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MIDI effect to transform melodies and arpeggios?
Question:
Are there apps flexible like Cykle, that allow to effect a MIDI input, performing variations/filtering on a sequenced melody (e.g. transposing notes), leaving the original sequence intact?
Example: change velocity, duplicate/choir a note, adding/subtract octaves (or, ideally, 3rd/5th/7th, according to the scale set in Scaler2 🤓), repeat/rachet, offset.
Background:
While writing/drafting my boring repetitive melodies loops (or when using an arpeggiator), I like add/substract couple of octaves on some notes, to find variations.
Usually I do it with a MIDI sequencer of choice (Nanostudio, Cubasis, LK): duplicate the looping pattern and make some manual variations. And so on, till I get 5-10 different patterns.
Easy & straightforward. But...:
- if I don't label the patterns, I often forget which was the original source (loosing track of the variations)
- if I decide for a fundamental change in the melody idea, I need to change all the patterns, one by one. (and I am lazy 😜)
- I'd like to layer my changes in non-destructive way, so I'd rather effect my main MIDI melody rather than copy-paste & change it.
I suppose Drambo could do it, with a convoluted & low-level not-immediate setup:
I tried to put the MIDI sequence in a track, send it to 2 different tracks:
- the "instrument" track, to play the main melody
- the "choir" track, where I only add a MIDI effect that makes the variation (via Drambo; which I suck at 😓)
Not easy, not flexible, a lot of setup and routing; not ideal for simple patterns discovering/generation during exploration & drafting phase.
I'm curious if there's something more opinionated & ready to use as AUv3 MIDI FX.
Actually think Cykle would be perfect for the job, but (as I confirmed with the developer) it only variates its own generated MIDI & pitches, rather than filtering the incoming MIDI.
Otherwise its UI is perfect, separating all the single elements (velocity, octave, transpose, rachet, etc; everything sequenced in its own variable length lane).
Am I asking too much? 🤓😅
Comments
Please check out the Mozaic section on patchstorage.com.
It's incredible for such tasks.
Ahah I was almost buying it, yesterday, after reading about a script from @wim
(at https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/38920/midi-auv3-for-octave-doubling-overlapping-transposition/p1 ).
Actually I could even code something, if I study it. Although as I said "I am lazy" ™ (as every proper developer 😜), I'm not a MIDI/Audio expert, and of course there would be caveats, bugs and edge-cases to take care of.
So I was hoping to just throw money at some genius app with good UI/UX and use it.
Honestly I just ideally wanted something like Cykle! 😁
I couldn't find much by digging in patchstorage.com, there's nice stuff but not as complex & complete as in my (unrealistic? 😅) idea.
You wouldn´t need to program in Mozaic unless you want to. Check out Note and Chords sections here, for instance:
https://wiki.audiob.us/doku.php?id=mozaic_scripts_list
I don´t have it, but you should probably look into Mela midi fx.
Drambo too, of course.
Yeah, Mela's midi fx modules are a great resource if you want to cobble together your own things without coding. Mozaic is great because it already has so many scripts available. Mela UI is much nicer than Mozaic's, if that's important to you.
Harmony Bloom once it drops on iOS.
If you set cykle to arpeggios in settings, you can send it midi and it will use the incoming midi instead of the melody parameter to generate output. All of the other parameters in cykle will work to alter the I coming midi. It makes a wonderful varied arpeggiator.
I've recently stumbled over these Mozaic patches by @soundtemple which I really like:
https://patchstorage.com/author/soundtemple/
I'm surprised the developer said this. In the settings you can change cykle to arpeggiate or pass chords through the midi parameters like probability, harmony, length etc., effectively ignoring the melody parameter.
I'd turn to Drambo for this myself, though streambyter and Mozaic are great more "programmery" options.
Here's a Drambo patch I did to do transformation of sequences, expanding the Drambo euclidean module. https://patchstorage.com/euclid-seq/
There was some threads on those here at abf several years ago:
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/46432/qntm-kntrl-v2-0-full-launchpad-integration-9-mozaic-devices-for-hands-on-aum-jamming-pt2
You can check out Cality too - fun little app that will manipulate incoming MIDI in some of those ways:
Cality Midi Manipulator
*Edit:
And a lot can be done with Cem Olcay's Bud apps. You would probably need to combine two or three to get somewhat close to what you want. They are incredibly flexible and easy to mix and match. It really depends on your preferences - using apps that have features built-in, or customizable like Drambo, Mozaic, Streambyter, and such, and there's plenty of modules and scripts out there and experts here that know those!
To modulate inversions, send your midi into Rozeta scaler and lfo the pre-transpose. Photon AU is a nice midi fx app, but I don’t know if it still works. It may be abandoned.
This is not true. At least if you use more than one instance of Cylke. If you set things like arp, midi channel, it ignores the setting if you have more than one instance. Bug was reported over a year ago… Dev seems to ignore it.
Or just directly lfo the range on the arpeggiator.
I just tested two instances of Cykle in AUM -- routed through AUM, one played an arpeggio, the other played chords. Worked fine. Was this problem using the standalone app and creating multiple "parts" that are meant to receive from different midi channels?
The Ranbo Mozaic script might be of use.
Cality is nice too. Takes some experimentation with the settings for sure though. Note: you don't have to send your melodies and arps into it. You can set it to the same scale and send it a drum or other part if you like, getting you splashes of variation not directly related to the melody but rhythmically anchored.
I'm thinking The Chordulator Mozaic script could also be of use. If you ride the bypass knob and/or the probability knob, you could get some subtle results that would sound nothing like added chords, but instead added bits of melody.
So, a brief bit of testing shows that if you set arpeggio and chord on two separate Cykle instances BEFORE hooking it up to a midi source, it will output appropriately once you're hooked up, but in the settings, instead of it saying whether arp/chord is selected, it will say "none" despite outputting chords or an arp. Definitely seems buggy but after a brief play it looks like it works as long as you set the arp/chord setting before hooking up a midi source though the menu won't reflect the setting.
Looks like if there are two instances of Cykle, changing the midi source or destination will not work and the program will break. It's a shame, but seems like it works as long as you're not changing source/destination.
Reminds me of Ioniarics from the same dev. Produces weird permutations of any arp or chord you feed in. I like to mix them back into the original midi stream. That gives me the basic arp I want, plus some added variation around the edges.
Poly 2 is a great app for taking your midi stream and arpegiating it with polyrhythmic groove.
I like playing with a single midi stream and altering with midi fx also. Here are some ideas:
-Send chords into one Cykle outputting chords, one Cykle outputting arpeggios, and play with the parameters. Using inversions, harmony, length, gate, things can get very varied.
-Send chords into 4Pockets Euclidean to have it come out as a euclidean/polyrhythmic sequence
-Send chords/notes into Rozetta Scalar locked to a scale and have it transpose up/down for harmony or counterpoint. Send this to an arpeggio for more variation.
-Send chords to different Rozetta Scalar instances locked to the same or related scales (E.g., if the original chords are in C Minor, lock some Scalars to C Minor, some to C Minor Pentatonic). Then have some of these scalars transposed up or down and notes will be changed but still locked to scale. Then hook up the different Scalars to different arpeggiators (Arpbud 2, Rozetta Arp, Aphelian, StepPolyArp, Poly 2 etc.) with different timing (e.g., some half notes, some quarter, some 8th, etc.) .
-Create a sequence in Stepbud in your scale (e.g., C minor). Send the output through Rozetta Scalar locked to C minor. Then have ANOTHER sequencer send midi into Stepbud to have it transpose the sequence -- since Stepbud is sending midi into Scalar, the notes will be in scale.
-Send any midi stream into MidiGates to thin out the density of notes played and make things feel less "grid-like" and mechanical. You might use a bunch of the above techniques together, but then things can be very hectic. Sending any of the above midi streams into their own MidiGates instance with different probabilities or gate sequences can really make things sound sparser, more natural, etc.
Nice recipes; thanks!
Chordulator is great, and certainly a good starting point for more exotic Mozaic explorations 😊
Thanks @wim!
Of course!
Some other ideas:
-send chords into one poly synth while also sending it into Midigates... Send the gated stream into mono synth or a poly synth with only 2 voices activated to have a "melody" line play over your chords.
-send a monophonic midi stream into Rozetta Particles or Collision (this will transpose the Rozettas to the input note), then send that into Rozetta Scalar to lock the results to your scale/key.
-send monophonic sequences into chord apps like Chordjam or Chordbud to generate chord accompaniment
I summary, and in train-of-thought scatterbrained fashion, what I've found is that you can use a lot of midi fx to take one midi stream and really play with it. The overall techniques are (basically synthesizing the stuff I shared but without discussing specific apps)...
Using arpeggiators and scale/key quantizers to generate different arpeggios with different timings and transpositions.
Using scale quantizers to transpose harmonies off a monophonic sequence.
Using sequencers that transpose based on note input combined with scale quantizers to generate harmonies off a monophonic (melody) sequence
Using chord generator fx to make chords off monophonic sequences
Using probability fx to remove/gate a sequence of notes or chords to decrease density and add a more natural feel
Using chords with both poly synths and mono synths so the mono synths note-steal and play a single monophonic "melody" alongside the poly synth chords.
... And combining any of the above. It's a very satisfying way of making music...its amazing how much variation you can get off a simple chord progression or note sequence.
Definitely over 340 midi plug ins in one app.
Inside Loopy Pro: Drambo/Scaler2/Riffer.
This way i can get harmonies following my randomly generated, and chained basslines, melodies. Sometimes i mute Scaler, but usually use. I need chords
I use Drambo to sequence Scaler 2.
Then Scaler2 midi out goes to a synth for chords, and also goes to Audiomodern Riffer.
Riffer drives an other synth for basslines or melodies.
In Riffer you can enable midi input to folllow your Scaler 2 to get harmonic changes. You have to set the same scale manually in Riffer which coming from Scaler 2. (In Scaler 2 you can check what scale you use for chords.)
Riffer has preset storage, but you can't chain them. Although it works with midi cc-s. So i use an other Drambo midi out automation envelope to change Riffer presets.
For transposing you can add Rozetta Scaler drive by Drambo midi out envelope automation.
If anyone have another similar setup for following harmonies, please share
Thinking about creating variations of a monophonic sequence with Drambo again, it's probably easier than we thought.
I would yet need to have a more detailed picture of what @Pictor wants to do though.
I've been working on a melody generator that randomizes rhythm and melody based on a restrictive set of parameters to make it sound more human and less mechanic (which many algorithmic composers suffered from in the past).
The fun thing is that I've learned that making these restrictions includes "telling the machine" what kind of pitch flows and rhythmic patterns are my favorites, so my racks have a very personal note, not unlike what I would compose while playing the piano.
To me, this is much better than using Euclideans and simple melody randomizers and more like what e.g. Riffler generates, except that mine has its own touch 😉