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The iSymphonic Solo Violin has vibrato recorded on every note. Sounds real but I'm not sure if I like it for all cases.
How do you fell about vibrato in the sample itself? Do you add a vibrato as an LFO (Low Frequency Oscilator) Modulation effect? Since vibrato is varying pitch at some frequency I think letting the performer choose to start/stop it is better. A slight wiggle on an MPE keyboard can do this on demand.
The Pen2Bow interface turns out to be effective for Hoedown double/triple stops (think "The Devil Went Dow to Georgia) but it would take a bit of practice. Having a drummer's chops might be helping... not sure.
I think it might be time to check out some bowed synths: Moog's, SunRiser, etc.
Pen2Bow turns out to be an excellent controller for volume: crescendos, diminuendos are all easy control using either speed or force assigned to CC7. Having a keyboard volume pedal is good for this too along with a CC knob but this feels like conducting when applied to strings pulling the volume from the players on demand and silencing them as well gracefully or abruptly. Definitely worth the $8 as a tool for expression but not having it as an AUv3 is frustrating. The rate of updates makes it look like a neglected product so I'm not expecting AUv3 anytime soon.
Just to say, thanks for all the info on pen2bow. I feel like I asked if anyone had a packet of crisps, and you came back with a buffalo strapped to your back (a vegetarian one)
I remember watching a video of it being used to control swam pc. I wish swam and roli were more forward thinking and open in their implementation. They have incredible products but try to position them toward urban hipsters and people who don’t understand that macs are PCs. It results in a glossy shiny ad friendly... semi crippled environment.
As far as sample libraries go, I disagree with one aspect of what’s been discussed in that I think large orchestral or instrument sections are the easiest thing to do. I don’t mean complex dynamic changes but in so far as the sound goes, I am not even remotely impressed with any big sample library for those things. It’s just the nature of the sounds, that they are much more forgiving and lost in the herd than individual instruments.
Composer cloud makes paying for libraries pointless for me.
I originally bought Auria Pro to use Mattias Westlunds free SFZ of SSO, but ran into playability bugs and midi bugs. Grumpy face.
Then tried free VPO and VSCO2 CE with same issues (pan bug in Lyra, imbalance in velocity layers). So using the free SFZs out there in Lyra was going to take some SFZ programming. I did try modifications, but it’s a big effort to get them sounding and performing well. Grumpy face.
I think now for me, after listening to some good examples of orchestral music on an iPad, I’m going to start something simple. Try to have some success with a simple arrangement and build from there. Good music has been written on wavetable synths for 90’s games.
Sometimes I wish I would just jump to PC, but I’m not there budget wise yet (or may never be). So I trudge on in iOS.
Hope I didn’t go on a tangent with this post
Here’s a less is more example:
http://mattiaswestlund.net/?p=845#more-845
..I picked up a netbook for €20 late last year, a circa 2010/11 Acer AspireOne. In case the “netbook” designation hasn’t made it clear already, this is not a powerful machine by any stretch of the imagination. It has a 1.6GHz Atom processor (with two logical cores, though whether that makes any difference for audio processing tasks I’m not sure), 2GB RAM, a 160GB hard drive, and runs Windows 7 Home 32 bit. There are smart phones around these days that can run circles around this machine in terms of processing power...
I was listening to Scott's Firetrain again and read the comments. He mentions that he uses Squidfont a lot. @McDtracy ... You know this Squidfont?
You summarize the state of IOS symphony creation perfectly with a solid level of experience. Your take away should be used by more of us rather than chasing more Apps before we start making.
I was inspired by @Kuhl to render a Beethoven Symphony movement and it started the chase for soundfiles and quality improved dramatically and @Kuhl's tips help. Find the best instrument and render that to audio and keep doing that as you work through the score. I think that's close to your approach.
Now I think we have come to realize it's wise to find an inspiring sound and use it as you build a project and keep adding instruments towards a finished whole. More like adding clay to make a sculpture rather than the chiseling away of marble. If we get too much clay we can take some pack.
Duke Ellington hired musicians and then composed to their strengths and created an orchestral style that didn't think it terms of saxes vs trombones vs trumpets. It's was more like Johnny Hodges+Cat Anderson+ Harry Carney used as a section.
OT: Ellington makes me think of Billy Strayhorn. Tony Bennett and Lady Gaga have a concert recorded and Lady Gaga performs the the whole of Lush Life as the piece of musical theater that it covers. It's the best musical theater performance I think I've ever seen... like Garland and Streisand in their prime. It's a heart wrenching 4 minute character piece that sets the music in 4 dimensions.
Really old SF2. It's 26 megabytes in size. The new hotness is the virtual playing orchestra that has SFZ settings for articulations with 2 approaches:
(1) Note velocity/loudness gets mapped to articulations.
Soft=pizzicato
Medium=legato
Loud=marcato
(2) the Mod wheel selects different articulations.
I loaded it into Auria Pro and wasn't wowed like I usually am with a new iSymphonic investment.
I think I have enough sounds to make something pretty convincing following @Jmcmillan suggestions. Build up slowly.
I realize this doesn't fit the methods of an improviser. Especially one that likes to start on a project and get up 8 hours later when it's done. Maybe re-visit the mix or a recording the next day but NOT something that's assembled over the course of 3-4 weeks or months in the case of @kuhl. He still starts from notation to build a piece adding one line at a time and maybe ripping out and starting again like Beethoven did... agonizing towards a perfect vision and getting there at a great cost.
No one has mentioned a great DAW for acoustic composing.
Audio Evolution Mobile Studio 2.0.9 for iOS allows you to add SF2 soundfonts easily and use the instruments in recording and render to audio. It's an $8 app and sells a complete SF2 IAP for around $12 I think but any free SF2 could be added. MuseScore's SF2 is excellent too.
Today AEMS delivered an update that support using Sound Design techniques on the SF2 instruments in its virtual keyboard. (Not sure if external keyboards see the tweaks yet. I need to check). This app is a good way to get access to the Salamander Pianos from soundfonts4u.com.
From the AEMS update notes:
For anyone holding back on Auria Pro on price this is a good way to record SF2 into stems for import into any other DAW. It's also a complete DAW with some solid FX IAP's from ToneBoosters.
The developer is focused on making it an IOS staple after dominating the Android (Google) Store for a low cost DAW leader. It's MIDI features are really, really good which goes hand-in-hand with SF2's as a toolset.
You know @McDtracy, there is so much discussion about tweaking sounds to make them better... why don't the devs do all that tweaking?
They do. They tend to ship the best settings to their ears. But I tend to prefer less treble or more bass or smoother mid's so I like to tweak.
If something sounds harsh to me (presenting consonant harmonics I like to use a phaser like gauze in front of a camera... the harsh highs don't get past that phaser they become a gentle hiss).
Developers are just people with fingers on your stereo knobs. Not Gods giving you the best of all possible worlds. Just the world they think you'll pay for.
In 6 months I may change course and insist you only buy quality and adding FX to an instrument will only change it's character but can never make it improve in sonic fidelity. Just playing devil's advocate here but good samples (or software models) will speak to you and demand you pay for them. 'Cause you have ears and you use 'em.
I also think these headphones are slowly making us deaf and we keep increasing the volume to fix that effect.
This reminds me. @Linelineman's Piano lefthand almost sounds like another piano because of his technique. His melodies are crisp and clear while his (lefthand) accompaniments are smooth and understated. He does all this magic in realtime. Listen to the solo piano sections for the contrasts in dynamics and tone between hands.
Now if we can get him to start to think of IOS as an instrument with infinite presets and layer performances over PREDETERMINED chord sequences he can created layered improvisations over. Write out some song forms or better yet a really long harmonic structure like a symphonic movement that modulates between keys.
The orchestral IAPs in Audio Evolution are really really good IMO. No tremelo strings but almost everything else I'd want, the instruments sit nicely together and there are almost no duds.
I know I’m tardy to the pardy or this thread but just wanted to say I gave up on acoustic modeling apps until I tried Roli Noise SWAM. It’s almost unbelievably authentic and expressive.
@McDtracy , I wish. I go where the Muse goes. I am not driving this particular Firetrain.
Not sure what Roli is cooking but there might coming some new things. Whatever it is, let’s hope they don‘t cripple it too much for iOS.
https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=516838
Dear McDtracy
I understand that, you are not the first one to ask for AUv3 support in Pen2Bow. While I have been open to this idea for quite some time, there is currently a roadblock that prevents me from moving forward: As you might have guessed from my videos, I am an old-school DAW guy in terms of my setup, I have no experience in creating music completely within iOS. But an AUv3 version of Pen2Bow would need to integrate into current music workflows (which I have no idea about). So in order for me to consider AUv3 support, I would need someone with experience in this area, who would be willing to give me honest feedback on the prototypes to ensure that this thing would really be useful in real world scenarios. If you (or also someone else here) would be willing to take on such a role, I think I would consider reopening the case AUv3.
Best,
Dimos
How do you like to play it? With background music and add a live track using Noise? or by recording on another device?
Well that’s the crappy part about not having the SWAM sounds in the Noise auv3. Maybe someday... For fun I just make a track in Noise and mess around over it. To record I move the Cubasis project over to desktop Cubase and record a live overdub from the ipad’s 3.5mm out. Seaboard block keyboard is pretty much mandatory.
Yeah it’s clumsy for the workflow but the sound is so real it’s like a live orchestra instrument in your face.
OK. I'll get right on it.
For that reason.
I think the thread has moved from being a "personal journey" into a "migrant caravan". And looking around the OP has gone home already... onward to the City on the Hill or Nirvana or Mecca or Heaven or Albuquerque. "Where are your papers?"
Here he is:
https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/30367/synth-rhapsody-the-acoustic-journey-continues#latest
Nope, @McDtracy, still here. Just took a little time to apply all I learned from the thread. Hey, did you know there's an @mcdonut? Maybe you're related!
All you have learned? You went and used 2 iSymphonic instruments at the same time. Don't change the subject again.
Confess.
"I will render unto audio that which will otherwise waste my time (by going "Poof" when I hit record) and not complain when I forget these rules."
This is IOS and there are limits.
Hi @McDonuts. If @LinearLineman PM's you don't tell anything about the family. He's a turkey (resident).
Those are fightin' words, @McDtracy, or your alter ego, McDonut. I actually used four instruments plus a synth.
And I panned like no tomorrow!
@McDtracy, Pen2Bow 1.1 is now an AUv3 plugin in iOS
We just released a major update to Pen2Bow. In version 1.1, Pen2Bow can now be used as an AUv3 plugin within Audio Unit hosts. This allows you to open multiple instances of Pen2Bow, to wire each instance with a different instrument and to save and recall the parameters as part of a whole session. Watch the video for more details:
Hope you enjoy the update!
@McD did you catch this?
didn't notice. I'll add it to the list of things to try.