How can I produce like Jean-Michel Jarre's ambient style?

jwmmakerofmusic

For those of you who suffered through this long dissertation in order to get to the question in the title, I salute you! 🫡 For those who just wish to get to my questions, scroll past to the last section below.

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Okay, so I'm still working on my Justice-styled EP "Music For Frens", but now I'm curious to learn how to produce Jean-Michel Jarre's ambient style, a genre that won't get me in hot water with copyright lawyers that I can upload to SoundCloud and BandCamp. 🤣

See, on my car ride to the bank this morning, I put on "Waiting for Cousteau", and for the first time in years, I listened to the Calypso tracks. Years ago I didn't care for them, but now that I listened to them, they truly are brilliant pieces of music in their own right. On the way home I listened to "Amazônia", and ahhhh, what an amazing collection of beautiful, gorgeous Ambient music.

So I've produced Ambient in the past as you probably well know by now and have been considered by many here to be one of the reasons the Creations section of our forum became more Ambient and Experimental since the summer of last year. But this was easy-to-produce live Ambient jams. They didn't require too much thought on my part, just an active imagination and willpower.

I have begun my research by checking out https://equipboard.com/pros/jean-michel-jarre to see if Jean-Michel even uses a DAW. Much to nobody's surprise, he uses Logic Pro and Live on Mac. He also has a huge collection of synths and plugins and such, which also isn't surprising. I haven't opened LP4i in a couple of weeks, but now I'm intigued to dig back in.

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Here are my questions then. Are there any masterclasses and interviews with Jean-Michel Jarre (preferably in English) that can give me some insights as to how he produced "Amazônia" and "Waiting for Cousteau"? There seem to be I'm familiar with how to produce works like "Oxygene" and "Equinoxe" since they seem to require an understanding of Western Classical Music Theory and basic synthesis 101, both of which I do have. (I just don't have the hardware synths, lol, but have plenty of great software AUv3s.)

This seems to be the holy grail of interviews here (I've yet to watch it but will once I finish posting this thread).

But I'm wondering what else is out there that I can glean Jean-Michel Jarre's techniques and thought processes from. 🤔

Second question, if you have produced Ambient music in a similar vein or are far more observant than I am, are there any insights that you can offer me as to how to advance and push my skills as an Ambient producer further to create the way Jean-Michel Jarre creates?

Third, any "out of the box" answers that are loosely related to the subject you may have can help too. As always with my threads, these are more open-ended and don't have to always stick to the original topic as these discussions are always helpful and interesting to see in which direction they head.

michael_m

Producing it isn’t really the hard part - composing and playing it is what makes it.

Can you transcribe music? If you can, go through pieces you like and learn how they’re put together. It’s definitely one of the best ways to learn how other musicians work.

jwmmakerofmusic

@michael_m said:
Producing it isn’t really the hard part - composing and playing it is what makes it.

This is very true. And I know how to transcribe the "Equinoxe" and "Oxygene" pieces just fine. But, it's tougher to figure out how Jean-Michel Jarre composed the titular track to "Waiting for Cousteau" as well as "Amazônia" since they don't seem to have a time signature, just a basic key signature. Calypso I is easier to transcribe since it relies on Western Classical Music Theory despite its many key changes.

Can you transcribe music? If you can, go through pieces you like and learn how they’re put together. It’s definitely one of the best ways to learn how other musicians work.

Exactly. But as I said, some of the aforementioned pieces mentioned seem to lack time signature.

jwmmakerofmusic

https://theprogmind.com/2021/05/03/jean-michel-jarre-amazonia/

This amazing, descriptive review explicitly explains exactly what I want to shoot for in my own productions. Essentially this quote...

Between all of the sound effects and atmospheric touches, Jarre has made something that feels musical, almost like tapping into the hovering harmony of the planet itself. With precision in his keys and hypnosis in his percussion, Jarre draws us into an experience and a rhythm that only becomes more mysterious and enthralling as each track bleeds into the next. And this certainly is one long track of sorts, as the album is split into 9 parts, all with the same name.

Whether I create one long track and split it into a few parts, or have separate experiences, this is the type of music I wish to create. Something emmersive, hypnotic, incidental sounds here and there, etc. I want to create an experience!

Not just some four-on-the-floor disco track with microsampling like Justice (which I also enjoy creating a lot), but something that immerses the listener and transports them into another world.

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jwmmakerofmusic

@tja said:
Now, I started to hear Amazonia on Spotify 😅🤗

Let me know what you think of your experience once you finish.

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jwmmakerofmusic

@tja said:
P.S. Tomorrow, I will hear Waiting for Cousteau

You're in for a real treat my friend.

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@tja said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@tja said:
Now, I started to hear Amazonia on Spotify 😅🤗

Let me know what you think of your experience once you finish.

It's an interesting mix of sampled clips of the topic "Amazon" used in a very music way, mixed with instrument and Synth clips, voices and sung pieces - neither classical song nor a classical ambient piece.

It has very few repetitions and always adds something new.

I understand that you like it!

After hearing all 9 parts, I added it to my downloads.

To me, it has some aspects of ASMR too.

To do something like this, you need a strong topic and lots of fitting and typical samples.
Then you need to find or modify those samples so that they can be used in a musical way and mix them with your instrument and Synth samples.
But in a light way, so that only few sounds dominate every moment.

That would be my base for trying this.
But this will obvious of course.

This actually makes a lot of great sense. Now I don't think I'm going to tackle a 50+ minute piece to break into a few parts juuuust yet, but I can shoot for 5-10 minutes and see how it goes. Just gotta come up with a theme first.

jwmmakerofmusic

Ah, another excellent interview. Seems more of a "masterclass/demonstration", which is what I've been looking for!

Edit: He uses Live.

michael_m

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@michael_m said:
Producing it isn’t really the hard part - composing and playing it is what makes it.

This is very true. And I know how to transcribe the "Equinoxe" and "Oxygene" pieces just fine. But, it's tougher to figure out how Jean-Michel Jarre composed the titular track to "Waiting for Cousteau" as well as "Amazônia" since they don't seem to have a time signature, just a basic key signature. Calypso I is easier to transcribe since it relies on Western Classical Music Theory despite its many key changes.

I didn’t know either piece, but I listened to them and they both seem to be in common time. Much more evident on the former than the latter, but the phrases used in the latter all seem to be in the same time signature.

Waiting for Cousteau shouldn’t be too hard to transcribe, especially if you listen for the rests as well as the played notes. It seems like a few piano phrases with some repeated synth motifs and underlying off-kilter percussion. Pretty sure it’s mostly in a natural minor key, so definitely not veering from western music theory.

Luxthor

Use everything Bleass for start, they are bragging about JMJ all the time. After all, they made ‘Eon’ for him.

dendy

Short answer: you can't

Long answer:

People like Jarre, Vangelis, Zimmer, ... Trick is they are geniuses :-) No matter what SW/HW you use you can't go even remotely close to what they are capable to make just because the magic of their music is not hidden inside gear or some methods you can learn - the trick is inside of their brain, how it is wired, how they think creatively.

You can get all studio exactly like JMJ and still you will not get even remotely close to any of his hits. For example think about Jordan Rudess - he can put his hands on any shitt app / hw and result is just amazing. But that doesn't mean if any other people put hands on same gear, that result will be not complete shit

Just wanted to mention this, cause reading discussion in general people think just "use sw/hear XY, look at tutorial YZ, and you can get there" is general answer to question of this thread.

No, you can't. Just enjoy that music listening it but don't try to make something "similiar". That's just wasting of time. We musicians tend to think we need to make every music we like but that is mistake. I learned to tell myself in some cases something like "Yeah, this is great music, but i will stop here just listening it. Not trying to make something "similiar" casue result will be just crap, cheap imitation at best".

Luxthor

@dendy said:
Short answer: you can't

Long answer:

People like Jarre, Vangelis, Zimmer, ... Trick is they are geniuses :-) No matter what SW/HW you use you can't go even remotely close to what they are capable to make just because the magic of their music is not hidden inside gear or some methods you can learn - the trick is inside of their brain, how it is wired, how they think creatively.

You can get all studio exactly like JMJ and still you will not get even remotely close to any of his hits. For example think about Jordan Rudess - he can put his hands on any shitt app / hw and result is just amazing. But that doesn't mean if any other people put hands on same gear, that result will be not complete shit

Just wanted to mention this, cause reading discussion in general people think just "use sw/hear XY, look at tutorial YZ, and you can get there" is general answer to question of this thread.

No, you can't. Just enjoy that music listening it but don't try to make something "similiar". That's just wasting of time. We musicians tend to think we need to make every music we like but that is mistake. I learned to tell myself in some cases something like "Yeah, this is great music, but i will stop here just listening it. Not trying to make something "similiar" casue result will be just crap, cheap imitation at best".

I think that our JWM doesn't want to be JMJ, 🤔 he is just interested in ambient style production, for experimental reasons. If I got that right?!

Copying artist style is something I’m strongly against. I’m with you on this one. 👍

Lorichs

I love this documentary about Oxygene.
Really fascinating and geekie but hardware is needed 😜

ik2000

This is a fascinating post JWM. As a JMJ fan since I first heard him in the 80s a similar question has always been in the back of my head. No matter how hard I try there is something I can’t quite put my finger in that is always missing in my music whenever I try to emulate the genius that is JMJ. But I guess that’s the same for all great artists. Closest I’ve heard today is probably the Finish artist Kebu who does a few JMJ covers but also does his own stuff which is clearly influenced by early JMJ and not so much the ambient music you mention. ( Check out his To Jupiter and Back album, which is a massive homage to JMJ and Vangelis )

jwmmakerofmusic

@michael_m said:

@jwmmakerofmusic said:

@michael_m said:
Producing it isn’t really the hard part - composing and playing it is what makes it.

This is very true. And I know how to transcribe the "Equinoxe" and "Oxygene" pieces just fine. But, it's tougher to figure out how Jean-Michel Jarre composed the titular track to "Waiting for Cousteau" as well as "Amazônia" since they don't seem to have a time signature, just a basic key signature. Calypso I is easier to transcribe since it relies on Western Classical Music Theory despite its many key changes.

I didn’t know either piece, but I listened to them and they both seem to be in common time. Much more evident on the former than the latter, but the phrases used in the latter all seem to be in the same time signature.

Waiting for Cousteau shouldn’t be too hard to transcribe, especially if you listen for the rests as well as the played notes. It seems like a few piano phrases with some repeated synth motifs and underlying off-kilter percussion. Pretty sure it’s mostly in a natural minor key, so definitely not veering from western music theory.

That's actually a fascinating observation. Yeah I did notice JMJ used some repeating motifs in the piece but didn't understand how he lined them up. So in common time? I'd be very interested to find out how you'd transcribe it, although according to the second video I posted, JMJ doesn't notate his ideas out. He just produces/programs them directly.

jwmmakerofmusic

@Luxthor said:
Use everything Bleass for start, they are bragging about JMJ all the time. After all, they made ‘Eon’ for him.

Bloody hell. They did produce that, innit? Well I do have all of Bleass' plugins on iOS to date. Then again, it isn't what you use but rather what's between your ears that counts, but great to know that Bleass has things covered, lol.

jwmmakerofmusic

@dendy said:
Short answer: you can't

Long answer:

People like Jarre, Vangelis, Zimmer, ... Trick is they are geniuses :-) No matter what SW/HW you use you can't go even remotely close to what they are capable to make just because the magic of their music is not hidden inside gear or some methods you can learn - the trick is inside of their brain, how it is wired, how they think creatively.

While imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, I wish not to imitate them per se but rather learn their production techniques to get out what is in my own mind. It's like visiting a vacation destination in a sense. You go on an adventure to explore the local vistas and come back home with new memories made and new lessons learned. Aka a transformative experience.

You can get all studio exactly like JMJ and still you will not get even remotely close to any of his hits. For example think about Jordan Rudess - he can put his hands on any shitt app / hw and result is just amazing. But that doesn't mean if any other people put hands on same gear, that result will be not complete shit

LOL! Well it's true that no two people are the same.

Just wanted to mention this, cause reading discussion in general people think just "use sw/hear XY, look at tutorial YZ, and you can get there" is general answer to question of this thread.

Well, specific tutorials do help demystify the magic. Sure it may spoil how the magic trick is done, but then you learn how to do the magic trick yourself, put your own spin on it, and innovate it further.

No, you can't. Just enjoy that music listening it but don't try to make something "similiar". That's just wasting of time. We musicians tend to think we need to make every music we like but that is mistake.

Try telling that to me, lol.

I learned to tell myself in some cases something like "Yeah, this is great music, but i will stop here just listening it. Not trying to make something "similiar" casue result will be just crap, cheap imitation at best".

Yeah, I'm not looking to imitate but rather take what I like into my own unique direction. I'm not about "staying in my lane". Over the course of this month, I learned how to do microsampling like Justice. Does my output sound exactly like them? Of course not, and that's not the point. I still want to sound uniquely like me rather than a cheap imitation of someone else. I just want to tap into whatever JMJ is tapping into and make my own stuff from it.

jwmmakerofmusic

@Luxthor said:

@dendy said:
Short answer: you can't

Long answer:

People like Jarre, Vangelis, Zimmer, ... Trick is they are geniuses :-) No matter what SW/HW you use you can't go even remotely close to what they are capable to make just because the magic of their music is not hidden inside gear or some methods you can learn - the trick is inside of their brain, how it is wired, how they think creatively.

You can get all studio exactly like JMJ and still you will not get even remotely close to any of his hits. For example think about Jordan Rudess - he can put his hands on any shitt app / hw and result is just amazing. But that doesn't mean if any other people put hands on same gear, that result will be not complete shit

Just wanted to mention this, cause reading discussion in general people think just "use sw/hear XY, look at tutorial YZ, and you can get there" is general answer to question of this thread.

No, you can't. Just enjoy that music listening it but don't try to make something "similiar". That's just wasting of time. We musicians tend to think we need to make every music we like but that is mistake. I learned to tell myself in some cases something like "Yeah, this is great music, but i will stop here just listening it. Not trying to make something "similiar" casue result will be just crap, cheap imitation at best".

I think that our JWM doesn't want to be JMJ, 🤔 he is just interested in ambient style production, for experimental reasons. If I got that right?!

Pretty much sums it up in a nutshell. I don't want to imitate JMJ. I want to tap into whatever universal wavelength/consciousness is out there that he taps into and make my own music.

I'm already pretty decent at Ambient production, but not on JMJ's level. I want to push myself to get to that higher level of consciousness, not be a one-man JMJ cover band. 😂

Copying artist style is something I’m strongly against. I’m with you on this one. 👍

Exactly. To repeat, I don't want to be a one-man JMJ cover band. It'd be the same as being an electronic musician version of an Elvis impersonator. 🤣 The only people who'd be fascinated by an impersonator would be old white ladies no cap. 😆 (Do Elvis impersonators still exist?)

jwmmakerofmusic

@Lorichs said:
I love this documentary about Oxygene.
Really fascinating and geekie but hardware is needed 😜

Well, maybe not hardware required, because we are spoilt for choice on iPad for hardware emulations (including Hilda and miRack and iVCS3 and Model 15). But I'm sure there's plenty of great insight into how the album was produced that can be gleaned and utilised for my own productions.

jwmmakerofmusic

@ik2000 said:
This is a fascinating post JWM. As a JMJ fan since I first heard him in the 80s a similar question has always been in the back of my head. No matter how hard I try there is something I can’t quite put my finger in that is always missing in my music whenever I try to emulate the genius that is JMJ. But I guess that’s the same for all great artists.

Exactly! I want to tap into that "magic" of all the greats before me. One way to do that would be to sample and microsample their work ala Justice, but that's only a form of imitation or recycling what they've already put out there into the world.

I'm looking moreso to innovate. So far this thread and thoughtful, wonderful answers are helping spark something in me.

Closest I’ve heard today is probably the Finish artist Kebu who does a few JMJ covers but also does his own stuff which is clearly influenced by early JMJ and not so much the ambient music you mention. ( Check out his To Jupiter and Back album, which is a massive homage to JMJ and Vangelis )

Cool! I'll definitely check out Kebu.

dendy

when it comes to ambient, i really love ambient live jams of this guy:

and this is stellar, this guys makes beautiful generating ambient soundscapes with his modular madness machine
(should be possible to reproduce in miRack, at least theoretically)