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ScaleGen
ScaleGen was just released, and as a friend of microtonal music I bought it immediately despite the $10. Although I didn't expect much.
And indeed, for now I cannot do much with it. I can export microtonal scales to Gestrument, but not to other synth apps. That's what I expected. Other apps must support the ScaleGen format, or ScaleGen MIDI/Text export. One can send MIDI directly to other apps, but so far this didn't work either. I assume there will be only very few apps with such support.
AirDrop from iPad to iPhone didn't work either. That may have other reasons.
Also, I would like to know how to play Gestrument with an external keyboard. I've never managed to do this, although the MIDI input settings in Gestrument seem alright. It should work in theory, but it doesn't in practice.
So if you have knowledge with ScaleGen and Gestrument, I'd like to learn more.
Comments
I suggested to Jesper that he support the Scala file format standard, then you could export directly to ThumbJam among others. I think that will probably come in an update.
I'll be investigating it in more detail and let you know what I learn.
I hope they go with Scala. It's a pretty portable standard.
At this point, you can't control Gestrument from an external MIDI source. http://forum.audiob.us/discussion/5113/tc-data-gestrument#Item_8
I emailed a bit with Jesper about it and he said they're starting work on version 2 and would consider it. Maybe email them and register your interest?
Hi guys. Yes we probably made a mistake not to include the Scala file format, and we will include it asap! We might actually also get AB, if only to be able to control recordings in other apps when using ScaleGen as a MIDI controller, but we will see about that.
Please let us know if you have any other concerns or ideas!
/Jesper Nordin from Gestrument
Jesper:
Did you ever figure out the bundle pricing with the App Store? I own Gestrument and it still shows the full price for ScaleGen.
I know - it hasn't gone active yet, and I don't know what's taking them so long! We haven't advertised the bundle actively yet, since they take so long for it to go through. But we do want the apps to be bundled, and the will then cost $14.99.
thank you all for your responses.
Scala file support for ScaleGen is a good idea. Although one could tune ScaleGen by ear and save, so it's not really necessary in my view. Worth to consider nevertheless, it would make things easier to setup.
The problem is probably how to directly control (or export files to) other apps.
If such interaction with other apps would be possible one day, a MIDI input would be a good idea. Play selected synth/sampler apps live with an external keyboard via ScaleGen. Like the Scala Relay function (which I use often with my Netbook to play monophonic synthesisers).
In my collection I found three apps that can swap MIDI channels for each incoming note: PPG Wavemapper, WaveGenerator, and SampleWiz. The latter works best, although still not quite right. Channel swapping is necessary to receive pitch bend data for each note separately, in order to play the thing polyphonically from an external keyboard. To play monophonically via Scala is never a problem.
Of course, it is better if the apps would support microtuning internally. So far I know of only three apps: Sunrizer, Z3TA, and Gender.
Gestrument receives MIDI CC, not notes, that's something I've learned now. No wonder all my attempts to play Gestrument with a keyboard failed.
Thank you @JesperNordin for the development of ScaleGen. I think this is a step in a good direction, microtonal tools like this are quite unique. I'm still working on a microtonal translator in Lemur, but there are some details that need some improvement. So I keep using Scala.
MIDI note input for Gestrument would be nice. On a side note, I bought Gestrument and never used it. Personally I'm not very fond of apps that do all the work. I understand it is a performer and controller app. MIDI note input would be somehow away from the initial idea. But it could be both. What do you think about it?
Maybe there's a problem with velocity. If one connects a keyboard, one expects velocity. And even velocity layers. That may be an issue with Gestrument and the sample library. Therefore I can understand if note input is not in your plan. Still, velocity controlling the volume only would be good.
Thanks again.
Phil999: Your comments are interesting, but the notion of MIDI input to Gestrument seems to miss the whole point of what it is.....I would much rather see development move in more appropriate directions.
Links are handy:
Read: http://www.gestrument.com/scalegen/
Buy: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/scalegen/id908056629
@JC_vt said:
yes, I'm aware of this.
@Phil999 said:
I might be missing the whole point as well but as it is, Gestrument can not be sequenced. I would really really love to set Xynthesizer into random mode and have it very very slowly trigger Gestrument. MIDI notes to set the root note, dynamics via velocity and a CC to set the density (or vel=density and midi volume = dynamics maybe?).
4 ipods doing this connected to 4 speaker sets in 4 corners of a room for all of your generative ambient music art installation dreams to be fulfilled. Ok, mine. I mean, you can currently use a Kinnect to control it! MIDI in can't seem that whacky.
We are continuously talking about how and if we should add MIDI note in one way or the other. It's not a question of dynamics - that would work fine, it's more a multiple input collision thing. Always nice to have more thoughts and input though - thanks!
And just to be clear Jesper, if Gestrument never added any sort of MIDI note in, I would go on using it as a happy customer. Mostly thinking out loud here, certainly not complaining.
@Phil999: ScaleGen does the MIDI channel swapping already when sending MIDI out, with settable channel range. I wish there was a better way for microtonal MIDI than using pitchbend and multiple channels.
Syrup old chap, do you have this app? If so, what do you think? if not, why not?
@j_liljedahl said:
true, but that's how it is.
good tip about the ScaleGen channel swapping range. I was not aware of this.
@j_liljedahl said:
There is a better way for microtonal midi, it's called MIDI Tuning Standard, but there isn't much support out there for it, definitely not on iOS.
http://www.midi.org/techspecs/midituning.php
Basically, it's special SysEx messages to do preset or live tuning of every midi note number.
Since we're on the topic, don't forget that ThumbJam supports microtonal scales (and imports Scala files), as well as a midi thru feature with scale lock, so that incoming notes are remapped to the currently selected key and scale on output. However, I don't think my thru feature remaps to channel hopping, I'll have to look into adding that. The TJ touch interface midi output can do channel per touch of course.
Once you guys add Scala export (with Open In) to ScaleGen, TJ can just open them right up. I may end up adding ScaleGen format support too!
I don't know, if something doesn't understand .scl I just don't use it for that kind of stuff.
All that pitch bend and splitting channels is so much work.
State saving in ab would be cool for that kind of thing, so you don't have to set it up again.
And I can't play strange pitches and scales on a chromatic keyboard, I get blisters in my brain from it. Only white keys works for me.
Gesturement is fretless that's not my kind of thing. I can do to much nonsense with it ...
Not just yet Mr Goodyear. I'm on app shutdown for a minute; things got out of hand again last month (several iOS purchases plus the Arturia Synth Collection). Looking for a video to further understand the possibilities anyway. I love Gestrument a whole lot so this would be shortlisted.
Here are our two videos syrupcore
ScaleGen -
Gestrument & ScaleGen -
And as I said before, if it doesn't prove difficult somehow, we will add Scala support. But we have also had some requests from dev's who want to include our .scale format in their apps, so hopefully that will also take on!
Ha! I opened this thread to post those videos.
Thank you! There is someplace between a 0% and a 0% chance that I wont buy this when I get home. Incredible work. Big high five to you and Mr. Liljedahl.
First thing I'm gonna do: mimic the Für Elise example but replace the notes with the notes from All About That Bass.
'From Elise'...
Another interesting approach to scales...this sounds really nice.
I think import of a midi file of für Elise is a bad example of how to use it, it's a minor harmonic, took me one sec to google it.
with export of .scl > there you have it, la voilà 
but if you import what ever you have played as a midi file it makes complete sense to me, then you don't have to figure out what it was that you were playing.
@lala - I don't think you understood the concept properly. It's not about taking a MIDI file (in this case Für Elise) and checking which scale it uses (even if you can do that as well). It's about using a MIDI file AS a scale! That means instead of pitches going from down to up they go from beginning to end of the melody. Look at the end of the Gestrument & ScaleGen video above or the in-depth ScaleGen video and then you will see an example of how Für Elise as a scale works.
Congrats, Jesper.
Gestrument hasn't the celebrity that it deserves.
The idea of taking a melody as something to play with reminds a little of something you can do in TC-data, and in fact many children's toys. I'm guessing (not having ScaleGen yet) that the difference is you can go back and forth, or inside the melody, if you know what I mean?
@Fizt - exactly, you can go back and forth in any way you like (again, see the videos above for an example) and if you port a MIDI files as scale to Gestrument you then can assign your different instruments to different ranges of the melody, which really resembles taking the "musical DNA" of a song and turning it into something new.
Thx for clearing that up.
@syrupcore The x/y position on the Gestrument interface can be controlled via MIDI CC messages. I've used the physics engine in Lemur to randomize Gestrument in that way.
Whattttt? Sweet! Thank you @apptronica.