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Midi doesn’t fire off AUv3 envelopes <<<SOLVED>>>
I noticed that my virtual synth instruments don’t seem to fire their envelopes from external mid sequence. Notes and velocity, but just not the envelope. The keyboard works as expected.
I thought it might be as I was using widimaster but,
I now think this isn’t a LP issue, as I connected my mac to my iPad direct via usb midi through midimittr and most synths would still not be triggered.
However, two older apps, argon and Cassini DO get their envelopes fired.
Please does anyone have any idea?
Cheers, Steve
Comments
The first thing I would do was use a midi
monitor to examine the midi stream.
What virtual instruments are receiving the midi stream?
It's unlikely that the envelope isn't triggering at all. It probably has to do with gate length or velocity.
Looking at the output in a midi monitor should reveal some things but you'll have to look carefully.
One possibility is when you're playing on a local keyboard you're are holding notes down a bit, which is engaging the sustain loop, but your external source is sending very short notes so that the sustain part isn't sounding.
Or, maybe the external sequence is coming in at low velocity and the synth envelope velocity tracking is coming into play. Synths often have an adjustment for how much velocity affects envelope amplitude.
If you have a slow attack on the envelope but the incoming note is shorter than the attack phase, that could also give the impression that the envelope isn't firing properly.
What synth, and what external source? What kind of patch?
Thanks for prompt reply,
I’ve just re-setup simply using Cubasis internally as opposed to actual external midi to rule things out, and now it seems all are working except iVCS3 and Moog 15. Quite likely at this point now a user error.
Notable though because they’re both modular so I may be patching something wrong there. My two fave sounding synths! I’m just going to check an external midi input using a laptop.
Are they app presets or your own? If they're factory presets, I can take a look at what might be the cause.
I expect it will come down to note length or velocity differences.
So far so good, all now working direct from CUBASE through midimittr except iVCS3.
Im next going to connect via my midisport 2x2 and widi to see if that is ok.
Yesterday was weird, one of those days when you’re chasing an issue, and can’t quite seem to get to the nitty gritty. After I re-set up in another room, all synths I have, Moog 15 & D, Synth One, Nanologue, Argo and Cassini were working correctly with the exception of iVCS3.
I could get in contact with JEC as he would know if that’s a iVCS3 thing. It’s a bit quirky.
Things have been a bit not right since I dongled my Cubase, an older mac, to complicate matters the midi sync kept dropping out as I was trying to suss the au’s.
New laptop later in the year I think.
I do have midi monitors, not used them yet.
I thank you both for your remarkable support, you guys are more attentive to our quirks and issues than elsewhere.
I will have some time today to look again at my developing system but the urge to have fun and make music may well predominate.
iVCS3 is a bit peculiar. Are you sure the patch you're using includes the envelope to control the output amplitude, and triggers the envelope from the input notes?
Yeh, iVCS3 is a minefield for potential screwups. 😉
Using a midi monitor and comparing the midi input from a source that seems to be working and a source that doesn't is the best way to get to the bottom of it. I'm 99% sure you'll find that it comes down to velocity or gate length differences.
I doubt very much that it's an iVCS3 bug or is anything the developer could address unless you get down midi monitor level in your reporting to the developer. That app has been around too long to be likely to have any midi processing issues.
There's a lot to be said for just forgetting all the tech stuff and having fun playing. 😎
I’m > @uncledave said:
I had that thought. Been busy recording today but
I’m going to get stuck in this evening with the iVCS3 as yeah quite poss I’m not seeing a missing connection. But I flicked through patches to check I think.
I’ve always used the internal sequencer but the sequence is too long and complicated for it.
I did think of switching between two instances to do the job.
I recorded it using a reason synth this afternoon for convenience.
Yeah I’ll check the monitor. The sequence is 64ths so should be short enough, and I did check a few other patches including some factory ones.
And tried some other sequences too. Velocities peak at 127 and most on 80ish.
When the seq is running the trigger light just stays on : as soon as I touch the keyboard the envelope fires and the light goes on and off as it should.
Defo want to get the bottom of it…
After dinner
humm ... that almost sounds like the sequencer might be sending Note-On/zero velocity for Note-Off. That's legal MIDI, but maybe iVCS3 isn't recognizing it. The midi monitor should show you that.
I'd try with a longer note length to see what happens. 1/64th might be too short for the envelope's duration.
Ah good point, cheers I’ll check
Yep, cheers @wim you are completely on the nail, it was actually 16ths which is ok but I found the sequence had been saved notes overlapping just a tick, it’s very old, probably done on an Atari in 1994.
And it’s been ported from that to probably every computer I’ve had since then!
I shortened all to 64 then back to snap to the 16 and the iVCS3 plays it perfectly. It’s was just a legacy thing, sorry to be obtuse! There’s probably more as I’m porting some old stuff into the loopy realm. At least I’m aware of it now.
This is the track I recorded ‘sarfternoon, just a run through. I’ve got AmpliTube and midi guitar loaded in another iPad and the midi fires of the moog in the loopy pad.
That’s Richard from Hawkwind played the drums on a Yamaha DD 11 drum pads thing. I bet there’s a load of overlaps in that too😂
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/sl407wn4bzdw8bvrhq17d/SSMS-Live.mp3?rlkey=anp5m1786tturab0or16i7gmc&st=dnbbpe7m&dl=0
That is an excellent track! 👍🏼
Cheers! It’s only ever been played out once some years ago, it was a struggle due to midi sync issues, but luckily got a desk mix of it. Richard sings toward the end. Now the kit has advanced so much I’m hoping to include it when we (hopefully) play later this year.
Btw, I’m wondering, seeing as I’m so sucked into LP now if there’s still any call for beta test of the new version?
There will probably be another call for beta testers in the not too distant future. There are some issues Michael wants to tackle before the final round of beta expansion.
Ok cool. I learn things every session with it - stayed up too late this evening though 😵💫😏