Ableton loses intel NUC development?

auxmux

@drez said:

@auxmux said:

@Korakios said:

@drez said:

@Korakios said:

@panthera86 said:
that escalated quick..
so will the Push3 Standalone be in a blow out sale?
or will become a mythological device?

I assume other companies will step in to fill the gap (small profit for a big company like Intel) , which would result in better pricing
edit , other manufacturers will continue to develop NUC chipsets .

Porting to ARM would be difficult ,but it would be way better in terms of hardware flexibility, price and power consumption

Live already runs on Arm.

I suppose you mean the custom ARM M1 chip from apple

Yeah, ARM for hardware would be different. Might be easier to run full Ableton on iOS, hmmm.

Why would it be different? ARM instruction sets are ARM instruction sets. When I run docker containers on my M1, I use ARM images, because the VM that is running underneath is…ARM.

The Push Standalone is already running Linux. I don’t feel like porting it over would be a major chore at all.

Got it, then yeah, I agree

Korakios

@drez said:

@auxmux said:

@Korakios said:

@drez said:

@Korakios said:

@panthera86 said:
that escalated quick..
so will the Push3 Standalone be in a blow out sale?
or will become a mythological device?

I assume other companies will step in to fill the gap (small profit for a big company like Intel) , which would result in better pricing
edit , other manufacturers will continue to develop NUC chipsets .

Porting to ARM would be difficult ,but it would be way better in terms of hardware flexibility, price and power consumption

Live already runs on Arm.

I suppose you mean the custom ARM M1 chip from apple

Yeah, ARM for hardware would be different. Might be easier to run full Ableton on iOS, hmmm.

Why would it be different? ARM instruction sets are ARM instruction sets. When I run docker containers on my M1, I use ARM images, because the VM that is running underneath is…ARM.

The Push Standalone is already running Linux. I don’t feel like porting it over would be a major chore at all.

Does your VM app translate cpu instructions or passthru ? I don't know if M1 is 100% ARM compatible (even if it's ARM based) or apple did their own custom design

As for iOS , every app running natively on M1 should run on iPads M1+ based . Maybe the GUI is handled differently ,but I'm not a developer

drez

@Korakios said:

@drez said:

@auxmux said:

@Korakios said:

@drez said:

@Korakios said:

@panthera86 said:
that escalated quick..
so will the Push3 Standalone be in a blow out sale?
or will become a mythological device?

I assume other companies will step in to fill the gap (small profit for a big company like Intel) , which would result in better pricing
edit , other manufacturers will continue to develop NUC chipsets .

Porting to ARM would be difficult ,but it would be way better in terms of hardware flexibility, price and power consumption

Live already runs on Arm.

I suppose you mean the custom ARM M1 chip from apple

Yeah, ARM for hardware would be different. Might be easier to run full Ableton on iOS, hmmm.

Why would it be different? ARM instruction sets are ARM instruction sets. When I run docker containers on my M1, I use ARM images, because the VM that is running underneath is…ARM.

The Push Standalone is already running Linux. I don’t feel like porting it over would be a major chore at all.

Does your VM app translate cpu instructions or passthru ? I don't know if M1 is 100% ARM compatible (even if it's ARM based) or apple did their own custom design

As for iOS , every app running natively on M1 should run on iPads M1+ based . Maybe the GUI is handled differently ,but I'm not a developer

Pretty sure the apple silicon is ARM64 compatible, which QEMU can emulate as well. So I would hypothesize that as long as Live Standalone was based on the same Linux version that Ableton was working on for the Apple Silicon compatibility, they should be able to port to ARM64 chips with lots of the heavy lifting already complete.

I think Ableton has options when it comes to processor types, but they’ve been using the Intel chips for all their development work over the last few years because of Covid and the massive chip shortage. I really believe they will be able to run it on whatever is performant yet cost effective for both the customer and Ableton themselves.

mistercharlie

@drez said:

I think Ableton has options when it comes to processor types, but they’ve been using the Intel chips for all their development work over the last few years because of Covid and the massive chip shortage. I really believe they will be able to run it on whatever is performant yet cost effective for both the customer and Ableton themselves.

Thinking about it now, it seems like this may have been the plan all along. Surely Ableton doesn’t want the Push 3 to run hot, and only last 2-3 hours on a charge. Maybe the idea is that people will also be able to self-upgrade to the ARM version when it’s done?

Putting an iPad inside and running it on that would also work!

bygjohn

FWIW when the M1 Macs came out, people were able to run the standard ARM build of Windows in Parallels, so it must be pretty standard ARM. IIRC it ran faster than on Microsoft’s own ARM hardware, but my memory may be wrong there.

drez

@mistercharlie said:

@drez said:

I think Ableton has options when it comes to processor types, but they’ve been using the Intel chips for all their development work over the last few years because of Covid and the massive chip shortage. I really believe they will be able to run it on whatever is performant yet cost effective for both the customer and Ableton themselves.

Thinking about it now, it seems like this may have been the plan all along. Surely Ableton doesn’t want the Push 3 to run hot, and only last 2-3 hours on a charge. Maybe the idea is that people will also be able to self-upgrade to the ARM version when it’s done?

Putting an iPad inside and running it on that would also work!

Yeah I think this is the magic part of it. You just replace the entire enclosure. They’ve been working on this for years and have said Push 3 is going to be THE PUSH for many more years. I firmly believe they have great upgrade plans in the future.

Jumpercollins

Danny_Mammy

@Jumpercollins said:

@Tarekith you're 'THIS IS A JOKE' is famous! Are you an Ableton Employee?

dendy

@drez said:

@auxmux said:

@Korakios said:

@drez said:

@Korakios said:

@panthera86 said:
that escalated quick..
so will the Push3 Standalone be in a blow out sale?
or will become a mythological device?

I assume other companies will step in to fill the gap (small profit for a big company like Intel) , which would result in better pricing
edit , other manufacturers will continue to develop NUC chipsets .

Porting to ARM would be difficult ,but it would be way better in terms of hardware flexibility, price and power consumption

Live already runs on Arm.

I suppose you mean the custom ARM M1 chip from apple

Yeah, ARM for hardware would be different. Might be easier to run full Ableton on iOS, hmmm.

Why would it be different? ARM instruction sets are ARM instruction sets. When I run docker containers on my M1, I use ARM images, because the VM that is running underneath is…ARM.

The Push Standalone is already running Linux. I don’t feel like porting it over would be a major chore at all.

It depends on what part of code is written in C/C++ (and/or other higher level language like JAVA for UI) - which you basically need just recompile for new CPU platform (very simplified, but in nutshell it is) and which is actually written in assembler (probably some parts of core DSP code for CPU use optimisation) - that part may be tricky, cause then you need completely rewrite that part of code from scratch if you want to make it natively compatible with ARM processor

mistercharlie

Panic over!

Intel mini NUC computers get a second life thanks to Asus

Tarekith

@Danny_Mammy said:

@Jumpercollins said:

@Tarekith you're 'THIS IS A JOKE' is famous! Are you an Ableton Employee?

Yes, but maybe not for long. Did not realize people would actually think all that was serious (f’ing idiots), some people at Ableton are not happy. LOL.

drez

@Tarekith said:

@Danny_Mammy said:

@Jumpercollins said:

@Tarekith you're 'THIS IS A JOKE' is famous! Are you an Ableton Employee?

Yes, but maybe not for long. Did not realize people would actually think all that was serious (f’ing idiots), some people at Ableton are not happy. LOL.

Yeah the amount of people "over juiced" over this are hilarious. And honestly Tarekith, sarcasm is impossible over the internet. You just can't do it. Also, the trolls know that it's sarcasm, but use it to troll even harder. Never worth it, IMO.