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iPad at NAMM

2

Comments

  • nerVenerVe
    edited January 30

    @Simon said:

    @nerVe said:
    Besides the cost…the Pro’s are far from Pro…

    When Apple call something "Pro", I don't think they actually mean for industry professionals.

    It is more of a marketing term for "high end, fully featured and more expensive model".

    Unlike Sony, who have a real "pro" broadcast division that makes very expensive video gear for TV stations and film companies - stuff that ordinary people would never buy.

    Apparently…at least with the iPad…Definitely not…

    The OP also asked about the $3800 Vision Pro…So, this too is for ordinary people not professionals… 😭👌

  • fisherrofisherro

    Watching the NAMM coverage, I did see the occasional iPad app as support to some hardware. But no iPad apps that were just iPad apps or hardware designed specifically for iPads.

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    As someone who never wants to go back to doing my music work on my Mac again, that was disappointing. Although I think it more reflects that none of the channels I follow who went to NAMM are particularly iPad focused. And that products these days don’t tend to be iPad exclusive. I’m assuming if people were specifically asking about iPad support, there would have been at least some yeses.

  • zzrwoodzzrwood
    edited January 31

    @nerVe said:
    Well…for one they started calling them pro devices with $1800 price tags and thunderbolt 4 ports but no audio driver support…

    DriverKit, including AudioDriverKit, has been part of iPadOS since version 16, however none of the hardware vendors seem to have taken any interest in developing audio drivers…

    https://developer.apple.com/documentation/driverkit/creating_drivers_for_ipados

  • setAIsetAI

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

  • GavinskiGavinski

    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

  • HolyMosesHolyMoses
    edited January 31

    @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Congratulation, you may be one of very very few I heard and met that think MS Surface Pro is slicker than an iPad Pro…

    Sorry to mention this, but, if MS Surface Pro was such an incredible device, why have it never been a great sales success?

    I have own two Surface Pro earlier, both series 5 and series 7, and, sure, for some “work” it can be good, but, if you should run Ableton Live or Cubase, it’s not good at all…

    For me iPad Pro and MS Surface Pro is two complete different devices with only one common feature, touch screen.

    If I allowed to rant a bit more - I’m allergic to Windows, in all versions - if you compare it to the streamlined and slick iPadOS17, Windows is a slow and bulky product in an surface device.

    Last but not least, the way we can run music making apps into iPads, there’s almost nothing that come close in an Windows environment…

  • jacoujacou

    If iPadOS was just a little bit more open like MacOS the iPad could be a real powerhouse. Installing AUv3 outside of the App Store and being a tiny bit less sandboxy. One can dream…

  • setAIsetAI

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

  • setAIsetAI

    @HolyMoses said:

    @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    Congratulation, you may be one of very very few I heard and met that think MS Surface Pro is slicker than an iPad Pro…

    Sorry to mention this, but, if MS Surface Pro was such an incredible device, why have it never been a great sales success?

    I have own two Surface Pro earlier, both series 5 and series 7, and, sure, for some “work” it can be good, but, if you should run Ableton Live or Cubase, it’s not good at all…

    I don't understand why the Surface has failed as a product, I wasn't expecting much but was extremely pleasantly surprised. Especially when I installed Bitwig, which really made the Surface Pro feel like a "super iPad" to me.

  • GavinskiGavinski

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    What specs would account for better sound quality?

  • HolyMosesHolyMoses
    edited January 31

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    What has display crispness with music making to do??
    I’ve as I said owned two different Surface Pro, and, have checked in series 9 in several shops - can’t see that it’s remarkable compared to latest iPad Pro M1/M2…
    Sound quality?? Do you mean that Surface Pro onboard audio chip is better than iPad Pro M1/M2?
    No no no - that’s not true.

    Software selection?
    Sure, you can run desktop applications, but, nothing can beat the amount of music app on iPad, especially the price point that is 1/10 or 1/5 of the prices for similar applications on desktop…

    I don’t know much about Bitwig, and what it cost and what you get bundled with the entrance price.

    There are a cause that I’ve own two different Surface Pro, but sold them because of disappointment - after the first, series 5 I bought/thought series 7 with better CPU and USB-C should be the thing, but, no, no…

    Bad battery time, Windows, hmmm…

  • CarnbotCarnbot

    We are lucky to have lots of options these days.
    Windows, MacOs, Linux, ipadOS and iOS etc
    All great for different use cases and budgets. They all work really well if you know what you're doing ;)

  • DhamDham

    @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Yes! I love those wonderful Windows Updates that precipitate a beautiful yet mysterious spinning ball. This is a great way to force us to get away from the screen, stretch, get coffee, get our chores done, go shopping, etc. I also love the free anti-virus, anti-malware software that MS includes now. It runs well with the additional Norton or MacAfee anti-virus/anti-malware which is also required on Windows systems. That IS slicker than snot.

  • HolyMosesHolyMoses

    @Dham said:

    @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Yes! I love those wonderful Windows Updates that precipitate a beautiful yet mysterious spinning ball. This is a great way to force us to get away from the screen, stretch, get coffee, get our chores done, go shopping, etc. I also love the free anti-virus, anti-malware software that MS includes now. It runs well with the additional Norton or MacAfee anti-virus/anti-malware which is also required on Windows systems. That IS slicker than snot.

    Humor & irony is what makes people live longer, stay stronger, and, lighten peoples mind...

  • AMBelloAMBello

    The iPad is a magnificent music making tool, but I would say I really miss Arturia’s V collection, pigments and Fx, as well as equator 2.

    I’m looking at options here, because I don’t want to have my laptop as a part of my live setup. A Mac mini with a touch screen could work, but while the touch is good to have, the portability seems questionable to say the least ?

    A second hand surface pro 6 or 7, which can be had by around 400-500€ in my neck of the woods would seem a credible option. I would just need a good AUM alternative for windows, although my guess is I will be disappointed with all of them.

    Believe me, I have no wish to return to windows… if any of you gents has any suggestions?

  • HolyMosesHolyMoses
    edited January 31

    @AMBello said:
    The iPad is a magnificent music making tool, but I would say I really miss Arturia’s V collection, pigments and Fx, as well as equator 2.

    I’m looking at options here, because I don’t want to have my laptop as a part of my live setup. A Mac mini with a touch screen could work, but while the touch is good to have, the portability seems questionable to say the least ?

    A second hand surface pro 6 or 7, which can be had by around 400-500€ in my neck of the woods would seem a credible option. I would just need a good AUM alternative for windows, although my guess is I will be disappointed with all of them.

    Believe me, I have no wish to return to windows… if any of you gents has any suggestions?

    Avoid any Surface Pro below serie 7 - serie 1 to 6 can’t be run from a powerbank - serie 7/8/9 have USB-C that can act like an charger port…

  • AudioGusAudioGus
    edited January 31

    @jacou said:
    What happened? What went wrong?

    Apple killed the headphone jack.

  • GovernorSilverGovernorSilver

    For NAMM< Mackie announced new products which all seem to mention connectivity with smartphones (iPhone) and tablets (iPad)

    https://mackie.com/en/news/all/Mackie_2024_Product_Launches.html

  • setAIsetAI
    edited February 1

    @Gavinski said:

    What specs would account for better sound quality?

    I don't mean the machine. I mean the sound quality of best software available. I use the iPad almost the exclusively for making music since 2015 or so and I adore many of the synths on the iPad, but I was really blown away by the superior sound quality of a lot of software like wavestate and modwave native, Softube stuff, giorgio sancristoforo's amazing instruments, and as I said Bitwig. Bitwig by itself makes everything on the iPad seem clunky and toyish imo.

  • jacoujacou

    @setAI said:

    @HolyMoses said:

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    What has display crispness with music making to do??
    I’ve as I said owned two different Surface Pro, and, have checked in series 9 in several shops - can’t see that it’s remarkable compared to latest iPad Pro M1/M2…
    Sound quality?? Do you mean that Surface Pro onboard audio chip is better than iPad Pro M1/M2?
    No no no - that’s not true.

    Software selection?
    Sure, you can run desktop applications, but, nothing can beat the amount of music app on iPad, especially the price point that is 1/10 or 1/5 of the prices for similar applications on desktop…

    I don’t know much about Bitwig, and what it cost and what you get bundled with the entrance price.

    There are a cause that I’ve own two different Surface Pro, but sold them because of disappointment - after the first, series 5 I bought/thought series 7 with better CPU and USB-C should be the thing, but, no, no…

    Bad battery time, Windows, hmmm…

    @Gavinski said:

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    What specs would account for better sound quality?

    I don't mean the machine. I mean the sound quality of best software available. I use the iPad almost the exclusively for making music since 2015 or so and I adore many of the synths on the iPad, but I was really blown away by the superior sound quality of a lot of software like wavestate and modwave native, Softube stuff, giorgio sancristoforo's amazing instruments, and as I said Bitwig. Bitwig by itself makes everything on the iPad seem clunky and toyish imo.

    I totally get that. Who wouldn’t prefer using a full blown desktop DAW (just like Ableton Live but with touch optimisation) over any iPad DAW? I guess some here probably wouldn’t. I also get that. The whole simplicity thing and so on.. But yeah the moment the iPad opens up a bit more and DAWs like Bitwig make their entrance the iPad will be next level for music making. Logic for iPad (despite the awful subscription model) is just not my cup of tea and doesn’t seem to be the hoped for new era of iPad music making.

  • zzrwoodzzrwood

    @jacou said:

    @setAI said:

    @HolyMoses said:

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    What has display crispness with music making to do??
    I’ve as I said owned two different Surface Pro, and, have checked in series 9 in several shops - can’t see that it’s remarkable compared to latest iPad Pro M1/M2…
    Sound quality?? Do you mean that Surface Pro onboard audio chip is better than iPad Pro M1/M2?
    No no no - that’s not true.

    Software selection?
    Sure, you can run desktop applications, but, nothing can beat the amount of music app on iPad, especially the price point that is 1/10 or 1/5 of the prices for similar applications on desktop…

    I don’t know much about Bitwig, and what it cost and what you get bundled with the entrance price.

    There are a cause that I’ve own two different Surface Pro, but sold them because of disappointment - after the first, series 5 I bought/thought series 7 with better CPU and USB-C should be the thing, but, no, no…

    Bad battery time, Windows, hmmm…

    @Gavinski said:

    @setAI said:

    @Gavinski said:
    . > @setAI said:

    @fisherro said:

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    I will get this on my Surface Pro😎, every iPad musician should also try a windows tablet, I couldn't believe how much slicker and more professional they are than iPads with music software.

    Interesting - but slicker and more professional in what ways exactly? About external connections? Or you mean ability to use desktop DAWs etc?

    Sound quality, software selection, crispness of the display.

    Using Bitwig with it's touchscreen mode really enhances everything even further.

    What specs would account for better sound quality?

    I don't mean the machine. I mean the sound quality of best software available. I use the iPad almost the exclusively for making music since 2015 or so and I adore many of the synths on the iPad, but I was really blown away by the superior sound quality of a lot of software like wavestate and modwave native, Softube stuff, giorgio sancristoforo's amazing instruments, and as I said Bitwig. Bitwig by itself makes everything on the iPad seem clunky and toyish imo.

    I totally get that. Who wouldn’t prefer using a full blown desktop DAW (just like Ableton Live but with touch optimisation) over any iPad DAW? I guess some here probably wouldn’t. I also get that. The whole simplicity thing and so on.. But yeah the moment the iPad opens up a bit more and DAWs like Bitwig make their entrance the iPad will be next level for music making. Logic for iPad (despite the awful subscription model) is just not my cup of tea and doesn’t seem to be the hoped for new era of iPad music making.

    What do you mean when you say that the iPad would need to open up a bit more for DAWs like Bitwig to make their entrance?

  • zzrwoodzzrwood

    @jacou said:

    @kirmesteggno said:

    @jacou said:
    Also in forums like Gearspace the iPad seems to be a bit of an ugly duckling of the music industry. A category cramped into 3 subcategories.

    The iPad with its small screen just isn't the right device for working within a linear timeline, which is what most people on Gearspace are used to.

    Extended desktop and switching UIs into a more zoomed out "desktop mode" could change that, but there no demonstrations of this.

    I think most people who can afford the Apple ecosystem can also afford a desktop computer as a more convenient solution for timeline based music production.

    A personal example:

    Before I bought my current iPad (9th gen) recently I was considering switching from Ableton to Logic on the iPad and try to replace my desktop for the most part, but couldnt find any workflow examples about how the extended desktop mode would actually be like, and after asking around the verdict was that it's basically just a blown up tablet view.

    That's why I've decided to treat the iPad as an ipad and stay away from the stage manager stuff for the time being. For me using Apple is about maximizing convenience and user experience. And iPad apps that emulate Grooveboxes, samplers, mixers, effects and desktop DAW controllers deliver on that front for me, timeline based DAWs don't.

    Its the same for art & design apps like Affinity. I like Procreate on the iPad, but couldn't get warm with shrunken desktop apps with too many features like Affinity. DAWs kinda fall into the same category. The iPad apps most people here love like are more like Procreate, they're focused user experiences.

    @Gavinski said:

    Part of the problem - and it's the same thing that makes this a difficult niche for YouTubers in the space - is Apple's withdrawal of the affiliate program 5 years ago.

    Comissions still exist for eBooks I think, but last time I've looked stuff up in the iBooks store there were no iPad music production books, which is kinda crazy. It's hands down the best format because you can include audio and videos in the Apple iBooks format and use it in slide over mode alongside music apps.

    These are the audio related books in my library, looking forward to adding more:

    I've actually decided just now that I'm going to compile information about the necessary tools for iBook production. Last time I've looked into it years ago people were using Apple Pages, but there might be other ways.

    Yes the lack of proper extended monitor support is a huge problem! While it would only be usable with mouse and keyboard it still would be a great extension!

    Most mid to high spec iPads already have proper extended monitor support…

  • jacoujacou

    Well on one hand I think it's the whole App Store thing. If devs wouldn't be bound to the App Store with it's fees on iPad they surely would reconsider otimising and porting their software.
    On the other hand iPadOS is coming with a lot more restriction than MacOS. Sandboxing, tight rules, no system wide audio routing etc.

    So my hope is that Apple will continue adding Mac features to iPad and slowly ease down on all the restrictions. I guess once they realize that they can't tie devs to the App Store forever they will try and shift their moentising strategy to making the iPad more attractive / pro / Mac like (as Mac keeps on going strong).
    I'm hopeful that the DMA will accelerate things without letting Apple sneak out.

  • kirmesteggnokirmesteggno
    edited February 1

    As a designer who's good at digging for info I find it incredibly hard to find information about designing for touch enabled audio plugins / AUv3s. So even if established plugin companies would want to get into mobile UIs and hire designers for it, they can't find designers because the designers can't even find the information they need to specialize in it. It seems to be a very gatekept niche, and all entry points into this niche that are accessible are mainly from frameworks for full stack indie devs.

    I think that's why you see som many small apps with standard DSPs and UIs and very little of the established desktop companies.

  • ralisralis
    edited February 1

    @AudioGus said:

    @jacou said:
    What happened? What went wrong?

    Apple killed the headphone jack.

     “+1 million “
  • jwmmakerofmusicjwmmakerofmusic

    @fisherro said:
    Watching the NAMM coverage, I did see the occasional iPad app as support to some hardware. But no iPad apps that were just iPad apps or hardware designed specifically for iPads.

    The was the latest Baby Audio synth, which I’m assuming will come to the iPad, but there was no mention of the iPad.

    A new Baby Audio synth? Atoms was it? I'm down!

  • jacoujacou

    @kirmesteggno said:
    As a designer who's good at digging for info I find it incredibly hard to find information about designing for touch enabled audio plugins / AUv3s. So even if established plugin companies would want to get into mobile UIs and hire designers for it, they can't find designers because the designers can't even find the information they need to specialize in it. It seems to be a very gatekept niche, and all entry points into this niche that are accessible are mainly from frameworks for full stack indie devs.

    I think that's why you see som many small apps with standard DSPs and UIs and very little of the established desktop companies.

    Thanks for chiming in. I wasn't aware of that. Hopefully information and help will be made more accessible.
    Maybe some other devs here can help with some links?

  • abfabf

    NAMM is a trade show for music merchants where they get a chance to contemplate their wholesale purchases for the year ahead. Originally only retailers were allowed to attend. Traditionally NAMM is where manufacturers got together to secretly fix prices.

    Initially I'm sure retailers thought the iPad might open up a new hardware market, but Apple's constant changing of specs and connections killed that dream. There's no reason for any retailer to be concerned with iPad apps because they don't sell them. I wouldn't expect to see much for iPad at NAMM, unless it is an iPad stand or bluetooth headphones or something.

  • Antos3345Antos3345
    edited February 1

    The biggest problem the iPad has for me is that it's not universally friendly with the OS desktop environment. If Apple made the iPad send and sync audio in perfect harmony, it would act as a perfect sidecar with OS. I know Apple made IDAM, but it does not do the best job. With these new heavy M series processors, Apple should make the IPAD much more creative and open up the code more for developers to design their apps better to match the IOS.

  • kirmesteggnokirmesteggno

    @Antos3345 said:
    The biggest problem the iPad has for me is that it's not universally friendly with the OS desktop environment. If Apple made the iPad send and sync audio in perfect harmony, it would act as a perfect sidecar with OS. I know Apple made IDAM, but it does not do the best job. With these new heavy M series processors, Apple should make the IPAD much more creative and open up the code more for developers to design their apps better to match the IOS.

    Agree. Bi-directional multi channel IDAM over USB-C would be such a game changer.

    Resources for skeumorphic UI devs and designers would be nice too. They provide design kits for the general system look, but not for the design language they use in audio apps.

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