How to replicate the idioteque\paul lansky synth sound?

sevenape

I really wanna try some chords with this harsh but mellow sound. I’m guessing there’s some ring mod in there? But is it just sines? Is it just fancy chords that use more than 3 fingers?

45 seconds in

sevenape

Maybe id700? It’s sort of fm bell synth sounding

cokomairena

that sounds like pure overtones, like in chiang mai or triplex classic

RonnieOmelettes

Reminds me of some of the free sounds in Decent Sampler, can't recall which one though!

sevenape

@cokomairena said:
that sounds like pure overtones, like in chiang mai or triplex classic

@RonnieOmelettes said:
Reminds me of some of the free sounds in Decent Sampler, can't recall which one though!

This is a start, thanks!!

rototom

you could also try the burns/spectrum "chords" algo.
(fancy chords, no fingers required:)
modulate the "timbre", "morph" and " harmonics" parameter.
and apply some samplerate reduction here and there...

NoncompliantBryant

It's definitely FM. Sounds like 2 operator to me. You can experiment with 2 OP FM like OPL or Sunvox. I'm no pro at 2 OP FM sound design, but here goes...

The carrier is a sine wave (hence that clean pure tone you're left with as the note sustains) and has a longer decay sustain and release than the modulator, hence why the harshness is at the beginning of the sound (when the modulator envelope is still open and providing that metallic sound) but resolves to a sine wave sounding pure tone (the carrier envelope sustain and release are all that are open at this point). Most FM synths just use sine wave operators, but OPL let's you play with more than that, so if you're using OPL, stick with a sine carrier. I'm no expert, but I don't think people were using more than sine waves for FM in the 70s, so maybe stick with a sine modulator for good measure.

The modulator is providing what you describe as ring mod to the sound. You'll want that to trigger at the beginning of the sound but then fade away.

If you set your carrier to have a high sustain and long release, then set a modulator to have a medium decay, low/medium sustain, and medium release, you'll start to get a sound with that initial harshness that resolves to pure sine tones. Sounds like that metallic sound starts with the beginning of the note, so maybe stick with attack and decay that resembles your carrier.

Play with the second half of the modulator envelope to get the timing right on when the metallic harshness goes away (higher sustain and longer release on the modulator will extend that metallic texture).

Increasing the carrier and modulator frequency ratios will give you more metallic sounds. Since the sound has such a clean sine sound at the end, I think the carrier frequency ratio is low, like a 0 or 1), which will preserve the sine tone when the modulator envelope ends. Try starting with a modulator frequency ratio from 1-4 (I have a 2 OP FM synth open right now, and anything higher sounds too brittle to my ears).

Orrrrr I could be totally off. But it's definitely FM, and likely 2 OP.

sevenape

@rototom said:
you could also try the burns/spectrum "chords" algo.
(fancy chords, no fingers required:)
modulate the "timbre", "morph" and " harmonics" parameter.
and apply some samplerate reduction here and there...

Great! Thank you!!!

sevenape

@NoncompliantBryant said:
It's definitely FM. Sounds like 2 operator to me. You can experiment with 2 OP FM like OPL or Sunvox. I'm no pro at 2 OP FM sound design, but here goes...

The carrier is a sine wave (hence that clean pure tone you're left with as the note sustains) and has a longer decay sustain and release than the modulator, hence why the harshness is at the beginning of the sound (when the modulator envelope is still open and providing that metallic sound) but resolves to a sine wave sounding pure tone (the carrier envelope sustain and release are all that are open at this point). Most FM synths just use sine wave operators, but OPL let's you play with more than that, so if you're using OPL, stick with a sine carrier. I'm no expert, but I don't think people were using more than sine waves for FM in the 70s, so maybe stick with a sine modulator for good measure.

The modulator is providing what you describe as ring mod to the sound. You'll want that to trigger at the beginning of the sound but then fade away.

If you set your carrier to have a high sustain and long release, then set a modulator to have a medium decay, low/medium sustain, and medium release, you'll start to get a sound with that initial harshness that resolves to pure sine tones. Sounds like that metallic sound starts with the beginning of the note, so maybe stick with attack and decay that resembles your carrier.

Play with the second half of the modulator envelope to get the timing right on when the metallic harshness goes away (higher sustain and longer release on the modulator will extend that metallic texture).

Increasing the carrier and modulator frequency ratios will give you more metallic sounds. Since the sound has such a clean sine sound at the end, I think the carrier frequency ratio is low, like a 0 or 1), which will preserve the sine tone when the modulator envelope ends. Try starting with a modulator frequency ratio from 1-4 (I have a 2 OP FM synth open right now, and anything higher sounds too brittle to my ears).

Orrrrr I could be totally off. But it's definitely FM, and likely 2 OP.

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation FM is a mystery to me!! I will definitely try this!

NoncompliantBryant

@sevenape said:

@NoncompliantBryant said:
It's definitely FM. Sounds like 2 operator to me. You can experiment with 2 OP FM like OPL or Sunvox. I'm no pro at 2 OP FM sound design, but here goes...

The carrier is a sine wave (hence that clean pure tone you're left with as the note sustains) and has a longer decay sustain and release than the modulator, hence why the harshness is at the beginning of the sound (when the modulator envelope is still open and providing that metallic sound) but resolves to a sine wave sounding pure tone (the carrier envelope sustain and release are all that are open at this point). Most FM synths just use sine wave operators, but OPL let's you play with more than that, so if you're using OPL, stick with a sine carrier. I'm no expert, but I don't think people were using more than sine waves for FM in the 70s, so maybe stick with a sine modulator for good measure.

The modulator is providing what you describe as ring mod to the sound. You'll want that to trigger at the beginning of the sound but then fade away.

If you set your carrier to have a high sustain and long release, then set a modulator to have a medium decay, low/medium sustain, and medium release, you'll start to get a sound with that initial harshness that resolves to pure sine tones. Sounds like that metallic sound starts with the beginning of the note, so maybe stick with attack and decay that resembles your carrier.

Play with the second half of the modulator envelope to get the timing right on when the metallic harshness goes away (higher sustain and longer release on the modulator will extend that metallic texture).

Increasing the carrier and modulator frequency ratios will give you more metallic sounds. Since the sound has such a clean sine sound at the end, I think the carrier frequency ratio is low, like a 0 or 1), which will preserve the sine tone when the modulator envelope ends. Try starting with a modulator frequency ratio from 1-4 (I have a 2 OP FM synth open right now, and anything higher sounds too brittle to my ears).

Orrrrr I could be totally off. But it's definitely FM, and likely 2 OP.

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation FM is a mystery to me!! I will definitely try this!

Good man! FM is weird but kind of the most inspiring to me insofar that it still feels like magic when playing with operators (whereas analog has divulge its mysteries in a more upfront manner).

OPL is a great synth for these metallic, glassy, harsh mixed with mellow sounds, has a good number of presets, and has some fun goodies like tremolo, vibrato, and velocity sensitivity (high or low) for the carrier AND modulator. The envelope controls are kinda upside down though, so I get tripped up on occasion lol

Sunvox's FM module is a basic 2 OP FM synth that is very easy to program once you grok the interface (hell, I love the sunvox UI and having horizontal bar graphs for envelopes works for me). I haven't done much 6 OP using Sunvox, but now that we're talking FM, I think imma give it a try tomorrow.

Do you have either of these synths? OPL has a bunch of presets that are great for backwards designing / figuring out how to program 2 OP FM.

Whats also great about both OPL and Sunvox 2 OP FM is that their cpu use is miniscule... And I'm talking like sometimes under a percent when the iPad is running on minimal cores. You can have entire orchestras of these synths running on an iPad from 7 years ago (my old iPad pro spends most of its time sequencing low cpu synths).

Also, thanks for hipping me to this track. It's fantastic.