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Issue with Tonex PEDAL and XY Pad
I have an issue that I’d like to see if anybody else has encountered running Loopy Pro to bidirectionally sync my guitar effects pedal board, specifically with the XY pad control, in Loopy Pro. I’ve connected Loopy Pro to my toneX PEDAL using a USB midi interface. When attempting to update the gain parameter and another effect with the XY control in Loopy Pro I have no issues updating the setting in the TONEX with Loopy Pro. But , when I attempt to update the XY values FROM the tone X pedal on the display in Loopy Pro, my tone X pedal reboots when I’m turning the gain knob on my TONEX pedal. While the Loopy Pro XY control is visually updated, the updates in the UI jump around as I twist the gain knob on the TONEX pedal. I don’t know if this makes sense to the reader, but I’m really curious if there’s a bug in Loopy Pro, or an issue with a Tonex pedal causing this issue, or perhaps I have something configured incorrectly. I think I might create a video to explain the issue since it is complicated, but first I wanted to check here and see if it rings any bells. Thanks for reading and appreciate any insights.
Comments
To simplify troubleshooting, set up a slider that sends the midi message for the gain. What midi message is it?
Can you add the pedal as a midi source to Loopy Pro’s mixer?
If so, get the ShowMidi midi monitor plugin and make it a destination of the pedal. When you turn the gain knob on the pedal , what midi is received?
If you move the slider in Loopy Pro, does midi come back to Show Midi?
Have you set up any midi bindings from the pedal?
Big thank you for the resopnse.
Steps taken:
Outcome: Slider moved in Loopy Pro successfully updates Gain value on Tonex Pedal
Outcome: ShowMidi receives CH1 CC102 0-127 when twiddling the gain knob on ToneX Pedal.
Happy to take any additional steps to triage this. Please advise if the above sheds any light or additional details are needed.
Thanks!
Mike
When you move the slider in Loopy, does MIDI come back from the pedal?
So, you aren't getting a crash with the slider?
What was the XY Pad sending?
One last thing, to bind the slider to update upon turning the knob on the tonex pedal, i am simply going into midi learn, tap the slider, turn the gain knob on the tonex pedal and then close midi learn. the result is periodic restarting of the ToneX pedal when twisting the gain knob. I'm not sure if i'm doing something incorrect but the 2 way communication does work a bit before ToneX bounces.
Midi comes back from the pedal when i move the slider in Loopy - seems to work as expected.
The slider test also does crash after i do the midi learn and then twist the gain knob on Tonex Pedal as mentioned above . Communications from Loopy to ToneX seems to work fine before i try to have loopy update via ToneX knob twiddle - updating loopy from ToneX Pedal interface causes some erratic updating in Loopy and periodic restarts of the pedal.
XY Pad was set similarly. If i can get this to work on the slider, it will probably resolve the XY Pad and personally, the slider is sufficient for what i need (didn't need the Y value in my prior test).
It sounds like you have created a midi feedback loop. Your slider is sending a message , the pedal sends it back. Because you midi learned the midi coming back, it triggers the slider which sends it back.
See if the the tonex pedal can turn off its midi thru of the messages it receives. You don’t want the pedal to send back what it receives
I agree. I was thinking this may be the case as well. However, when I turn Midi Thru off on the Tonex, no messages get sent from the Tonex when I do a Midi Learn setup in Loopy. Tonex Pedal doesn't have a setting for Midi Out that works. Midi Thru options in the ToneX Pedal are Off / Thru / Merge. Off - no signal received by Loopy on knob twist. Thru - Results in the restart. Merge - Same result as Thru. I have the latest firmware for the ToneX Pedal. Are there any work arounds/devices that may be explored to handle this?
When you turn Midi Thru off on the pedal, the pedal doesn’t send midi when you turn the knob on the pedal?
Correct. I just confirmed with ShowMidi that nothing is received by the ipad when Thru is set to Off. When Thru is set to Thru or Merge, CC102 data is received on Channel 1.
That is an unfortunate design. One thing you can try is to remove the send midi message from your slider—so it has no actions—and midi learn from the pedal.
is there a way to turn off midi-thru in loopy pro? this seems like a needed option?
There is no midi thru unless you set it up. You set it up by sending midi to a device that sends it back and telling loopy pro to send out that same midi message when it is received.
@Mwittmer did you try what I suggested? (Removing the send midi action? I am not sure it will work but it is worth a try. The Tonec behavior is unfortunate).
I will try it out and report back. Thanks.
When removing the midi send action, i can no longer update the gain value on the tonex pedal from loopy but updating loopy by twisting the gain knob on tonex pedal does work as expected. As a test, i confirmed that static values can be passed using other actions for the slider control, like Release or Double Tap, but since the slider sends incremental values based on the slider position, reboots occur. It would be nice to have an “on release” option for the slider which would only transmit the last value/position to the device, but that may be a small use case requirement.
In Control Settings, find the midi interface the midi is going to and make sure midi feedback is turned on.
Done. I confirmed it was already set to enabled.
Unfortunately, I think you are stuck with one-way communication if the only way for Tonex to send midi is with its thru mode on. It is an unfortunate design choice on their part.
You might want to contact iK to find out if there is a way to have the pedal send midi when thru mode is off.
There might be a complicated way to route midi from the panel into streambyter and midi binding from streambyter to the slider (rather than direct from the midi port) and have moving the fader mute streambyter. But I don’t have the time to experiment with that.
appreciate the time spent on this inquery, regardless of the outcome. thank you.