Loopy Pro: Create music, your way.
What is Loopy Pro? — Loopy Pro is a powerful, flexible, and intuitive live looper, sampler, clip launcher and DAW for iPhone and iPad. At its core, it allows you to record and layer sounds in real-time to create complex musical arrangements. But it doesn’t stop there—Loopy Pro offers advanced tools to customize your workflow, build dynamic performance setups, and create a seamless connection between instruments, effects, and external gear.
Use it for live looping, sequencing, arranging, mixing, and much more. Whether you're a live performer, a producer, or just experimenting with sound, Loopy Pro helps you take control of your creative process.
Download on the App StoreLoopy Pro is your all-in-one musical toolkit. Try it for free today.
Comments
Nice concept. Perhaps Apple could even create a system wide configurable AppTip API. That sends the user a weekly summary of app usage and suggested tips in a grid with check box
The notification would be opt-in of course.
Something like this would suit my personality very well as I do enjoy tipping in low pressure scenarios.
I like this too!
Also worth noting: all unlocks after the initial one are half price - Pro Unlock vs Pro Upgrade
Yeah, tipping feels different.
Subscriptions feel like renting. 😂
Everything on iOS feels like renting to me now.
Wow, touché… Seems like App Store can do “eminent domain” and remove apps we pay for from the App Store without a refund, case in point: WaveStorm 🤦♂️
I agree. The people paying less in an introductory sale are the same diehards who are going to buy on release date anyways. I notice Brambos doesn’t do introductory sales, and I think that’s the right call for an established iOS music app developer.
There’s a lot of talk about supporting Michael and other great developers. IMO, charging MORE for the first month would be a way to put our money where our intentions are.
I’ve been doing a bit more thinking about business models, and thought I’d share my latest thoughts. I’d love some feedback, and if anyone can think of another app that has an analogous setup, I’d love to hear about it so I can quiz the developer!
I’ve been thinking about ways to enact something a little bit akin to the subscription model (for sustainability’s sake) in a way that feels fair - unlike the current subscription system on the App Store. I’m also thinking about ways to provide a free trial, as Loopy Pro is going to be a reasonably high priced app. Although I think it’s reasonable, it would however be a lot to spend on something just to try it out.
My plan at present is to offer a free download, with a fully featured, time-limited free trial IAP ($0), and then an IAP to unlock the app (which, without the IAP and after the free trial expires, either makes no sound or becomes read-only; I haven’t decided which).
The unlock IAP will give you full access to the app and access to all new features 12 months forward from the time of sale. After that 12 month period, you keep the app in the state it is in at that point, and get ongoing bug fixes hopefully for as long as I’m working on the app. Any new features that are released after that point are unavailable (but not naggingly, obnoxiously so) until you renew with another IAP, reasonably discounted.
This feels close to the model that many desktop apps have, and I believe should enable me to continue working on the app indefinitely, which is my plan. My earlier idea was to release a separate app every 12 months or so, in a bundle with the previous one so you could get a discount, but that had many really significant disadvantages (the short-term timescale of the discount period, having to move over all settings and documents to the new app, confusion about having two versions of the same app on the App Store during the upgrade period, the pain of providing bug fix releases for many previous versions).
What do you guys think about that? Does it feel fair? Can you think of any other apps on iOS that do something similar?
This sounds perfect @Michael. I'd love you to be able to work on this indefinitely too.
@Michael If you can implement that separation between bug fixes and IAP features in the same app then I would be all in on that. It feels like the best of both worlds where users are not left behind after a year if the OS breaks something (the Wotja model has the potential to fall foul of this, I think), and the user is left free to upgrade to the new shiny when they are ready.
It’s here...
Curious to know what would be the one off price.
I really hope this will help to move devs past this current state.
Inevitable, but a dealbreaker...
I honestly don’t understand the ill feelings here; as a customer of apps that use this model myself, I feel it to be perfectly reasonable. Why the bother? Bear in mind that it makes the difference between being able to continue developing loopy pro indefinitely…and having it be a once off.
I don’t want to state a price just yet because I’ve not completed my decision-making there and don’t want to disappoint.
No ill feelings here. I sincerely hope that this will start a movement (you’re good at that
) to normalise current state. I don’t use anything subscription based, I find replacement in those cases. It’s kind of a policy - probably rare these days, but I never bought anything in instalments even. I assess price vs worth to me and make a decision - want > can afford / need to save.
Maybe I’ll join in when I see it, either way it’s just one opinion.
Okay, fair enough 😄
I think the end of the trial should be read only. If the trial ends and you're in two minds then that's where you're going to stay, as a non-paying customer.
Fair? Hmm. Fair... Is it fair to you, Michael? Fair to me is different to everyone else here. You're the one who has made this. You can always tweak the pricing once you've released it. All I ask is that you are transparent about your intentions and motives. That way you can do whatever you want. If it's £300 and it sells like hot cakes then good for you. If it doesn't sell a single copy then change the price etc etc.
Eta: I wonder what kind of heat this pricing model will bring? I imagine, although this is simply plucked from my imagination, that the amount of money spent is inversely proportional to the amount of chill felt about features wanted and bugs fixing.
dp.
@michael I generally don’t mind the desktop upgrade model, I like being able to step off the bus whilst still keeping functionality. The Bitwig model sounds closest to what you’re suggesting and at the moment I’ve not kept up to date as the old version suits my needs, but I may well take that option in the future.
Where I see a hole in your plan, and sorry if I’ve misunderstood, is that there is no reward/compensation for an initial investment. I would rather pay something up front and then top up with an annual IAP, rather than have to pay the same price as a new user each time. I admit though I have yet to scribble out the maths of this on an envelope… I guess that would only work satisfactorily if the initial cost was greater than the IAP/upgrade (like Bitwig)?
Also, I see a lot of damning App Store reviews for ‘free’ apps with IAPs, it seems people feel somehow cheated by this in a way they don’t with an upfront cost. I would hate to see Loopy Pro with anything less than five stars.
Sounds like a fair and workable model, though it’s difficult to judge without knowing the initial price, and projected update prices…they’re also subject to wildly varied user circumstances, pro, hobbyist, how much you earn in a global economy, but being able to keep using it even if you don’t update wouldn’t be a bad thing for the user who was happy to stick/couldn’t justify the update cost, though I wonder just how tricky that would make life for you the developer 🤷
I think people feel cheated by IAPs becaused they are not aware of them before they put their cash down. I believe it is this that needs to be overcome, rather than any particular pricing model.
Yes, I agree, it’s exasperating to read those reviews (for apps that cost nothing), it must be far worse to be receiving them.
Yep.
Just to be clear, I think that we could talk about what a particular app should cost until we are old (er) but I don't think that's the issue. I believe the issue is communicating the value of an app and why a dev believes their creation is worth X amount. For me to earn X amount takes me X amount of time. For you? Maybe a lot more cash for a lot less time. So what is an app worth? It is worth what a dev believes it is worth. Communicating that is the key to any pricing model, imo.
Okay, I’m just gonna put it out there for the sake of a meaningful discussion - the IAP will be in the ballpark of $30US. For subsequent years (upgrades), it’ll probably be half that.
@Michael I rather pay for any new versions, outright. Wouldn’t mind the confusion of having two app temporarily on store. I personally don’t pay subscriptions and yet own most iOS music software and upgrades — Including everything you’ve ever put out
That’s interesting! Is that just the aversion to the IAP?
I have big concerns about my ability to provide ongoing bug fixes for a bunch of different historical versions
Wojka 3000, Wusik 12000, etc
Vs.
LumaFusion
If I had a winning product, like you do, I’d think twice about innovating on a pricing model. But who knows? Perhaps that’s the worst advice you’ve ever received
The model seems fair and the price is right.
One thing that’s unclear to me is, 12 months from purchase means a lot of individual decisions based on a development cycle - some things are built on others, putting out purchase date based on upcoming features etc.
Do you plan to keep an ongoing roadmap?
What kind of timeline would you project for the existing roadmap?
Edit:
What kind of options do you plan when LP reaches its mature age (working purchase model, proven solutions etc), so basically 2-3 years in.
For me the big advantage to the end user is that you continue to get bug fixes by keeping it all under one app so even if you stick with the base set of features then you should still benefit from bug fixes caused by OS updates, and maybe even some quality of life improvements (performance, for example) if they aren’t specifically tied to new functionality. I can imagine it would be a massive headache to split the app into separate releases and also maintain fixes so the choice is either the Wotja way where you are stuck if Apple break something and haven’t upgraded, or keep everything in the one app and benefit from fixes with the option to upgrade as and when you see fit. The “as and when you see fit” part is what differentiates this from the subscription model where you are either on the train or off it.
I beleive Lumafusion does have IAPs but these are more in the style of Koala or LK where they are discrete bits of new functionality. I would be happy with this model as well but it relies on being able to decompose functionality in such a way that you can offer it piece by piece and still have everything work correctly for those who have not enabled it.
Free Trial - In App Purchase Upgrade - Free Bug Fixes - Paid Feature Upgrades?
@Michael: If I understand correctly, the plan is: I get the free app, get the IAP to try all features under a limited time span. Pay for IAP for full usability. Updates are free for 1 year. Afterward, I can continue using the app indefinitely, but won't be able to get new features offered after the first year Bug fixes still continue, however. After a few years (through which I can continue using the app), if I'd like to have the most recent features, then I can update the app (or buy IAP). If it's like this, it's basically no different from the way I use my DAW or video editing software on a desktop where I update every 2-4 years, and I'm very fine with this.