apps let you choose the number of steps in the loop.
For 3/4 music you want 12,9 or 6 steps. AUM is best for this and just treat AUM’s transport as an arbitrary pulse and not 4/4,etc. using another app as the metronome helps to skip that “Beep on one”.
I like to use Mozaic and control the number of notes in the loop and the pulses per quarter note PPQN.
Then you can lay polyrhythms out in any time signature using number that align on a precise One:
3x3 = 9 loop
Over
3x2 = 6 loop
Then you dial in the PPQN for 3 over 2. Adding swing to the 2 rhythm helps produce something less mechanical.
I think polybeat has this feature and you can run multiple instances. Make audio recordings in an app like loopy pro and build larger compositions. LK can do this with MIDI segments vs audio.
You just need to buy the MIDi Matrix IAP. There might be a piano roll IAP to make the midi sequences in specific timings too.
Yeah it's great! I used it in my latest vid on the new Mixbox reverbs to do the baseline and Rhodes parts (dor baseline i just pitched down with Rozeta Scaler and used midiGATEs to thin out the notes, provide some variety
Yeah that's a good idea, and something that i have done using it with Scaler 2 recently, but should do more. Especially if you use midiGATEs and Rozeta Scaler with it, you could pitch it up or down and come up with some nice added textures to the main, more predictable, input
Also search the Drambo section on Patchstorage.com for "polyr" and "polym".
Looks like a popular subject with a number of creations ready to load 😊
Thanks for the suggestions, folks. I ended up grabbing a bunch of apps. I wasn't grokking Ioniarics or Cykle for this project, but ended up using Polybeat, Euclidean, and Ooda (yep, even though it only does 4/4). This isn't a complete track but will form the bed for a full track later.
Definitely trying this cheers.
@jimhanks
great that you managed the result you wanted
Love the walkthrough of your process
If i'm enjoying it so much as it is, can't wait for the final track
Thanks. After I posted this, I started moving the tracks over to Reason to add uke, bass, and flutes and realized I messed up the chord progression. It was supposed to be Ebmaj7 to F#maj7, not F# minor7. Oops 😬 So the final track will sound slightly different. I'm hoping for a Christmas release of an album of tracks largely constructed with similar techniques.
just gonna mention that it’s not all plain sailing in IOS land for odd time signatures EVEN once you’ve found your
generative sequencer :
AUM may seem flexible with its integers but the denominator is stuck at /4 which can ruin bar counts & sync .
( I mentioned this in AUM update thread but @j_liljedahl seemed to overlook my comment , & someone recommended I join Discord channel to vote on this upgrade but Discord want my phone 4 verification to join which is a no-go , so here I am taking advantage of this thread to try again here )
Loopy Pro didn’t go very high with integers when I checked out the week long demo ,
( I need 13/16 @Michael , haven’t sent you song as proof yet as you asked in a previous thread ,but it’s true )
Ableton Link can also be problematic as it assumes 4/4 & not all hosts seem to be able to overide this -
MidiLinkSync app seems best to specify number of beats per bar .
Furthermore I’ll also mention issue of plugin synced time divisions -
I’ve only recently realised that whilst desktop Ableton allows different time signatures for its audio/midi clip length counts - its max4live (& maybe native?) devices still only count in 4 ,
so an LFO synced to 1 bar just counts 4 beats for that bar & resets ! EVEN when the global clock is set to e.g 5/4 & should reset after 5 beats .
I am now reviewing how all my plugins (desktop & IOS ) behave with odd time signatures -
when sync is set to 1 bar does it count 5 beats for 5/4 time ?
I need to start writing results down as my memory is going , but I remember being disappointed with SugarBytes for a start.. don’t quote me , or maybe everyone check for themselves , or maybe we compile a database here , ..
but there are still issues when trying to break free from 4/4 - even with software devs who try to be innovative & groundbreaking ! /rant
edited for clarity
Analogous problems with tuning. Why does everyone use 12et for music that never modulates?