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Need some help crafting a tone on Nembrini's DC30.

maxxpower18maxxpower18
in App Tips and Tricks

So I love the Nembrini amps sims, but I've noticed that they distort a lot faster than the real amps when cranking up the gain. I've seen videos of people playing the AC30 Top Boost at like gain 6 and it still sounds somewhat clean, but if I do that with DC30 I get the British Invasion distortion sound.

I'm trying to craft the perfect edge of breakup tone. Any advice?

Comments

  • uncledaveuncledave

    You might try lowering the input level. Some amp sims are calibrated to work with -12 dB input level. That leaves some headroom for transients.

  • SchmotownSchmotown

    Try turning down the gain on your interface, maybe all the way down, then adjust the input gain in the app. I got this idea from @Rob_Jackson_Music, I think, and it’s really helped. BTW, it seems to work well for all amp SIMs, not specifically Nembrini.

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    Interesting, so turning the gain down on the interface and turning the input gain up from 0 in the app? Won't my DI recording be very weak?

  • Rob_Jackson_MusicRob_Jackson_Music
    edited July 18

    Well... opinions seem to differ on this, and it was a hot topic with all the guitar YouTubers for a while.

    But, the general consensus seems to be that folks are hitting amp sims with a signal that's way too hot.

    It's where you adjust the gain is where folks got confused, myself included. :#

    So I was doing this as @Schmotown mentioned, but I have since tweaked my approach according to the latest "online wisdom". ;)

    So say you want to adjust by -12dB as @uncledave suggests.

    Instead of making that adjustment using the input gain of your interface, set the input level of the interface so it's "healthy", i.e. not clipping and using a good amount of the dynamic input range.

    This is probably what most people do, that didn't get sucked in to the first wave of the online discussion.

    Here's the important bit:

    Then, take 12dB off inside the digital signal chain, before it hits your amp sim.

    FWIW, this is what I do now, and the desired results are pretty much the same (gain-wise), but the signal to noise ratio of your guitar signal coming in, is much better.

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Well... opinions seem to differ on this, and it was a hot topic with all the guitar YouTubers for a while.

    But, the general consensus seems to be that folks are hitting amp sims with a signal that's way too hot.

    It's where you adjust the gain is where folks got confused, myself included. :#

    So I was doing this as @Schmotown mentioned, but I have since tweaked my approach according to the latest "online wisdom". ;)

    So say you want to adjust by -12dB as @uncledave suggests.

    Instead of making that adjustment using the input gain of your interface, set the input level of the interface so it's "healthy", i.e. not clipping and using a good amount of the dynamic input range.

    This is probably what most people do, that didn't get sucked in to the first wave of the online discussion.

    Here's the important bit:

    Then, take 12dB off inside the digital signal chain, before it hits your amp sim.

    FWIW, this is what I do now, and the desired results are pretty much the same (gain-wise), but the signal to noise ratio of your guitar signal coming in, is much better.

    I'll play around with this. Appreciate it.

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Well... opinions seem to differ on this, and it was a hot topic with all the guitar YouTubers for a while.

    But, the general consensus seems to be that folks are hitting amp sims with a signal that's way too hot.

    It's where you adjust the gain is where folks got confused, myself included. :#

    So I was doing this as @Schmotown mentioned, but I have since tweaked my approach according to the latest "online wisdom". ;)

    So say you want to adjust by -12dB as @uncledave suggests.

    Instead of making that adjustment using the input gain of your interface, set the input level of the interface so it's "healthy", i.e. not clipping and using a good amount of the dynamic input range.

    This is probably what most people do, that didn't get sucked in to the first wave of the online discussion.

    Here's the important bit:

    Then, take 12dB off inside the digital signal chain, before it hits your amp sim.

    FWIW, this is what I do now, and the desired results are pretty much the same (gain-wise), but the signal to noise ratio of your guitar signal coming in, is much better.

    Wait, now that I read it over again, are you saying that I should turn down my fader for the track down by -12dB? That wouldn't work because as you mix the song I don't want my guitar's distortion to go up and down as I mess with the fader. Are you saying that for example in the DC30 app I should turn down the input volume there instead?

  • espiegel123espiegel123

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Well... opinions seem to differ on this, and it was a hot topic with all the guitar YouTubers for a while.

    But, the general consensus seems to be that folks are hitting amp sims with a signal that's way too hot.

    It's where you adjust the gain is where folks got confused, myself included. :#

    So I was doing this as @Schmotown mentioned, but I have since tweaked my approach according to the latest "online wisdom". ;)

    So say you want to adjust by -12dB as @uncledave suggests.

    Instead of making that adjustment using the input gain of your interface, set the input level of the interface so it's "healthy", i.e. not clipping and using a good amount of the dynamic input range.

    This is probably what most people do, that didn't get sucked in to the first wave of the online discussion.

    Here's the important bit:

    Then, take 12dB off inside the digital signal chain, before it hits your amp sim.

    FWIW, this is what I do now, and the desired results are pretty much the same (gain-wise), but the signal to noise ratio of your guitar signal coming in, is much better.

    Wait, now that I read it over again, are you saying that I should turn down my fader for the track down by -12dB? That wouldn't work because as you mix the song I don't want my guitar's distortion to go up and down as I mess with the fader. Are you saying that for example in the DC30 app I should turn down the input volume there instead?

    He is saying put a gain plugin before the amp sim that you can use to reduce/adjust the level going into the amp sim. He isn’t suggesting using the channel fader to adjust the volume.

    Note that the Nembrini sims have an input gain adjustment on the rack page … but it is a hassle to use.

  • Rob_Jackson_MusicRob_Jackson_Music

    Yep, as @espiegel123 says.

    If you want to get into the science weeds of it all, this was the video that convinced me I was wrong:

    https://youtu.be/gJ59h7xfvdI?si=EFJ9fmSCPg0ls9zc

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @espiegel123 said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Well... opinions seem to differ on this, and it was a hot topic with all the guitar YouTubers for a while.

    But, the general consensus seems to be that folks are hitting amp sims with a signal that's way too hot.

    It's where you adjust the gain is where folks got confused, myself included. :#

    So I was doing this as @Schmotown mentioned, but I have since tweaked my approach according to the latest "online wisdom". ;)

    So say you want to adjust by -12dB as @uncledave suggests.

    Instead of making that adjustment using the input gain of your interface, set the input level of the interface so it's "healthy", i.e. not clipping and using a good amount of the dynamic input range.

    This is probably what most people do, that didn't get sucked in to the first wave of the online discussion.

    Here's the important bit:

    Then, take 12dB off inside the digital signal chain, before it hits your amp sim.

    FWIW, this is what I do now, and the desired results are pretty much the same (gain-wise), but the signal to noise ratio of your guitar signal coming in, is much better.

    Wait, now that I read it over again, are you saying that I should turn down my fader for the track down by -12dB? That wouldn't work because as you mix the song I don't want my guitar's distortion to go up and down as I mess with the fader. Are you saying that for example in the DC30 app I should turn down the input volume there instead?

    He is saying put a gain plugin before the amp sim that you can use to reduce/adjust the level going into the amp sim. He isn’t suggesting using the channel fader to adjust the volume.

    Note that the Nembrini sims have an input gain adjustment on the rack page … but it is a hassle to use.

    Oh right, I completely forgot about gain adjusting plugins lol. Yeah the older Nembrini plugins on the iPad don't show you how many dBs you're actually lowering. The Range 120 one does though, but I'll use the Logic Pro gain plugin.

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Yep, as @espiegel123 says.

    If you want to get into the science weeds of it all, this was the video that convinced me I was wrong:

    https://youtu.be/gJ59h7xfvdI?si=EFJ9fmSCPg0ls9zc

    Math, fuck yeah! Unfortunately the spreadsheet doesn't include Nembrini amps but I'll play it by ear.

  • JanKunJanKun
    edited July 19

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Yep, as @espiegel123 says.

    If you want to get into the science weeds of it all, this was the video that convinced me I was wrong:

    https://youtu.be/gJ59h7xfvdI?si=EFJ9fmSCPg0ls9zc

    Math, fuck yeah! Unfortunately the spreadsheet doesn't include Nembrini amps but I'll play it by ear.

    Nembrini amps are included on the spreadsheet

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @JanKun said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @Rob_Jackson_Music said:
    Yep, as @espiegel123 says.

    If you want to get into the science weeds of it all, this was the video that convinced me I was wrong:

    https://youtu.be/gJ59h7xfvdI?si=EFJ9fmSCPg0ls9zc

    Math, fuck yeah! Unfortunately the spreadsheet doesn't include Nembrini amps but I'll play it by ear.

    Nembrini amps are included on the spreadsheet

    Oops, thanks.

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    I'm really glad I asked this question. I never really liked Nembrini's Soldano amp sim, I thought it sounded too artificial in its distortion, but it was probably because the signal being fed to the amp sim was way too hot.

  • SamuSamu

    @maxxpower18 said:
    I'm really glad I asked this question. I never really liked Nembrini's Soldano amp sim, I thought it sounded too artificial in its distortion, but it was probably because the signal being fed to the amp sim was way too hot.

    This is also something I bumped into when I got the Nembrini Orange amp way back, feed it with too hot signal and it sounds meh, lower the input level and it shines :sunglasses:

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @Samu said:

    @maxxpower18 said:
    I'm really glad I asked this question. I never really liked Nembrini's Soldano amp sim, I thought it sounded too artificial in its distortion, but it was probably because the signal being fed to the amp sim was way too hot.

    This is also something I bumped into when I got the Nembrini Orange amp way back, feed it with too hot signal and it sounds meh, lower the input level and it shines :sunglasses:

    That one sounded pretty decent even with a hot signal so I'm sure it's gonna sing with a proper gain staged signal.

  • ecouecou

    Interesting discussion. I will have to try it tomorrow. I never seem to get a satisfying sound with Nembrini amps. My favourite being Aurora DSP Dead kitty and Ironheart

  • maxxpower18maxxpower18

    @ecou said:
    Interesting discussion. I will have to try it tomorrow. I never seem to get a satisfying sound with Nembrini amps. My favourite being Aurora DSP Dead kitty and Ironheart

    I'm gonna try it with Rhino and Goblyn.

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