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Possible bug with hardware controllers in Logic
Can someone else try this to see if they are getting the same behavior? I’m curious if this is a bug, or user error.
- Create a track with an auv3 instrument in Logic.
- Map a knob in a hardware controller to a parameter (eg filter cutoff). Then tweak the controller to ensure that the synth is responding appropriately in Logic.
- Add either a sequencer or software controller as a midi effect.
- Now try the knob you mapped to the synth. Is it still responding appropriately?
For me, I am unable to use both hardware and midi fx at the same time in Logic. So far every combo of these two I’ve tried has resulted in the synth failing to recognize the hardware signals, after the midi effect is engaged.
Comments
What happens when you long tapping the MIDI FX tile and choose "record MIDI from here"?
I have the same error when I mark “record midi from here”. To answer your earlier question, a setup I’m testing right now is Akai mpd 218 as hardware. Model D is the synth, with cutoff frequency mapped to cc12. Fugue machine in the midi fx slot.
If I have the sequence running on fugue machine, model D does not respond to cc12 messages from the hardware. If I long press on fugue machine, and select “off”, then model D cutoff immediately begins responding to the cc12 messages from the hardware controller.
I’ve had the same behavior with 2 other hardware controllers.
Sounds like Logic routes midi serially through the plugins. That is, fugue machine or whatever other MIDI plugin you're using would need to support "MIDI through" to pass the messages from your controller. As far as I can see there isn't such a setting for fugue machine. This is probably not a bug per se, but I don't know of a way to route midi inputs in parallel like you can do in AUM. I think this is the sort of thing you'd need to wire up in the MIDI "environment" in desktop Logic.
Try using the script you can’t download in this thread:
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/comment/1216303#Comment_1216303
It lets you map cc directly to plugin parameters in any plugins in the channel and it passes the midi through. Probably best to put it in the first midifx slot.
Might work whilst you wait for a fix.
Where it might not work is if the midi doesn’t get recorded otherwise you’ll not be able to automate it. So it might not work depending on what the midi fx after it are doing.
In other words I’d you map say CC12 to filter cutoff and you record into the track, Logic will record cc12 not the plugin parameter. If something is clicking the cc it probably won’t work.
Worth a try?
To get to the bottom of it use a midi monitor to see what’s happening to the midi data and turn the ‘offending’ plugin in and off to see if it is indeed the culprit.
Thanks, this sounds like a possible explanation. I just assumed since Logic is supposed to be the best DAW to come to iOS, it will be able to handle something basic like this. Cubasis, Loopy Pro and AUM all work flawlessly with this setup.
Yeah, Loopy Pro and AUM are nicely designed for one-to-many or many-to-one MIDI routing, and Cubasis has the little "MIDI Thru" button. Hopefully Logic does something similar to Cubasis in a future release but I don't see such a setting anywhere right now, so until/unless they do it'd be up to the individual plugins to handle it. MIDI routing is definitely one of the areas where Logic falls behind the competition.
Thanks. I’m a bit of a midi dummie, but I’ll give it a try
It would need to record everything to the track with the midi for this setup to be worth using Logic. My use case is with SWAM instruments, and I’m controlling between 3-6 instrument parameters in real time (depending on the song), while recording MPE data as well. So using automation to recreate a performance would be a nightmare.
Thank you for this explanation. I guess I was using midi thru in Cubasis without realizing it.
Ok, now I’m very confused. I just checked my latest Cubasis project, in which I use midi fx and a hardware controller in tandem to control SWAM instrument parameters. I do not have midi thru selected, and the setup still works well. Selecting and deselecting midi thru in Cubasis makes no difference on whether the auv3 instrument can respond to both a midi effect and a hardware controller at the same time. @mjm1138 can you make sense of this? Is midi thru only for software effect chains, and hardware acts on the instrument through a separate path?
In Cubasis I just set up a MIDI instrument track and inserted Fugue Machine as a MIDI effect, and plugged in my hardware controller (Arturia Minilab 3). With Fugue Machine active I get no signal from the hardware controller to the software instrument unless I select "MIDI Thru". So I'm seeing different behavior than what you describe. Did you test this with a different MIDI plugin? Some MIDI effect plugins will implement "MIDI thru" independent of the DAW (like an arpeggiator for example).
Yes, that was a different set up in the project I checked. I was using Velocity Keyboard (software midi controller) in the midi effect slot, and a breath controller as hardware, both controlling SWAM cello.
This set up does not work in Logic, however. So still a problem there.
I don't have Velocity Keyboard so I don't have any insight there. Might there be a "thru" setting in the plugin?
Just had a look through settings, and I don’t see anything like that.
I just thought of something.> @mjm1138 said:
@mjm1138 would you mind testing out Fugue Machine + Aturia Minilab 3 in Logic, but using Fugue machine as a virtual midi in port in Logic, as opposed to a midi effect?
I just realized that this may be a work around for my Velocity Keyboard/SWAM/breath controller combo to work in Logic. I would love to know if Logic responds to midi messages from both a virtual midi in port, and a hardware controller at the same time, but my free trial ran out a few days ago, and I would rather not pay for a month’s subscription just to see if this works.
Yes! Running Fugue Machine standalone, I'm able to send signals from Fugue Machine and my Minilab 3 to an instrument track in Logic simultaneously.
Wonderful! Thank you so much! Can you record the midi to the track?
I'll have to check that later but I'm sure I can; I know I can from the Minilab and at this point the Minilab and Fugue Machine are kind of equivalent devices from a MIDI input perspective. BTW Ableton Link between Fugue Machine and Logic works fine; the one gotcha is that I had to go into settings and set up the playheads to send to the MIDI output within Fugue Machine. It showed up as an input in Logic without any intervention, as does the Minilab.
@mjm1138 Sounds promising enough to grab Logic for another month to test out this set up. Thanks again for checking this!