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Macbook reco?
Other than ipad, I'm a windows guy...
However, I'm looking to get a laptop for music making "stuff", an because so many of the apps, etc. I use for music seem avail on MacOS and I'm going to keep using ipad and it's brain-damage inducing to get large files to/from ipad/PC so I'd like to leverage Airdrop I'm looking at Macbooks.
I don't want to cripple future usage, but I also don't want to pay Apple's insane prices for memory/storage above and beyond what's "rational."
So I'm looking for reco's on a minimal reasonable model in terms of CPU/memory, etc. to run Live. I don't think I need latest and greatest, but I do need apple silicon, etc. of course, so those temptingly cheap refurbs aren't gonna work.
I'm not looking to score movies, and 200 track projects are not a concern. I'm mostly focused on live performance and maybe some post arranging...
So... suggestions?
Comments
Sounds like the cheapest model would do, if you don't need much storage.
What apps do you have in mind, and what about sample libraries?
Have you looked at Mac minis? You could probably reuse some existing peripherals if you go that route.
I always start here when dreaming ...
https://www.apple.com/shop/refurbished/mac
The problem here is the M processor/memory/ssd nightmare that Apple dishes out.
Macmini m4pros are nice…except they can heat up quite badly/quickly…and…regular m4 only has 4P cores…so meh
MacBook pros hurt that wallet…and our last MacBook Pro got closed with an eraser tip in it and destroyed the entire screen…so not build quite tough and it was heavy. (weight)
Never get an m3 for music they didn’t fair well and went away quite quickly…
Always check Pcores vs Ecores and M chips are all about the ram…and since it’s configured on purchase the more the better….never under 16gb ram with M…32 is a sweet spot.
March is around the corner…see what drops at Apple…maybe?
8 Performance cores are plenty for music production 24gb is a nice place to start in ram. Logic Pro will not address the E cores at this time…so they are useless unless you are doing graphic ops
This is all solid advice!
I think RAM will be the biggest contributor to service life. You can save money on storage by using external storage and put that savings into more RAM. It will pay off in the long run. The recommendation to start with 24GB is solid, I would do 32+ if you can. The more files you can keep cached in RAM, the faster the system is going to feel.
For reference, I'm using an M1 Max that I ordered on the day they were announced in the MacBook Pro, and it has no issues at all. I'm throwing a lot at it on a daily basis, and have been 7 days a week since I got it 3+ years ago. I maxed out the RAM (64GB) and did a mild storage upgrade. I'm reaching a point now where I need more RAM, but I'd guess it would be another 2-3 years before this CPU started to feel old for large audio projects specifically.
YMMV, I have a somewhat extreme use-case.
Cool. Thanks guys. I like the idea of buying a gen or two back proc-wise.
This seems... "Good" https://www.amazon.com/Late-Apple-MacBook-Space-Renewed/dp/B09V5RWQXY
But damn... $1500 for a 4 year old refurb...
Oh well, I'll prob wait until the Apple Event as I'm not in a super-hurry...
Apple direct is often surprisingly competitively priced vs. amazon for refurbished product. They generally have fast free shipping as well ... without needing Prime.
I'm not schilling for Apple. I've just had very good luck with Apple Direct for everything from Lightning headphone adapters to refurbished iPads and iPhones.
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The only thing to be aware of with third-party resellers, is they’re unlikely to match Apple’s level of support if anything goes wrong.
I treated myself to a new MacBook Pro M4 Pro at Christmas for music related stuff, and couldn’t resist the £200 cheaper deal via Amazon. However when I got it, the purchase date was incorrect (apparently a common issue, as it’s set when sent to a reseller, rather than when subsequently sold to a customer), meaning I lost a few weeks of cover. Apple had to sort out an issue caused by Amazon not updating the date.
So I put the £200 saving towards Applecare so I can go direct to them for support, rather than the somewhat questionable support via a reseller.
I wouldn’t normally bother if buying accessories or iPad’s, but for a pricey laptop I want that peace of mind! Saying all that though, my 2012 MacBook Pro has only just started having issues!
While spec is important, I bought my M3 Air 16gb 256gb simply on the price deal, credit terms and where I could get it from at the time. Yes, I could always want more, but it will run Mainstage and Logic with no issues and I can add storage later. I couldn't afford the 512gb storage at the time, but I would recommend that as the best starting size really.
As you know Apple options are expensive and you can easily double the price no problems. Personally if I was using a computer live, I would get two basic ones and duplicate the setup and have one of those switchers.
I understand that some need the higher spec models, but it's so easy to say....you need this and this minimum and all of a sudden the price is enough to buy a laptop and a new iPad too!
Look hard at your personal needs. Add up what storage you need. Look at what apps you will use. Think about how you will use it and not may use it. Buy accordingly.
Sometimes multiple lower spec devices over a longer period will work out better than just buying the best spec and hoping it covers all your needs for many years.
Depends on what you’re intending to run on them. For example my 2012 MBP still runs Live 10, though the CPU maxes out pretty quickly.
My Intel 2020 MBP runs Live 10 and Logic well, but it glitches when recording audio in Live 11/12.
My M1 Mini runs Live 11/12 well, but some plugins (Spacecraft for example), cause it to freeze up and become unresponsive.
I have none of these issues with the new one.
I personally want to run the latest software, and take advantage of new tools. Unfortunately that means newer kit and higher prices. But anything above and including an M2 Air or Pro though with at least 16gb RAM should be fine for now.
My Mac experience over time has been a happier one than with budget (ish ) PC's which is what my wife prefers.
My MacBook Air from 2010 (!!!) is still in daily use as a multitrack playback machine and virtual drum module with out a glitch ( running Cubase 11 Pro, Superior drummer, Roland V Drum inputs and a monitor mixer on the output). The laptop just "filtered down" as I got newer models ( not very often BTW!) It cant be updated now, but it does what it needs to do. In that time my wife has been through 3 HP laptops which all give up after 2-3 years. She's on the 4th one now.
My main workhorse is a base level 2016 Intel 27" iMac Pro ( 32MB RAM) on which I've post / music for many projects ( mainly docs ) up to 90mim in length, 20-30 tracks of audio. Still handles everything and runs the latest OS with ease. I'm expecting support to end soon ... but a decade is a good run and I know the iMac itself will keep going probably for another decade.
My most recent laptop is a MacBook Pro 14" M1 Pro /16 GB. It came as a part of a big job I did. It IS the most capable Mac I've ever had and will be my main machine when the iMacPro quits being able to run software.... if ever!
Right now I actually use the MacBook Pro for hobby music production and am waiting for LoopyPro to make the desktop jump. It runs a surprising number of iPad apps ( no touch obviously ) but I find it more addressable/connectable than iPads. Although the newer USB iPads are probably better. But I'm not going there again.
My point is that although the Mac looks more expensive in the cart, ( yes extra RAM, SSD Capacity seem absurdly expensive) it does come with a suite of highly capable software ( GarageBand, Photos,Numbers, KeyNote, Pages, Mail, Passwords, iCloud, integration with your iPhone, Apple watch, iPad etc and more) so it can be workhorse out of the box , and in my estimation will last longer than the competition... the Apple build is excellent.
Admittedly a cheaper PC which can be totally replaced every couple of years, means you will always have a modern machine. Bit like leasing a car! My approach is that my more 'expensive machines' now form a network of machines which I leverage together to get things done.
I'm almost at the point of having too many! LOL
No wrong choice though...
Similar experience - my wife had an HP for a couple of years, then a Dell (keyboard broke within a few weeks, and the replacement had different issues that were never fixed) for a further three years, then another HP, until she eventually gave up on it (screen issues) and bought a Kindle for personal use, and company laptop for work.
In the meantime I was still using my 2012 MacBook Pro for music making, and it has only just started having issues (trackpad) - though that could be rectified by using a Bluetooth trackpad. It’s now setup in a separate room hooked up to speakers as a music player.
My 5 year old Intel MacBook Pro is used daily for work and (surprisingly) shows 100% battery performance. I still get a day’s work on it with a single charge. It’s a bit sluggish for recording audio though, hence the new M4 Pro for music making.
Macs have a relatively high initial cost, but when you take into account their longevity, they work out good value overall.
Refurbished 2015 MacBook Pro here. Still going strong except the webcam didn't survive the wife spilling a glass of water on the table. Everything else survived after a day drying out. Runs Live lite and FL Studio like a champ, even most of the FL Studio demo projects. Love the integration with the iPad (though wish iDAM had two-way audio).
35 year career supporting mostly Windows computers. I've no complaints with them other than totally annoying marketing upsell approach from Windows 10 onward. I've never looked back since getting the MacBook Pro though.
Normally I avoid anything refurbished like the plague as I have had bad experiences with refurbished purchases in the past, but I have never heard anyone fault Apple’s refurbished gear. They definitely seem to stand out in a buying option that can be somewhat of a crap shoot.
Yeh, I don't even trust official Amazon Renewed products.
I have a M1 8Gb MacBook Air and the equivalent Mac mini and have never had any issues running Logic/Reason etc. with loads of soft synths etc. I don’t know how it does it. A minor miracle.
I'm thinking that what may make more sense is to use the ipad for "mobile"/couch stuff and get a Mac Mini for desktop. The odds of me wanting or needed a full, super-powered laptop on my, well lap, seem pretty low when I can use AUM, all the apps, etc. etc. that I like to use for jamming/playing, then the Mac Mini can be on the desk for when I want my multiple, large monitors, which I'd do with a laptop anyhoo... And the Mac Mini's ('cept for the M4Pro) are not priced as goofy as the laptops, and the onboard storage is not as big a deal when you can slab external HD's at it cheaply...
I have a Mac Mini and a Mac Air. Both M1, same specs etc. and I use the laptop wayyyyy more.
Having a Macbook and iPad on the go is much more useful. The Mac Mini basically became my entertainment computer.