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Reflections about a MIDI workflow

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  • edited June 2017
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  • I went through the exact same thought process as you are going through now......
    The honest answer is that i still haven't fully sorted a utopia workflow for including Gadget into a MIDI setup.
    I have tried using ModStep/AUM - Cubasis- Auria Pro.......

    At the end of the day I keep returning to stand alone Gadget for its sheer speed and simplicity (no virtual wiring required). and then export the individual Audio tracks (available export option in gadget) once I am ready to start a proper mix...

  • edited June 2017
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  • Are you on iPhone or iPad?

    @tja said:
    Sad thing, though.

    I love all my new Synths and I still like Gadget.

    Using them early in the work flow, is difficult....

    So, maybe only use them for the final mix and stay in a DAW with internal Synths or AU only till satisfied with the results...

    But I just cannot start with Gadget, needing my instruments and sequencers to start.

  • edited June 2017
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  • Imo gadget is one of those apps that you dont integrate to other apps very much, easily, or properly. Instead you do nearly everything on it or use something else. Your workflow sounds like you should be using something else, unless gadget has a midi export(which i remember it not having, but not sure).

    Why not just use so e sequencer or daws sequencer instead of gadget? I think both cubasis and auria can do what you want.

  • Remember, as long as an app has MIDI OUT you can always feed it into Gadget for recording MIDI and only need to do this if you want to use sound sources outside of Gadget....There are other ways of doing this too with AUM/Modstep for example...or even Cubasis/AUM/ModStep/Many other apps......but I'll use Cubasis as an example.

    Start your Cubasis project.....create some midi tracks and send then to whatever IAA/AU synths you like.

    Now for the 'Virtual wiring' I mentioned before.....
    When you want to use Gadget, load Gadget in Cubasis onto an Audio track (Not a midi one)....make sure Gadget is in 'Advanced MIDI' mode in the settings (this allows you to select different MIDI devices and channels for input into the tracks)
    This Audio track is now acting as a Bus Master for the gadget tracks.....

    Now create more MIDI tracks in Cubasis and send their output to the tracks you setup in Gadget, use the Gadget mixer to balance the gadget tracks together....and use Cubasis for composing the MIDI.

    When you are ready to commit to audio you can either
    Just record the mixed audio from Gadget onto the Stereo Audio track you have it loaded in Cubasis
    OR
    Mute your Gadget MIDI tracks in Cubasis so that only one synth is playing at a time, record onto the Cubasis Audio track, once the track is recorded move the audio onto another Audio track, change the mutes and record the next Gadget track.
    OR
    Create a bunch of 16 bar scenes in Gadget....then record the MIDI from Cubasis into Gadget, then export the Audio as individual tracks from Gadget and import into Cubasis (For this option you will need to use MIDI sync to keep Gadget and Cubasis in sync when recording the MIDI, set Cubasis as MIDI Clock Master and Gadget as External Clock)

    Another option you have is to start something with whatever apps you like, then import the audio into Gadget (Zurich) from your other seq's / synths...and work in Gadget without all the virtual wiring.

  • @AndyPlankton said:
    Remember, as long as an app has MIDI OUT you can always feed it into Gadget for recording MIDI and only need to do this if you want to use sound sources outside of Gadget....There are other ways of doing this too with AUM/Modstep for example...or even Cubasis/AUM/ModStep/Many other apps......but I'll use Cubasis as an example.

    Start your Cubasis project.....create some midi tracks and send then to whatever IAA/AU synths you like.

    Now for the 'Virtual wiring' I mentioned before.....
    When you want to use Gadget, load Gadget in Cubasis onto an Audio track (Not a midi one)....make sure Gadget is in 'Advanced MIDI' mode in the settings (this allows you to select different MIDI devices and channels for input into the tracks)
    This Audio track is now acting as a Bus Master for the gadget tracks.....

    Now create more MIDI tracks in Cubasis and send their output to the tracks you setup in Gadget, use the Gadget mixer to balance the gadget tracks together....and use Cubasis for composing the MIDI.

    When you are ready to commit to audio you can either
    Just record the mixed audio from Gadget onto the Stereo Audio track you have it loaded in Cubasis
    OR
    Mute your Gadget MIDI tracks in Cubasis so that only one synth is playing at a time, record onto the Cubasis Audio track, once the track is recorded move the audio onto another Audio track, change the mutes and record the next Gadget track.
    OR
    Create a bunch of 16 bar scenes in Gadget....then record the MIDI from Cubasis into Gadget, then export the Audio as individual tracks from Gadget and import into Cubasis (For this option you will need to use MIDI sync to keep Gadget and Cubasis in sync when recording the MIDI, set Cubasis as MIDI Clock Master and Gadget as External Clock)

    Another option you have is to start something with whatever apps you like, then import the audio into Gadget (Zurich) from your other seq's / synths...and work in Gadget without all the virtual wiring.

    Wow! This was informational and superb. My head is squeaking right now around this workflow/midi/audio. Right now Ím testing the Auria Pro I bougth a Yeah ago and Never really used as a midi handler for all my plugs and synths. But that only wrecks my head in more troubles. Think Im going back to Gadget witch I really like more and more. And I hope I can start make some audio soon.

  • edited June 2017
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  • edited June 2017
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  • edited June 2017
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  • I like Gadget's sequencer and interface and, with its sonic capability, for some music it's the best start of a workflow. Having most of its gadgets, for me it's a reliable sketchpad, with no messing around connecting things, and with a range of sound more than I can get my head around with all the possibilities. It can export all tracks individually as MIDI and audio. If I couldn't put together from scratch a decent start or representation of a song or piece with it, then I wouldn't use it. I'd just use some of the Korg standalone apps in a DAW rather than as gadgets.

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  • You can export all gadget tracks as individual tracks in one step.

    Aum/modstep has the same limitation, it is gadget only having stereo out.

    Yes in Cubasis load Gadget as IAA on audio track. This is essentially the same thing you would do using aum/modstep.

  • @marcuspresident said:

    @AndyPlankton said:
    Remember, as long as an app has MIDI OUT you can always feed it into Gadget for recording MIDI and only need to do this if you want to use sound sources outside of Gadget....There are other ways of doing this too with AUM/Modstep for example...or even Cubasis/AUM/ModStep/Many other apps......but I'll use Cubasis as an example.

    Start your Cubasis project.....create some midi tracks and send then to whatever IAA/AU synths you like.

    Now for the 'Virtual wiring' I mentioned before.....
    When you want to use Gadget, load Gadget in Cubasis onto an Audio track (Not a midi one)....make sure Gadget is in 'Advanced MIDI' mode in the settings (this allows you to select different MIDI devices and channels for input into the tracks)
    This Audio track is now acting as a Bus Master for the gadget tracks.....

    Now create more MIDI tracks in Cubasis and send their output to the tracks you setup in Gadget, use the Gadget mixer to balance the gadget tracks together....and use Cubasis for composing the MIDI.

    When you are ready to commit to audio you can either
    Just record the mixed audio from Gadget onto the Stereo Audio track you have it loaded in Cubasis
    OR
    Mute your Gadget MIDI tracks in Cubasis so that only one synth is playing at a time, record onto the Cubasis Audio track, once the track is recorded move the audio onto another Audio track, change the mutes and record the next Gadget track.
    OR
    Create a bunch of 16 bar scenes in Gadget....then record the MIDI from Cubasis into Gadget, then export the Audio as individual tracks from Gadget and import into Cubasis (For this option you will need to use MIDI sync to keep Gadget and Cubasis in sync when recording the MIDI, set Cubasis as MIDI Clock Master and Gadget as External Clock)

    Another option you have is to start something with whatever apps you like, then import the audio into Gadget (Zurich) from your other seq's / synths...and work in Gadget without all the virtual wiring.

    Wow! This was informational and superb. My head is squeaking right now around this workflow/midi/audio. Right now Ím testing the Auria Pro I bougth a Yeah ago and Never really used as a midi handler for all my plugs and synths. But that only wrecks my head in more troubles. Think Im going back to Gadget witch I really like more and more. And I hope I can start make some audio soon.

    Yw......for Auria you do it the same ways as described above.

  • @tja said:

    @AndyPlankton said:
    Remember, as long as an app has MIDI OUT you can always feed it into Gadget for recording MIDI and only need to do this if you want to use sound sources outside of Gadget....There are other ways of doing this too with AUM/Modstep for example...or even Cubasis/AUM/ModStep/Many other apps......but I'll use Cubasis as an example.

    I seem to read already about some method to handle MIDI with Gadget, AUM and modstep.
    But I don't know modstep right now.... no idea what would be possible.

    When you want to use Gadget, load Gadget in Cubasis onto an Audio track (Not a midi one)....make sure Gadget is in 'Advanced MIDI' mode in the settings (this allows you to select different MIDI devices and channels for input into the tracks)
    This Audio track is now acting as a Bus Master for the gadget tracks.....

    Gadget as IAA for the Audio track in Cubasis?

    Yes

    When you are ready to commit to audio you can either
    Just record the mixed audio from Gadget onto the Stereo Audio track you have it loaded in Cubasis
    OR
    Mute your Gadget MIDI tracks in Cubasis so that only one synth is playing at a time, record onto the Cubasis Audio track, once the track is recorded move the audio onto another Audio track, change the mutes and record the next Gadget track.
    OR
    Create a bunch of 16 bar scenes in Gadget....then record the MIDI from Cubasis into Gadget, then export the Audio as individual tracks from Gadget and import into Cubasis (For this option you will need to use MIDI sync to keep Gadget and Cubasis in sync when recording the MIDI, set Cubasis as MIDI Clock Master and Gadget as External Clock)

    I don't like to record the mixed Audio. Maybe I want to use Auria Pro for further refinement.

    The process for Auria is exactly the same

    I think, only method 2) or 3) are valid....

    Another option you have is to start something with whatever apps you like, then import the audio into Gadget (Zurich) from your other seq's / synths...and work in Gadget without all the virtual wiring.

    Noooooooo ;-)

    Thanks for your explanation!

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  • If you export and choose Dropbox, you have option for All tracks.....this is only available for Dropbox as AudioShare and audio copy only handle single files

  • edited June 2017
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  • @tja said:

    @ToMess said:
    Imo gadget is one of those apps that you dont integrate to other apps very much, easily, or properly. Instead you do nearly everything on it or use something else. Your workflow sounds like you should be using something else, unless gadget has a midi export(which i remember it not having, but not sure).

    Why not just use so e sequencer or daws sequencer instead of gadget? I think both cubasis and auria can do what you want.

    Exactly this is my problem.
    Gadget has MIDI file export, and only to Dropbox - that's all.
    So, it gets more tedious and also more sequential... Track by track

    But in general, this is the case with any Synth outside of a DAW, if it is neither internal or at least an AU.

    So, my reasoning was, that - for my idea of a workflow - it may be best to just start and stay with Cubasis until I am "finished" and can try to use others Synth to get the Audio.

    Just curious how other people think about this and handle this.

    Well i dont have one clear path to anything ios, stuff is always changing. Im pretty sure ill stick with bm3 when it comes out, i currently do have the beta and its exactly what i want. Before it i didnt have any strict path, but it was always changing. What i ended up to before bm3 was AUM as the mixer and synth/app host, sometimes ab2 as well. Basically i have found that AUs are so handy that there arent many synths i use that arent AU(odyssei and model15 are the only ones i think, and troublemaker for its nice sequencer), and i dont use any effects that arent AU, except maybe filtatron again one day. Basicaly i hosted all apps to aum or audiobus then routed them to blocs wave to record the audio(some apps i recorded early on, some only at the end), these loops i exported to ableton to build the structure of the song(i like this way more than using ipad daws for this). Example would be something like these running on AUM or on AB fed to AUM: imaschine for drums, one shots and maybe some synth pattern, troublemaker for not a 303, few instances of poison 202 as AU with FX AUs fed into blocs wave and recorded without sequencing, or sequenced with midisteps for example.

  • edited June 2017
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  • @tja said:

    @lovadamusic said:
    I like Gadget's sequencer and interface and, with its sonic capability, for some music it's the best start of a workflow. Having most of its gadgets, for me it's a reliable sketchpad, with no messing around connecting things, and with a range of sound more than I can get my head around with all the possibilities.

    Yes, I started in the same way...

    But I want to make use of my MIDI sequencers :-)
    Also, currently I have the feeling that Genome fits me better that the step sequencer in Gadget. But I am just exploring, so we will see ...

    It can export all tracks individually as MIDI and audio.

    Yes, but MIDI just as file to Dropbox.
    And, as far as understood, Audi also one by one, not multiple together.

    If I couldn't put together from scratch a decent start or representation of a song or piece with it, then I wouldn't use it. I'd just use some of the Korg standalone apps in a DAW rather than as gadgets.

    I was hesitating to get iM1, iM-20, Module and ARP ODYSSEI from KORG, even if they are on my wishlist.
    First, all them them cost a bunch of money.
    Currently more, that I would like to spend easy - I already have some Synth, too much for my knowledge already.
    Also, they may contain further IAP which cost even more!

    I planed to spend the next money on the Cubasis IAP and some of the Auria Pro's.
    The later are quite expensive in summary :-O

    I don't have a single workflow. I don't aspire to have one. Gadget is just one great way to make music in an all-in-one easy package. It can either be an experimental environment to discover and put together ideas, or if you already have a more developed concept, you can choose if Gadget's a good place to start realizing it.

    Auria Pro and Cubasis are very nice DAWs. There are an overwhelming number of other apps to generate sounds and sequence them, and I use many of them too. I don't really see an app as a set of limitations -- rather as opportunities -- but Gadget isn't best for everything. When not, use other apps. Put them together in whatever ways work best for that situation.

    DropBox is my main cloud storage and works well for me. Exporting audio from Gadget is somewhat slow in data transfer, but it's very easy to initiate export of all audio and MIDI tracks. Once exported, there are countless ways to incorporate those tracks and other apps into a final product.

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  • edited August 2017
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  • edited August 2017

    OP

    Tell me what type of music you want to make?

    I THINK that matters, but that is just me.

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