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Comments
@AndyPlankton
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Yeah agree with the rest, but not:
“Perhaps it is because they want you to buy gadget ?
It will be a business decision and not a technical one...and the same one behind why Gadget is not an AU host.
IAA in essence opens up their stand alone apps as AU would. AU has no reason to make you not buy Gadget any more than the stand alone Korg apps having IAA, excepting that IAA sucks lol
As for hiring the ghost busters - only if Sigorney Weaver (in her younger guise) is still hanging with them!
+2
Here is my concern with the AU thing and music iOS apps in general. There needs to be order for a sustainable and productive environment.
If too much time and effort is dedicated to AU or not there is also AB2 or 3, latest SDK here, latest SDK there, IOS upgrades, LINK, new devices................
I fear too much energy put into the "means of delivery" and not the product may stifle new app ideas and growth.
If developers are spending the last "x"'months retrofitting apps they are not doing new things.
I would like to see iOS exactly mimic the VST/ PC/ MAC world. That has done just fine for ages.
We don't need the wheel re-invented, we do need new app ideas.
I don't get excited for an AU version of an app I have had for 2 years. Not fun. Doesn't give me any new sounds.
I just hope users and developers keep their eyes on the prize. Creative new solutions and sounds making music.
Delivery systems are important, but I think the proportion of effort and concern is not reciprocated for the productivity gains enjoyed by users.
Do an analogy with pharmaceuticals and it is the same thing. People don't care about if it is tablet or a capsule, they want the medicine. If it works well, they will take it.
I use some apps that don't have IAA AB or LINK. Why? Because they fucking rock, that is why.
Too much preoccupation with the means of using apps and not the content will yield less impressive apps in the short term.
Until developers and companies who realize that will be the big winners.
Are you telling me that any of us will stop using Sugar Bytes apps because they aren't AU? NOPE
Animoog, -- nope.
Synthmaster - nope.
Patterning. - nope.
I desire new apps that make new sounds, I don't care what form or communication or method they use.
As long as the midi works and the sound is on point, I don't give a fuck - me buy.
So as far as the future of the music AU app thing.
Well, ultimately whatever will make Apple the most money will happen.
While yes, I have agreed that I can see it can be problematic updating older apps from many perspectives.
However, I do not agree with productivity from the perspective of how much we get done being any negative that attributes to AUs. I find the opposite: I definitely have less issues that distract from making music now that AUs are more common. IAA use just causes so many more problems compared to any issues I have with AU.
I also disagree that AU is just a delivery system. AU Midi especially will make really creative new solutions possible!
Yes, I have stopped using many apps due to them not being AU and not fitting comfortably into a flow of creativity that is getting so much quicker for myself. Yes some are still hanging on in there, but I have spent so much time frustrated with IAA apps. Ones that constantly don’t load before a session and then I have to trace them to conserve my battery life. If I did a time and productivity assessment, then many IAA apps would be flagged, yet I’m not that serious lol. However, I do find that getting rid of many IAA apps has reduced my frustration levels!
Yes:
Patterning deleted!
Synthmaster deleted!
Animoog still hanging on in there! Lmao
Same!
It’s tough isn’t it - I mean that initial getting rid of old friends (apps), but boy is it freeing when you find that they were really not required. I think sometimes half our apps are just there because we feel attached and they form habits
Don’t get me wrong, this is not just about saving time. After all, if I was to quit chatting on here, I would save way more time lol. Nope, it’s about the frustrations AUs relieve (cue bad jokes lol)
Yep not saying AUs have no issues in there current form, but I’m curious to in what way any of the current AUs are that much less usable than there IAA counterparts? Yes, it must make it more difficult from a development perspective when resources are limited, yet maybe it does improve some resource management, which long term as most of us use multiple apps running simultaneously, is important.
Exactly...it is the function and not the form that ultimately matters......
As a developer myself (not iOS or audio) I know that adopting new technologies or methodologies takes time and does slow down your output for a while, and without documentation also brings uncertainty as to wether you are doing it right. So having lots of different technologies to support does bring an overhead...using IAA means that you can have an app that is not dependent on another app in order to run that can also be integrated with other apps when needed.
I guess what would be good to know is if Apple have the known IAA bugs (loading/ghosting) on the fix list or not, and if so what sort of priority do they have.
IAA was just a flawed concept to begin with and is not getting further investments. Problem is a few of developers put significant time into building it into their instruments. So a rewrite could be hard to justify. I think it’s a mistake to use it for new apps though.
I get you, it is the interruption to the creative flow that is the real issue...not the time spent !
AU is not the magic bullet to stop those interruptions......having restrictions on creating patches for example, having to use the 'full' IAA version of an app to create patches...and then use an AU version to play them back is just as interruptive as a ghosted IAA that needs to be closed or restarted.
I'm not saying that IAA is great or that AU is not great, they are both good, and neither perfect for all scenarios.
What will help most is having these technologies bug free and well documented so that developers can trust in them and use them in the correct way.
I took the standpoint some while ago now that IAA bugs are here to stay....and AU small screen was too fiddly...so I took my sounds to outboard gear...I now don't have them hassles
BUT I now have different hassles instead LOL
Are we not talking about function? IAA has never been solid. It was a patch so that they didn’t get eaten up by Audiobus on their own system. AU functions better. There are always growing pains when new technologies shake things up. Remember Lemur? And what the iPad did to them? They had to adapt. Everyone has to adapt. We’re not talking about Wal-Mart putting the mom-and-pop stores out of business, we’re talking about developers moving forward. Don’t retrofit your old apps if it’s too difficult... but don’t make new ones that are going to be outdated in no time.
shrug I don’t mind using IAA. The ones I use work nearly flawlessly, the ones that didn’t were deleted, with no correlation to the AU market.
I PREFER AUs, but it’s in no way a dealbreaker.
Edit: My exhibit A is mood. The AU version is a hassle to program with the screen switching, and there’s a feeling of disconnectedness. However, the IAA full-screen experience is a pleasure and as a result it’s one of my go-to synths.
Nope definitely not a magic bullet (psss they don’t actually exist
)
Yeah while AU had some screen limitations, they are on the way out and again it is down to devs to support that. Reducing that restriction was important.
Reducing the other restriction of AU Midi was also important and that is working out too.
That’s why the title of the thread ‘the forward momentum’. It’s easy to see that AU is being developed, while you admit that you think IAA bugs are ‘here to stay’.
Yes, there is a learning curve, lack of documentation and time costs money, yet there are many positives too:
I sort of agree with you in the sense that IAA, and even Audiobus, felt like iOS hacks to make connectivity even possible.
In a way, they totally were. Audiobus first, because there was no audio infrastructure to build it on, so it had to be a network protocol and IAA because ... yeah I'm not gonna finish this sentence because I don't want to get disappeared by the CoreAudio team. ;D
Fully agree with what they did with Mood interface in AU, yet it has its uses. To be honest now we have full screen AU, there should be a choice.
As AU Midi comes of age, I’m hoping we see interfaces we can design ourselves that then just send midi to the sound AU. It’s all about choice and if taken to its possible conclusion AU can give us our cake and eat it!
Imagine you have the full screen normal standalone in AU, then you have the cut down version for those that like to just get access to a few controls at one time. Then image you can hook up a control interface you designed for live use - fully personalised and suitable between control of any AUs you have set it up for!
Do they still use hoods and water torture?
I hope you continue to share your wisdom on the forum!
No, they make you sit in front of the system diagram for the IAA implementation, and make you read the bug list repeatedly while ignoring your "If you do it this way it would work better" comments, which in turn sends you into mental confusion.....allowing them to brainwash you..
You willingly walk out wearing a t-shirt with
I
IAA
printed on it.....
I see they got to you @AndyPlankton is there a way to be deprogrammed? ( joking of course. I know you always try to be balanced in your writings
)
hehehe The devil needs an advocate
Job’s taken. Shove off
He also offers good health care (until you die), but that’s no reason to sell your musical soul to the IAA (In aptitude algorithm)
Fight, fight, fight......
'Function is related to form if said form is broken, which I truly believe IAA is.'
IAA working fine here. the only hassle i see is loading up patches for projects. that's the same for hardware tho.
also worth noting, if i've got this right, is that cubasis have stated that they've no plans for AU full screen. using a lot of apps there is like playing thru a letterbox
Imagine if IAA was a 'conspiracy'? Where would all the Audio piped thru IAA go to?
I know, Into Apple's A********
I wish there was a tool like 'Audio Hijack' in iOS, we would not need to use any 'dirty hacks' at all, just select an apps audio-stream from Core Audio as the source but that would be a big NO-NO for all the big media corps....
You are indeed lucky then. Don’t you find projects a nightmare when patches don’t load? Remembering where patches go must be somewhat of a problem.
For example. One of my BM3 projects runs fine for all its samples and all AU, yet every Korg app used (IAA) has some issues. Some don’t load the preset, while others do. Some don’t connect their midi links, others do. Some occasionally don’t load at all!
This is just one session! It just sucks the fun away for me.
I hope they change their tune as more full screen AUs become available. As yet, they are behind the curve without AU Midi anyway
Bingo.
Bango.
So that being said, people may want to pay attention to you and I friends at Retronyms.
They are ....um...branching out of the matrix in a way with changes happening.
I think Retronyms about to blow up bigger than ever in the next 6 months if you ask me.
I love their products and support there work 100%.
Proud to say.
@Fruitbat1919
yeah, tis a hassle. hehe. but it has always been like that for me. never used DAW's that much, but in bm3 i just name that the pad with the patch i've created. setting up the midi channels is a mare. never encounter much bugs per se tho. also, things don't get too complex because i don;t use a lot of different apps. i've been playing electronica for round 8yrs and i've never completed a single tune. might be a connection there