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AI maybe be good for artists
I've not seen this take but it's probably been said.
Personally, I think it's possible that AI may help improve the music space. so far, every AI piece of music I heard has been exactly like the same old bland genre-based music people try to make money with. if AI replaces that then i don't see a problem. all that stuff is practically free already.
It might be good if AI blows that space away. no more illusions of making money (however small) from banging out a bit of genre. The stuff you don't wanna make anyway.
it may lead to musicians accepting what they need to focus on to become a musician. maybe the joy of making music become the primary motivation.
AI will never be Bach or Bird, it can just copy and generalise it. If your music is already generalised then you be swallowed up, not a bad thing?
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I’ve thought about this as well, original stuff will stick out more, and I think people value authorship much more than the tech bros think. Sure loads of mass trash will soak up the mainstream, but there will be breakthroughs even in that from time to time, and as you say, much is that is safely behind the gatekeeper’s barriers as it is.
Yep - it’s a good point. Might need to mangle it through some overdriven multi effects to make it stand out and sound more original 🤩
Hell yah. Music in its purest form is all about the felt presence of the moment. Screw music recording turning it into a commodity. That was just a temporary sideline distraction to the true party to come.
Ambient will always sound like ambient after all. 😁
AI is in its infancy. Hell, AI is in its amoeba stage. And AI has the power to grow and improve quickly, much faster than humans can.
Clearly the AI of 2024 is no Bach or Bird. But where will AI be in five years? Twenty years? Fifty or a hundred years? A thousand years or more? Use your imagination, man. The AI of today is at amoeba stage and improving fast. People are barely improving at all. Just wait.
I'm not sure where you got the idea that AI just "copy and generalize"? AI recognize patterns, and in some fields can already recognize patterns more subtly than humans can. AI will identify and enhance patterns no human could ever see. It is only a matter of time.
i think AI can free up a space for humans to fill in their own endeavours for musical expression...... and imagination. Maybe make better music.
Look at chess as an example of AI, no need to look a thousand years into the future, the engine is far superior to humans however no one is interested in playing an engine for fun, only for study/learning just like humans use any other machine. There isn't such a market for two engine chess matches.
AI generated music may give study opportunities, i doubt humans will be so interested in collecting AI music.
however, i can see it totally dominate the commercial world in terms of that next marvel movie soundtrack etc... maybe, maybe not
Better robots replacing lesser robots (people doing inhumane work following templated and automated processes) looks like general theme with AI.
Erasing every poor bastard who makes mediocre music just because they want to, and it’s what they’re capable of, does not sound like anything remotely “good for artists.”
AI not stopping people from making mediocre music, just means there little chance to make any money from it.
It’s been really helpful for me in a lot of ways, it’s just another tool in my arsenal to use. I feel if I only made music for money, my viewpoint of music would be as soulless as AI is so I’m not really worried about getting displaced by it
Wonder how professional musicians (i.e people who make music to pay the rent) feel about all of this...?
Probably divided/fragmented like with people who make visuals.
this already happened when streaming platforms deprived us of the possibilities to earn money with music.
Yah for me the music as commodity dream ended with Napster.
Work for hire in games will still be a thing, but considered soulless work by the likes of many on this forum. I dig it though.
lol… that must have been AI Generated…
All they have to do is, Don’t use it!
Why all the hate/fear? Shoot, I am loving FlStudio’s AI Chord Progression Tool.. They need to port it to iOS..
That's comedy gold.
Identifying Political Deepfakes in Social Media Using AI:
https://www.truemedia.org
I've been thinking about this too. AI created content is now mingling with non-AI content, and training done on 'what's out there' in 2024 and beyond will start to pick up the creations done by AI itself. Will this widen its perspective or narrow it?
Regardless, I have no doubt that it will introduce variations that no human would and we'd interpret it as 'creative' in no time at all.
this has been tried actively for some time but it seems that there’s some sort of feedback effect where it turns to poop rather than gets better. Whether this can been tuned out somehow remains to be seen, but it kinda starts returning to the noise it started from, delicate systems I guess…
I feel like Napster and Limewire and other file sharing apps not only killed the music industry but also devalued art and music to the point where people just expect it to be free.
Nowadays people think nothing of sharing a Netflix password or installing adblockers because many seem to feel like if technology allows it, it's fair game.
If I'm completely honest with myself it's part of the justification I use for working with AI.
I could argue that artists copy each other and that AI is mimicking that process and I think that's a fair argument, but I can also see how people feel they should be compensated for contributing to the training, especially when someone copies their style using a model or Lora that has been fine tuned on their art.
I do my best to create things that would fall under fair use. Some transformative. Something that is different enough from the source material that it stands on its own. Do I always hit that mark? I don't know.
There will be a lot of AI "slop" in the future. With so many people having access to it and social media being what it has become I don't see any way around it. I know I need to up my game if I'm going to get people's attention and AI is the hot new thing. I've tripled my subscribers and had one video hit over 6000 views. I might never have another video that performs that well. Or I might have one that goes viral. But I will make some slop in the process.
Hopefully that's not all I make.
Professional musician here.
Yup.
I would spend more time worrying about AI if “charting music” today wasn’t so depressing.
The projects that get me excited break rules and define new potential genres. If AI can locate
New areas of composition, arrangement or sound design it will surface and make the case for a significant new toolset or workflow. Will it be targeted towards mobile creators leveraging some backend service to be super “”smart”. Or will this service emerge that allows anybody be to be the “creator” of record and more musicians are left without revenue options?
I’ll take responses offline.
'Adobe Says Artists Should Embrace AI If They Want to be Successful'
https://www.theverge.com/2024/10/25/24278715/adobe-artists-embrace-generative-ai-creative-community
A few weeks ago my son, who is a gifted artist but has never developed his potential or made use of it (which is fine), told me how he's been using AI art generation to revive and improve his drawing skills.
He's been uploading his own sketches and then systematically prompting the AI to criticize and help him improve in targeted ways. For instance the AI will point out something it sees as wrong about the anatomy of a figure, and he evaluates that feedback, and if he agrees, he'll make a modification and upload it, repeating until both are usually satisfied with the results. He says it's like hours of expensive one-on-one with a teacher and that it's breathing new life into his whole experience.
I thought that was an extremely creative use of AI. I've been wondering ever since if such an approach could be helpful for musicians. It sure would get me past the "I'm not interested, I want the satisfaction of creating myself" stage.
I believe that's how students of all age and learning levels are going to be learning soon enough. When students have the best minds in every field at their fingertips 24 hours a day, the entire notion of learning something once and then forgetting about it will have to be challenged. Ninety-five percent of everything kids learn in school is useless, so I think a real educational system renaissance may be just around the corner.
I’ve been using it with writing, almost like a working partner who I can bother with dumb questions as much as I like without annoying them. Great for analysing work I’ve been sweating on, getting some sort of opinion, some thoughts on things that may be improved, or that I’ve not thought about. I was tempted to get it to rewrite stuff once or twice but quickly realised that wasn’t for me… one caveat is that I’ve found it to be gushingly kind about what it’s presented with, which in some ways is good as it doesn’t dampen your enthusiasm, but definitely take its complements with a pinch of salt😅
AI is terrible for all existing artists as the models are trained on their work without permission or recompense.
AI is also bad for artists as it’s by definition always going to shit out the most average of work. That’s how it works — the models average out the data.
AI is also bad for artists as it is basically allowing non-artists to do the job of the artist with ease. To an average at best level.
AI is also a crock of shit for me as the whole point of me making music is for me to make it. I get zero satisfaction out of typing a prompt to let an LLM vomit out something for me.
AI is going to be good for people that want an image but can’t take a photo. Or draw a picture. Or write with any degree of competence. Or they want a tune but can’t play an instrument, sing or write a song.
It’s not for artists. Quite the opposite. It empowers those with no artistic talent, and those with neither talent nor taste.
In democratising art it also demeans and devalues it. Why bother learning how to draw, paint, write, photograph, play an instrument, write a song when you can type in a few words instead?
And yes it can help those with the necessary talent to work faster and to not need the assistance of fellow artists. Hollywood will use it because it will make them more money and they won’t have to pay artists at all.
It is also in desperate need of some control and checks. It’s being used in situations where it can be dangerous (the military are using AI for target acquisition for example) .
It doesn’t know when its data is wrong, and the humans that control it will tend to believe whatever nonsense it spews out. The models are only as good as the data they’re trained upon.
There are hugely beneficial areas that AI can assist in, like assisting in the diagnosis of cancer for example, but good for artists. I think, on the whole, not. It’s almost moot that an artist can use an AI powered plugin to help them write a song when everybody else is using AI to ‘write’ the whole blinking thing.
Good for people that want to be artists but can’t maybe.
I don't agree with all of your post, but this I totally agree with! I regularly run into people that think everything they get out of ChatGPT is correct. Even talking to my son, who I just posted about how he's using in an intelligent and creative way, shocked me with some of the stuff he just takes as factual from ChatGPT. To be fair, he does that with YouTube too. 😂
AI has to be approached with vast skepticism and with awareness of its limitations (and dangers). I don't encounter nearly enough people these days that do. It's kind of scary.
Well, I've seen it help people who are fantastic idea people but without the skills or connections to develop those ideas. If you think of the idea as the product, not the art, or music, or words, it's not necessarily a bad thing. We could see breakthroughs that we never would have otherwise.
We can also all die from it. I'm still convinced that's a very real possibility.
John, there is nothing to be worried about. Making art is a form of self-accomplishment, like climbing on the mountaintop, learning to speak a new language, learning to play an instrument, and expressing your feelings and experiences using your body and mind.
Writing the prompt has nothing to do with your personal accomplishment in certain art disciplines, maybe in writing a good prompt and that's it. You can't run 100 meters in the Olympics using a motorcycle. You are not a mathematician for just knowing how to use a calculator. You can't win a chess game using AI to do your moves.
Today, "AI" is, before everything else, just a product, an apparatus of sorts. There are plenty of ways where it can be useful. I'm so freaking excited for what is happening right now in the technology world.
One thing is sure: GPT is not you!
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