Sample delay for mid side mixing (is awesome!)

Mountain_Hamlet

Hi,
I’m currently exploring mid/side mixing. Is there a plugin in iOS that will give you the capability to delay the mid or the sides rather than stereo? There is a sample delay in Logic Pro, but it only does stereo.

Something like Voxengo Span that you can get on desktop.

Here is a video by Dan Worrall that helps to explain what I’m talking about:

Thanks in advance.

ZankFrappa

Not sure exactly what you're looking for, but Jens Guell has a sample delay. Maybe it can do what you need...
https://apps.apple.com/de/app/wu-ausampledelay/id1530887051

rs2000

Here's a Drambo patch that does some M/S processing:
https://patchstorage.com/mid-side-mixer/

It should give you a good starting point.

BlueDream

you can do it with Drambo

Mountain_Hamlet

@rs2000 said:
Here's a Drambo patch that does some M/S processing:
https://patchstorage.com/mid-side-mixer/

It should give you a good starting point.

Thanks for the pointer. I figured there has to be a way to do it with Drambo. This could be a good starting point.

Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr

Split mid-side in AUM into two channels. Use whatever delay you want on each channel.

Mountain_Hamlet

@Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
Split mid-side in AUM into two channels. Use whatever delay you want on each channel.

Thanks for the tip. My preference would be to use it inside something like Logic, but I could export and import if I needed to I guess.

uncledave

You can do this easily in the free BYOD AUv3 plug-in.

Poppadocrock

I believe you can do this directly in AUM without any external apps. You could use bussing to split the signal, the M/S internal FX, and the sample offset setting in each audio channel.

Someone did a video on that exact thing like 8-12 months ago Maybe, think it was Doug, @thesoundtestroom

Edit - missed the Logic Pro comment.

Poppadocrock

@uncledave said:
You can do this easily in the free BYOD AUv3 plug-in.

Great to know.

Mountain_Hamlet

@uncledave said:
You can do this easily in the free BYOD AUv3 plug-in.

Thanks. That looks promising. I’ll have a look. I’ve been looking at the Drambo one and doing mods to it. But, this appears to be a lot more direct. BYOD is a very handy plugin to have.

quantovox

@Mountain_Hamlet said:

@Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
Split mid-side in AUM into two channels. Use whatever delay you want on each channel.

Thanks for the tip. My preference would be to use it inside something like Logic, but I could export and import if I needed to I guess.

In Logic Pro, using the built-in "Dual Mono" feature allows separate processing for Mid and Side.

We also have a plugin called Mid-Side Continuum which can be used to wrap any stereo effect and offers a continuous control curve instead of a hard switch between L/R and M/S (uses a modified, fractional encoder/decoder). Actually received a request for adding more controls to deal with plugins that don't offer separate L/R processing, which we'd like to follow up on, as it may be an area of diminishing returns in terms of ease of use and utility over solutions that involve splitting / merging.

rs2000

Here's a compact, low-CPU Drambo version that you can use in your DAW as-is:

https://patchstorage.com/mid-side-delay/

It also doubles as a "Stereo width enhancer" using a side boost function.

Edit: I've added a highpass switch for the side signal to improve the sound in stereo widening.

Mountain_Hamlet

@rs2000 said:
Here's a compact, low-CPU Drambo version that you can use in your DAW as-is:

https://patchstorage.com/mid-side-delay/

It also doubles as a "Stereo width enhancer" using a side boost function.

Edit: I've added a highpass switch for the side signal to improve the sound in stereo widening.

Thanks for this. I started to modify the other one you sent me, but this looks like exactly what I am looking for. I’ll give this a spin tomorrow and let you know how I go. This actually looks like the perfect plugin with width enhancement built in…

Mountain_Hamlet

@quantovox said:

@Mountain_Hamlet said:

@Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr said:
Split mid-side in AUM into two channels. Use whatever delay you want on each channel.

Thanks for the tip. My preference would be to use it inside something like Logic, but I could export and import if I needed to I guess.

In Logic Pro, using the built-in "Dual Mono" feature allows separate processing for Mid and Side.

We also have a plugin called Mid-Side Continuum which can be used to wrap any stereo effect and offers a continuous control curve instead of a hard switch between L/R and M/S (uses a modified, fractional encoder/decoder). Actually received a request for adding more controls to deal with plugins that don't offer separate L/R processing, which we'd like to follow up on, as it may be an area of diminishing returns in terms of ease of use and utility over solutions that involve splitting / merging.

I haven’t found the dual mono feature in Logic for iPad. I know it’s there on the desktop, but I haven’t been so fortunate as to stumble upon it in the iPad version. I’ll have a look at Continuum for some other potential uses.

rs2000

@Mountain_Hamlet said:

@rs2000 said:
Here's a compact, low-CPU Drambo version that you can use in your DAW as-is:

https://patchstorage.com/mid-side-delay/

It also doubles as a "Stereo width enhancer" using a side boost function.

Edit: I've added a highpass switch for the side signal to improve the sound in stereo widening.

Thanks for this. I started to modify the other one you sent me, but this looks like exactly what I am looking for. I’ll give this a spin tomorrow and let you know how I go. This actually looks like the perfect plugin with width enhancement built in…

Looking forward to hear your opinion 😊

rs2000

I'm starting to get some fun out of this myself!
I couldn't resist adding Mid/Side distortion like shown by Dan Worrall in Fabfilter Saturn.

Mountain_Hamlet

@rs2000 From first listens it appears to be doing the trick rather nicely. It’s amazing the difference it makes putting a small time delay on the mid channel. I’m going to play with this a bit more and make sure I’m not fooling myself. I do most of my work through headphones and just a little bit of delay appears to be giving me a lot of depth. I’m very excited about the prospects of this.

Mountain_Hamlet

@rs2000 this is quite awesome I think. I’ve been checking with scopes to see what is going on phase wise and I know putting delay in the signal is going to affect phase, but with my measurements it’s not really noticeable. What is noticeable is the instance depth it is giving in my headphones. This is with 0.01ms delay on the mid channel. Instant 3D. It’s kind of nuts. I need to hear this in the car next I think, but on the iPad speakers it sounds great and on the headphones it sounds great.