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Comments
That's for sure, but, I'm convinced that every AX10-equipped iPad Pro sold has this problem, but, if you really wants an iPad Pro I can't see why wait...?
This must be something Apple can adjust with some software update - otherwise, we demand to have new ones in the fall... It must be hundreds of thousands sold so far...
I'm waiting because for $800 it should just work and I can "demand" all I want but that doesn't mean apple "has" to do anything about it. I'm not desperate to buy something that's broken. They can have my money when it works without the hoop jumping.
I actually agree with him. apple isn't really obligated to fix this. And other than this forum barely anyone is complaining about it. Musicians barely represent 0.5% of the market so it might actually go unfixed. I'm waiting to see how it goes before I pay for the device since my primary use is music. And almost 70% of the time I'm using it without an audio interface.
Here in the U.K. we have statutory rights and in it's current state the argument could easily be made that the iPad Pro 2017 is not fit for purpose. So I would say they are obligated to fix it or refund the monies paid for it. I do hope that this is a software fault that can be fairly easily fixed.
My concern would be proving to Apple that it "is not fit for purpose". I could easily go into an Apple Store and have the guy say "does it play iTunes ok? Yes? Then we aren't refunding your money". Not worth the hassle to me. To me it's like buying a car where the headlights eventually stop working and I have to pull over and stop the car to get them to work again. Why would I ever buy a car knowing that was a problem and "hope" they come out with a fix? Then when I take it back they'd be "well you knew it didn't work going in, sir. No return for you".
I'm loving mine.
Side note: You mentioned using the lightning headphone adapter... did you notice any difference in sound quality at all going via lighting adapter vs headphone jack?
I can answer on that...
I bought this adapter (lightning/3.5mm) just to test the latency thing with the analog output.
And, the only differences I could discover was that the lightning output volume was lower gain than the analog output...
The sound quality was pretty equally...
While it's still on sale it still has to be 'fit for purpose' or a statement describing it's limitations. The purpose I refer to is music production in a professional manner.
I rarely spend more than a few minutes playing around with the countless music apps I have acquired on my iPad 3 64 GB and more recently on my iPad Pro 10.5 256 GB. Usually it's been on my couch through the speaker(s) or earbuds and occasionally in my studio through a Griffin interface.
Because of this thread (and perhaps a drink or two) I decided to extend the experience with my new couch setup. I created a Gadget file using an Akai Synthstation 25 on a Dublin bass, a Korg microKey Air (wired) on Darwin, an original Korg USB pad on Milpitas, an electric guitar on Resario, and Gladstone playing a prerecorded beat. All this going through a powered USB hub into the Lightning CCK. The audio coming out of the headphone jack into the auxiliary in of a Fender Frontman 15G (not neutral sounding but still less ear wear).
It has been more than two hours now and there is absolutely no apparent latency with any of the controllers or guitar. The outcome may be different if the Lightning cable was not in use but that test will have to be at another time.
Just wanted to add that I am extremely happy with this iPad Pro. The size is perfect and the extra ram, processor speed, and storage relieves my mind regarding future proofing my experience if only for few generations of hardware.
I just got a new iPad Pro and haven't experienced any significant problems yet. It's a multi-purpose computer device that probably works well enough for 99% of buyers. What computer device doesn't come with some OS glitches? And I don't see Apple marketing any iOS devices explicitly for music production, but even for musicians, many can get around this problem well enough. And it's unrealistic to think that Apple is going to include statements describing limitations for anything, much less a niche market. What product comes with such a thing? If a device is flawed in some way, potential buyers must find out through independent review specific to their desired use of it.
It seems pretty simple. No guarantees that the problem will get fixed. Don't know if one can count on a refund. So just don't buy it if it won't get the job done for you today. Possibly buy it in the future if that changes.
So if the Apple Pencil, doesn't work as expected or the CCK doesn't allow the connection of anything other than a camera, in your opinion that situation would be fine for those that have them because they are a minority of users. I never said the iPad was marketed exclusively as a music product. I don't expect Apple to describe the new 'Pro' has limitations compared to earlier models, but I reasonably expect them to correct any problems.
While the latest iPad Pro´s are now available here (in Germany) for close to €100 less than from Apple itself it´s getting interesting again but all the things about the latency issues would be a no-go for me. I mean it would be the main thing i use it for and i don´t have an audio interface and use for 99% of the time headphones (AKG K702).
I would not accept any workarounds.....here is where my love would end with Apple.
So i would wait until the official release of iOS 11 and see if that change or at least if it´s clear what really happens and if just a specific batch has this problem.
I´m also thinking to buy the new Macbook Pro since i also get the model i want now for about €500 less than from Apple itself. But i´m a bit scared that they might have a similar problem (but didn´t heard anything about this yet).
I don´t think that Apple don´t care since they still offer pro audio apps but it might not be their focus to fix that anytime soon.
Isn´t there any app which works like the activity monitor where you could maybe see what really happens. RAM overload? CPU spikes? Some weird things running in the background?
Like i said before i had a similar problem after an update on my mac and contacted support. They tryed but couldn´t really help and offer me even (outside of my warranty) to come to an apple store and see if they can do something.
But then i investigated in it myself more and found the problem via the activity monitor (like also said it was just some i-cloud key thingie trying to connect to something i disabled when setting up the new OS and it was overloading one core after a few minutes).
Anyway i don´t think this is a hardware fault since there are temporary workarounds to solve it.
We will see.
Will be interesting if the new iPhones (with A11X?) without headphone jack would have the same trouble.
10.5" here - yes there's a gradually appearing latency problem, but found unplugging and reinserting jack seems to solve it. Haven't been able to recreate problem using iTrack dock.
I've heard no problem on ios 11beta, but can anybody confirm?
Latency problem still there on iOS 11 beta 4...
Confirmed
So it slowly comes in rather than appears in a moment. Strange.
On my iPad Pro 12.9” it cycles increasandly 10-12 minutes between the low latency/high latency...
First spot on, then it grows every minute to higher and higher latency to around 200ms... The cycle ending with 30 seconds of crackles in the sound, and, when the noise disappears the latency is back on <5ms...
But, not if a do the unplug/replug-thing of course...
I went to my local Apple Store to chat to any potential music maker staff members and they wasn't aware of the problem.
The guy did say he'd make a ticket to report the tech guys for me (if that happened or not is another matter).
What he did say was that as other celebrity pro musicians will be using the iPad Pro 2 professionally this problem will be heard and solved (eventually). Especially as the unit has 'Pro' in the name, this shouldn't be happening.
For me the latency headphone bug is still very much happening...
Did some tests while getting the audio corruption in bm3 and it looks to me like it's tied to the buffer/ CPU usage. Audio corruption starts , I switch the buffer to 512 and it disappears, switch back to 256 and it's present, 128 present. 512 clear, 256 still there but it gradually fixes itself. This is during a period of around 15 sec. I wonder if it's some CPU throttling, or if the audio process goes into a low priority mode while something else happens in the background and it cannot cope with low buffers.
Yeah, I'm pretty much convinced it's not a hardware problem. If so it wouldn't really work in the first place and wouldn't correct itself when you
change somethinglike unplug and plugin the headphones. I'm wondering if they sourced a new hardware vendor for the internal sound chip and don't have the driver quite right yet.I can confirm the same static issue. After 10 or 15 min crackles start and get worse until unplug and replug headphones. I also disabled the 120 kHz refresh and still have the problem.
iPad Pro 10.5 iOS 10.3
There's something going on. First off, I LOVE my new iPad Pro 10.5. Pry my cold dead fingers, yada-yada, and all that jazz. But yes, there's something going on here.
I noticed an issue related to this "latency" thing that was NOT associated with the sound chip, or headphones.
Not sure how or if this relates, but I noticed that my stylus latency increased when using the ArtRage app if using the highest resolution (4096x4096). So much latency that I could draw a circle, and count 4 seconds until the circle actually drew on screen. But, after I zoomed in, drew something, then backed back out, the latency went away.
ArtRage hasn't been updated in awhile, but I noticed no such latency with the drawing program Procreate. Even with double the resolution canvas, Procreate had no stylus latency at all.
So, there appears to be something at work here between different apps, not being optimized for the new pro chips etc. Procreate is updated regularly, but ArtRage is not.
Although, I think this issue has been mostly blown out of proportion, I DO think there's a problem related specifically to the new Pro iPads. I'd bet a few bucks that it'll be resolved with the public release of iOS11, but I can't be 100% sure of that.
If you want perfect for the premium price Apple commands for these new pro devices, I'd likely hold off to see if the public release of iOS11 fixes them before you drop serious coin on these new iPads. I wouldn't trade mine for the world at this point, but there does seem to be something not quite right that may or may not be resolved by iOS11.
Not sure what this has to do with what I wrote. OS issues are common in computer devices. iOS music-making bugs probably more common. New device with new CPU, even more likely. To see some problems in the new iPad Pro isn’t a huge surprise to me. Apple is certainly working on many things, and at some point they probably get to fixing whatever’s causing this. They may get a relatively small number of complaints. It may be tough to fix. I don’t know. So, personally, if the new iPad Pro wasn’t cutting it for me today, I’d return it, or not have bought it to begin with.
@skiphunt, I'm sure even Apple devs would be interested - if information wasn't ignored somewhere along the communication chain.
Some ios11 beta testers must have reported the problem.
I hate to say it, but this problem doesn't seem to be happening only on the new devices. I've had the latency-and -crackling-issues time and again with Air2, as well as with Pro9.7, in my case mostly with interface connected (kmix/ICM4+). Recently I also noticed issues with latency just switching Apps (it takes a moment to actually graphically represent the switch). And yesterday Logic on my Macbook Pro played up on me, taking various seconds to show newly instantiated Auxiliary-busses.... . I don't own any of the new iPad Models, but my experiences seem very similar to what everybody here goes through.
Unplugging/replugging, hard reset, reboot only work sometimes. No networking, no Wlan, no Bluetooth is activated.
The bad news is, it seems to be a thing more widespread, the good news is, this will also make it more obvious, and fixes will be in place sooner (i believe).
Headaches, but then again, it's nice outside, and I try to take it as a sign to shut down devices, look at gardens and skies and use my feet and breathing organs for a while.... .
Cheers, t
Oh, and I forgot to say: all of this on ios 10 still, no beta here....
@animal I've sometimes wondered if Apple saw the problem years ago for audio work, and thought stopping providing a jack socket would be an easy solution. However, if it appears for artists with the Pen, it makes me think Apple needs to provide their PR employees with deaf aids!
If it's not directly an ios problem, they should add something in Xcode AND make sure devs know about it! Also, they should stop recommending resets without icloud to unhappy users!
Lovely weather :-)
INTUA have acknowledged the problem which is good start...