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Microphones, microphones, my kingdom for a microphone
I’ve done a bit of diving and research and comparative listening over the last few days as I’m not entirely happy with my rode nt1 so I thought I’d start a thread to discuss options and maybe me and others will get pointers.
I currently have two rode nt1 condensors, genuinely regarded as a safe bet, excellent flat response mic for vocals, acoustic instruments etc, and somewhat beloved by people in general for the price. One is an older one, bought about ten or fifteen years ago. One is the fifth gen. I personally find the older one slightly more pleasing I think, a bit crisper. And this is the issue. It has a flat response. I don’t feel this reflects or flatters vocals. It sounds artificially packed in the mids to me, like it’s stuffed with cotton wool. There’s no space between frequencies. It’s inarticulate in some way like a toothless comb. Vocals don’t sound like that, they emote and sound much more expressive.
I realise mics are different for different people but I’ve found they sound like this on everyone, perhaps a bit better on female voices. It’s nice compressed but I find I need to scoop the mids to make it more articulate and get some edge from it and openness.
So on my search and listening I came across a bunch of mics and names which I’ll briefly list in case anyone has any thoughts or wants to contribute to discussion. Basically I’m unsure about the nt1 and am thinking of picking something up not too expensive, maybe a few hundred but 2-300 uk pounds would be nice, that has depth and a full sound but is much more open than the nt1 which I think sounds muffled. I probably prefer a sound that has the depth and fullness but has a very open articulate top end, open and immediate and alive and intimate. The exact opposite in my opinion of the nt1. But avoiding sounding brittle etc.
I should add that if there is a particularly outstanding mic with this kind of character, openness clarity, like someone whispering in your ear, but with a full sound supporting it with ease, a mic that’s a clear jump in quality I would be willing to spend 700 or so. I’ve kind of been weighing it up with the tlm 102.. it’s just the worry about managing reflections
If has experience other options, bargains etc…
The mics, various price points:
Rode nt1 already mentioned as point of comparison
Aston spirit: more articulate and pronounced top end and a more open sound but still rich and full. Definitely better for acoustic guitar for this reason imo. I can’t say it’s outstanding but definitely more exciting and alive than the rode
Neumann tlm 102: sounded great, the best quality I think of them all had everything. Just very balanced naturally open and articulate sound. Didn’t sound like it was trying to be that kind of mic like the cheaper ones did, just that it is. Can immediately hear the quality/price as it’s more expensive than the others. Unfortunately very sensitive and unusable in a home studio where there’s background noise. Doesn’t come with a shock mount or functional pop shield which is appalling. Or at least it didn’t in the videos I saw.
Lewitt lct 440: about 200 quid and with a great open sound top and upper mids really well defined, nice like someone’s speaking in your ear. Perhaps lacks a bit of body and weight
As another reference the Shure sm58 sounds very brittle and thin compared to these mics in my opinion, though I absolutely take someone’s point about the need for a quiet home studio for condensors, and if not possible a dynamic being preferable.
Earthworks sr40v: sounds good. Bit too low Endy perhaps for me. Not sure.
Shure ksm8: I think this was the model. Sounded good, little bit closed.
Shure SM7B: really popular among podcasters. Meh, sounds alright not really up to some of the other condensors listed imo. But it’s hard to remember each comparison.
Blue bird: gets mentioned a fair bit, sounds poor to me, thin and cheap but it does have openness. Like the opposite of a bass boost seems artificially strong upper mids lr too but I do quite like that if it was a better quality all round sound.
Interesting ones:
Isk 2b or starlight: particularly interested in this company, sounds nice in videos, I’ve seen recommended a lot as a kind of sleeper for vocals \
Warbler mk1 or Iii or iv or whatever: this company is really interesting but I couldn’t find much to listen to. Really really recommended as a sleeper for vocals. Made by some guy, maybe Australian who seemed to have a strong background in mics and puts them together how he thinks they should be for less money using good components but assembled in china. I think…unless I got that mixed up with someone else lol. Anyway really interested in anyone with experience with these compared to the rode and above
I’ll probably get slaughtered here so just to add that these are my memories of my personal takes on these mics from my limited listening and very happy for contrary views and discussion.
I know these are just a few mics but they were the ones that came up a lot on YouTube and Reddit and various forums as lower price range bargains or best mics for vocals and acoustic instruments.
Comments
You might want to take a look at the Aston Stealth as well, because it has four separate circuits which deliver four different voicings, so it's very versatile.
I own one, although on the whole I prefer the SM7B, which is just more forgiving on my voice, but as you're not a fan of the SM7B you might prefer the more open sound of the Stealth.
Another great mic I own and love is the Oktava MK319, but I don't think it's available at the moment due to sanctions on Russian manufactured goods. It's an excellent (and cheap) condenser mic.
I’ve found with with a little EQ I can get my Mic to do whatever I need. (AT2020). Doesn’t mean I’m not looking tho… every spring I get gas.
Take a look at the Heil PR30 or Heil PR40, they’re dynamics but very well regarded for vocals.
A lot of well regarded “vocal” mics actually have a bump in the mids or upper-mids. I agree that a vocal mic should be rich and open, but too much bass and richness could be a detriment for vocal recordings. What you call “thin and brittle” is possibly just an upper-mid push that can easily be smoothed out with eq. Finding the right mic for your voice is kind of a personal journey, but the mic is only part of the equation. You do want a sort of flat and transparent mic as a starting point, you can EQ it in post. Also, mic sensitivity is extremely important, and they all vary. What is dull could just be not pushed hard enough, what is brittle could just be too sensitive.
Another important factor is your mic pre-amp. This is where color, character, analog tube warmth, etc.. can all be achieved. Bus powered audio interfaces are fine, but they don’t have the dynamic range and don’t have as much max gain on tap compared to a top of the line mic-preamp. Just to say, the mic is only part of the equation. You have to pair it with the right mic-pre, if you’re really going to be picky.
The Rode NT-1 family was built on a huge range of capsules over the years.
(starting with bulk purchase from China of which the „best ones“ cherry picked and the rest returned to sender up to their own automated production in Australia)
The circuit also varies a lot, but most confusing is their branding: the very 1st was simply called NT-1, followed by NT-1a, but another NT-1 was released as a successor of the NT-1a.
The NT-1a is as famous for it‘s low self-noise, as for it‘s bite in the high midrange.
(a feature of the NT-1 series, initially sounds impressive, but can be a real problem in a mix)
An Audio Technica AT2035 is frequently suggested as an alternative in the same price range.
Regarding prices: Audio Technica, Neumann, Sennheiser, Gefell, etc charge high indeed.
But it’s not for the high quality of the individual mic, it‘s for constant quality and sound.
If you have a 20 year old U87, a brand new replacement will sound exactly sound like the old one, as good as technology allows.
People who started with an NT-1a frequently choose the Gefell M930 as an „upgrade“.
An M930 is a $1k investment, yet an affordable entry if you look for a high quality microphone for a lifetime.
A Neumann or Audio Technica may also apply (depending on individual voice), I mentioned the M930 mainly because it’s probably not very known that Microtech-Gefell was the „eastern section“ of Neumann right after WW2, they share the same heritage.
Apropos heritage... Lewitt in Austria is trying to rebuild the reputation of AKG microphones, that went down the drain when Harman took over AKG...
They seem to be on the right track.
@wingwizard : what is the mic going to be recording?
Both mics (and the SM57) share the same (basic) capsule design (Unidyne), but the 57/58 have a transformer included to „push up“ the signal.
Hence the SM7b has way less output, but avoids flaws a budget transformer may introduce.
It has a special resonator (it‘s backside), capsule distance from lips is kept higher (by it‘s foam) and the hollow part of the foam has a specific design.
(you don‘t get an SM7b by removing the transformer from a 57/58)
Anyway... all 3 absolutely need a high quality preamp to live up to their full capabilities.
They do have a characteristic sound (which some love and some hate), but you‘ll hardly experience anything of this on most budget interfaces.
(that‘s why I frequently suggest Audient ID interfaces, their preamp design is top notch for dynamic mics)
A Neve original/clone or vintage Telefunken-like will perform a little bit better, but the ID preamps catch the essence of the respective dynamic mic really well.
If you want a 57/58 on steroids... the (vintage) AKG D1000 or D1200 does it.
My favorite dynamic mic is the AKG D224, a dual capsule design (cardioid but without proximity effect).
Like the Sennheise MD441 often considered a condenser mic equivalent.
Unfortunately these mics are only available in used condition, so either buy with risk or local.
If you want to be really picky… every voice is unique and different in terms of which formants and overtones are accentuated or less prominent. There is great software out there that can measure your voice, not which frequencies you’re singing, but rather the energy of your voice. It’s kind of like a frequency graph mixed with a seismograph. You can see every frequency of your vocal production on a graph to see which overtones and formants are prominent or weak. Basically the amplitude of your formants shown in parallel to the frequencies of your fundamental vocal range. Some people sing high but in the throat, others sing low but in the mask, and vice versa. My point is you can find out exactly what your voice does and pick the right mic to flatter it.
After recording my own vocals at home for the last ten years I'm a total convert to the SM7B, it's incredibly forgiving and for me at least it's much easier to get a usable take with it compared to more sensitive condenser mics.
The trouble with condensers is that they catch a bunch of stuff I don't want, like annoying throat and mouth noises, and also the sound of the room, as well as nearby traffic or anyone who might be walking around the house.
The SM7B, being less sensitive (and highly directional) is less likely to pick up any of that stuff. So for home recording in less-than-ideal conditions it's a great option.
-I decided I didn’t want to say anything here so let’s just pretend nothing happened and watch the leaves blowing-
Just that the sm58 is too rough and lacks depth comparatively, it’s not about upper mids, it can’t be eqed out
I really want to say the pleas of my hostages… but more boringly: vocals and acoustic guitar mainly.
I’ll second the heil pr40, it is my favorite mic I own and I’ve yet to find a source it sounds bad on. I haven’t had a chance to try the pr30 but I’ll get one at some point. I have had the rc35 capsule on one of my wireless mics for a few years and it’s great, it’s the capsule from the pr35 handheld mic. I just bought a second one on eBay today, and will be looking to get two more when I can find them around the same price so I have a matching set (and bid goodbye to the sm58 capsules that are on them now). I think the pr35 has the same roots as the pr30.
You can hear the pr35 in this video that someone shot, that’s the camera audio picking up the room audio on this gig on which I was doing sound:
If you want a condenser, find one of the neat microphones king or worker bee mics, they are absolutely amazing for the price. I haven’t heard the v2 ones, but the first version that are yellow and black are fantastic. They are by the original people from Blue microphones after they sold blue to logitech. The king bee is a large diaphragm transformer balanced condenser and the worker bee is a medium diaphragm transformerless condenser. The worker bee has a really smooth upper midrange, and is awesome on vocals and acoustic guitar. Sounds great on piano too.
I had the isk 2b in the past, I didn’t really care for it and wound up trading it for 3 ev nd408 drum mics, which was a great trade for both parties. The person I traded with really liked the 2b, but I found it pretty “edgy” sounding.
The Roswell mini k47 is a great mic too, very basic but very good.
The blue ember is a good sounding inexpensive mic as well. It has an electret capsule, not a “true condenser” but it sounds great. I have a pair that I use a lot. Last week I recorded some voiceover in a high school band room for the show I was doing, using my apogee mini-me as an interface, and I was very pleased with the results. I use the embers on amps and pianos pretty frequently also.
Oh, and the absolute best value of any mic out there- the line audio cm4. Super flat response. The pattern is somewhat wide, but it sounds great and very natural. They don’t sell direct anymore but you can get them from their dealers around the world.
Finally, if you have a 57 laying around, look up the mod to remove the transformer. The 57 becomes much nicer unless you want the extreme mid boost that a 57 is known for. I don’t love that. Without the transformer, you lose about 10db of gain but you gain a lot in low end and high end. I guess the flattening of the upper mid hump brings it back into balance so the lows and highs seem much more present. The 57 sounds much more like an sm7 this way. The sm7 is not a mic I really enjoy, but I enjoy it more than a 57/58.
Oh, @wingwizard, spending some of your budget on acoustic treatment to manage reflections will make a big difference.
I hope that was helpful.
Harman was purchased by Samsung now. I’m not too happy with the “customer service” I’ve experienced regarding my soundcraft ui24r right now.
Thank you I appreciate it.
I’m not a fan of the heil pr40, its very top endy response wise - I only found this out after thinking that hearing a couple so checking the chart in case it was my ears. But I’m sure for different tastes it’s perfect.
Thats really helpful re the isk 2b particularly as you like the heil.
Listened to the roswell, that’s a great sounding mic for me, thanks, going to listen to more of this one.
At this point I’m feeling my original opinion on dynamics holds - I just consistently hear very marked drop in quality relative to condensors. I think the point about acoustic treatment is probably the best advice due to this. I don’t rate dynamics so I would be using something for me that sounds poorer just because I couldn’t get the right environment. In reality even laying in bed testing the rode sounds better than that to me, and it’s not what I’d like. So I’m starting to get somewhere thank you
I’ll check out the audio cm4 too now
I did some research into acoustic treatment, and have been in a lot of different situations - fully treated studios, half treated, sound booths where everything sounds much worse due to smallness making treatment less effective or more stifling, those imo useless things that go around the mic stand and completely suck the air and life out of any mic or do nothing, a home studio with a mattresss on the wall behind me, a bedroom with hard walls reflecting everywhere, the same bedroom facing into the centre of the room with probably the best mic sound I’ve ever heard besides the treated studio (in which I was facing a glass wall).
So I’ve got these four metal telescopic poles which were actually meant to be to put up an open clothes storage thing. They brace against the floor and ceiling. You can just pull them out and set up however you like. With cross bars. So I have this really quick and easy thing I can take out and set up in whatever configuration hang a duvet or whatever material over it to tailor the reflections at whatever distance whcih I think will be a much better solution than acoustic booths or panels for hundreds and hundreds or more. And it cost like 30 quid lol
Where I’m at now: (I realise probably only I care
)
I think Neumann are fantastic. I’ve realised that there , much like with guitars or anything, is almost a sub industry in taking shots at Neumann, due to fame, price etc. I get that. There are a lot of videos and forum comments and things that are loaded with this and I have to say, listening to so much Neumann vs and all the mics that are meant to be better cheaper etc, I just every time blind abing love the Neumann sound. I worked with them used them in studios. I think they are very pleasing.
Listened to all the warm comparisons, every time Neumann for me.
The only microphones so far that are making me think twice are Lauten which I just stumbled across. There’s a 220 and a 320 a warm tube mic cheap second hand and not horrific new. Them and the Tlm 102 Neumann my favourites I think.
I have one of these https://goldenageaudio.com/d1-dynamic-microphone/ although mine’s not from that posh glossy impressive brand, mine’s exactly the same unit, mine’s from cheapo brand Yoga – the DM-868 http://www.yoga.com.tw/en/product-344702/Stage-microphone-DM-868.html and it’s surprisingly okay – years ago I thought it would be worth having one around for the looks and the affordable price, but then it turns out to sound good enough too
I don’t think the pr40 is top endy, but everyone hears things differently. I think the sm7 lacks high end, which may be why people think it doesn’t pick up reflections. But, if the pr40 isn’t your taste, that’s ok. Just for reference, I used the pr40 on this, and it is about 2 feet away from him, just out of the shot. I did use a little bit of uad c-suite vox to remove the room sound and a little bit of rx broadband noise reduction because we were in a NYC apartment in midtown, but you still hear the heil for sure.
If you like the Neumann tlm102 you should get it. I’ve seen them for $500-$600 online, and while it is in their lower price range in their product line, a Neumann is still a Neumann. We have one at the school where I teach, but I haven’t really spent any time with it. I was surprised at how small it is though.
Room treatment with blankets can be helpful. Just for reference though, I bought 4 4” 2ftx4ft acoustic panels for $80 from someone local. They are pretty easy to build yourself as well and don’t have to be expensive. A blanket will take high end reflections, and is better than nothing, but having midrange frequencies bounce around the room and reflect back to the mic causes issues with frequency response due to phase, so panels are still a good investment.
Also, make sure you are setting gains correctly. Average -18dbfs and you’ll be good.