What speakers do you mix for?

Fruitbat1919

I spend an awful lot of time noodling away from my monitor speakers. At these times I have to use my iPad speakers, as I can’t wear headphones for too long as they tend to increase the frequency of my head pains.

Obviously when I hook up to my monitor speakers, the whole mix needs adjusting as the bass is especially too loud.

Bearing in mind that a large proportion of people just listen to music on phones, laptops, tablets and other tiny speakers, how do you make your mix suitable for the widest range possible?

I have noticed that even some professional recordings seem too bass heavy on my speakers now. Are they recording more towards the phone listening market now do you think, or is the fad for extra bass?

As for apps, that could make my life easier, would making two EQs at the end of every track I’m making to suit the speakers, the best option while I’m still writing the track? Save all that constant playing with faders depending on where I’m making music?

Tarekith

I aim to make it sound as good as possible on as many speakers and headphones as possible. It’s less about targeting one specific user group, and more about trying to find an average that works well everywhere.

jimhanks

For me, I mix with AKG K240 headphones and 4" M-Audio speakers, neither of which is "mastering quality" and both of which are bass deficient. I've learned to accept that my best mixes are where I really want more bass but I don't push it as I know "the car test" is going to fail. 😝

I don't use the iPad speakers for anything involving levels. Arranging, timing, composing - fine - but no good for mix decisions in my opinion. The only exception is one time when I made a ringtone for my iPhone and knew that was the only place it would get played. Otherwise, no, I don't try to target for tiny speakers.

pedro

When mixing I tend to try each and every possible scenario. Even tiny speakers. My car stereo is one of my references cause I can immediately tell what’s missing or too much of (maybe because I already listened to so many tracks on it)

ecou

It would be so cool if the speaker could provide a sound curve. The player would adjust the audio curves !

reasOne

I just mix with my monitors and my te ob4.
Then the famous car test

RonnieOmelettes

@reasOne said:
I just mix with my monitors and my te ob4.
Then the famous car test

Is that a thing? Always thought my mixes sound great in the car.

Stuntman_mike

Car test is strong, I mix with Kali Audio LP6s 95% of the time

Danny_Mammy

its usually means you have to look at bass differently, you make it work on the studio monitors, but you need to add some low mid saturation for the iPad speaker. its one reason why saturation and distortion is used so much in mixing nowadays, it help cut through the ipad speaksers.

also a layer of sub and layer of distorted bass can help.

for sure your mix will have bass that will not be heard on ipad speakers.

Fruitbat1919

Thanks for all the replys

@Danny_Mammy said:
its usually means you have to look at bass differently, you make it work on the studio monitors, but you need to add some low mid saturation for the iPad speaker. its one reason why saturation and distortion is used so much in mi :xing nowadays, it help cut through the ipad speaksers.

also a layer of sub and layer of distorted bass can help.

for sure your mix will have bass that will not be heard on ipad speakers.

Thanks this was helpful

NeuM

These days I try to get as clean a mix as I can, then master with Logic Pro’s “Mastering” button. It does 100x than I could at finding the right levels and pulling out of the mix a nearly perfect balance across the frequency spectrum every time.

Fruitbat1919

@NeuM said:
These days I try to get as clean a mix as I can, then master with Logic Pro’s “Mastering” button. It does 100x than I could at finding the right levels and pulling out of the mix a nearly perfect balance across the frequency spectrum every time.

Yeah im still getting to know Logic.. Hopefully one day the AI stuff will just do all the mixing and mastering for me on command lol

Slush

I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Fruitbat1919

@Slush said:
I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Headphones aren't really any use for me as they put pressure on my head making me more likely to have one of my head pains.

squeals

When I read about car tests, I’ve always felt the advice gives a technical reason why you shouldn’t mix for the car, but misses the point.

You shouldn’t mix for the car, but your mix should sound good in the car!
I listen to most of half my music in the car. I’d never make little adjustments based on the car, but if something is off it’s back to the drawing board.

Personally, I have my monitors, my hi fi, my good headphones, my iPhone headphones car & my tv. If it sounds good on them I’m good to go. (I have set to my taste.)

Stuntman_mike

@Danny_Mammy said:
its usually means you have to look at bass differently, you make it work on the studio monitors, but you need to add some low mid saturation for the iPad speaker. its one reason why saturation and distortion is used so much in mixing nowadays, it help cut through the ipad speaksers.

also a layer of sub and layer of distorted bass can help.

for sure your mix will have bass that will not be heard on ipad speakers.

GOLD

Slush

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Headphones aren't really any use for me as they put pressure on my head making me more likely to have one of my head pains.

I see, and what about In Ear headphones?

Fruitbat1919

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Headphones aren't really any use for me as they put pressure on my head making me more likely to have one of my head pains.

I see, and what about In Ear headphones?

Never really considered them. Do they make decent in Ear headphones - never had any myself, but I’ve not really looked for any either, so I’m open minded.

tom_ward

@squeals said:
You shouldn’t mix for the car, but your mix should sound good in the car!

I think this nails the point regarding car tests. I find that most of the bass-is-too-heavy issues I have with a mix present themselves right away in the car. Even sub-bass issues, which are easy to spot in the car when the loose change, pens, lighters, door panels, etc. start rattling.

@Fruitbat1919 said:
As for apps, that could make my life easier, would making two EQs at the end of every track I’m making to suit the speakers, the best option while I’m still writing the track? Save all that constant playing with faders depending on where I’m making music?

I've been getting a lot of benefit from saving mixing presets, personally. I know there is a school of thought that mixing and mastering happens at the end of the process, but if I have a common setting(s) that ends up getting used every time, I just put it on at the beginning...especially if it'll help get a more accurate picture from something portable like an iPad speaker, where like you I almost always end up with too much bass. This was working really well for me on the desktop, in Bitwig, and I've been slowly transitioning that into an iPad-centric environment.

@Fruitbat1919 said:
Yeah im still getting to know Logic.. Hopefully one day the AI stuff will just do all the mixing and mastering for me on command lol

I don't have any advice for a mobile setup, but on desktop I've had good success with TDR's SlickEQ Mastering plugin which is pretty good at matching references:
https://www.tokyodawn.net/tdr-slickeq-m/

Fruitbat1919

@tom_ward said:

@squeals said:
You shouldn’t mix for the car, but your mix should sound good in the car!

I think this nails the point regarding car tests. I find that most of the bass-is-too-heavy issues I have with a mix present themselves right away in the car. Even sub-bass issues, which are easy to spot in the car when the loose change, pens, lighters, door panels, etc. start rattling.

@Fruitbat1919 said:
As for apps, that could make my life easier, would making two EQs at the end of every track I’m making to suit the speakers, the best option while I’m still writing the track? Save all that constant playing with faders depending on where I’m making music?

I've been getting a lot of benefit from saving mixing presets, personally. I know there is a school of thought that mixing and mastering happens at the end of the process, but if I have a common setting(s) that ends up getting used every time, I just put it on at the beginning...especially if it'll help get a more accurate picture from something portable like an iPad speaker, where like you I almost always end up with too much bass. This was working really well for me on the desktop, in Bitwig, and I've been slowly transitioning that into an iPad-centric environment.

@Fruitbat1919 said:
Yeah im still getting to know Logic.. Hopefully one day the AI stuff will just do all the mixing and mastering for me on command lol

I don't have any advice for a mobile setup, but on desktop I've had good success with TDR's SlickEQ Mastering plugin which is pretty good at matching references:
https://www.tokyodawn.net/tdr-slickeq-m/

Thanks. Let me know how the transition to iPad mixing presets works out for you.

Slush

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Headphones aren't really any use for me as they put pressure on my head making me more likely to have one of my head pains.

I see, and what about In Ear headphones?

Never really considered them. Do they make decent in Ear headphones - never had any myself, but I’ve not really looked for any either, so I’m open minded.

Me either, but maybe something to dive into: https://www.musicradar.com/news/best-in-ear-monitors

Etienne

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Headphones aren't really any use for me as they put pressure on my head making me more likely to have one of my head pains.

I see, and what about In Ear headphones?

Never really considered them. Do they make decent in Ear headphones - never had any myself, but I’ve not really looked for any either, so I’m open minded.

Me either, but maybe something to dive into: https://www.musicradar.com/news/best-in-ear-monitors

There's also reddit for recommendations of chi-fi in ears.

@Fruitbat1919 I don't know if your studio monitors are directly connected to your ipad but if connected to a desktop computer, I'd recommend calibrating your output with soundid reference which can be put in your daw. (Or to the whole mac output)

Fruitbat1919

@Etienne said:

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:

@Fruitbat1919 said:

@Slush said:
I frequently check on my headphones using a free Auratone mono speaker impulse response:
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/13569/Auratone_441kHz.wav
Don’t know if it works for you but I find it very useful. The Auratone speakers are and where found in many recording studios to check how a song would sound on simple consumer speakers. I believe lots of Michael Jackson’s recordings where judged through these.

Headphones aren't really any use for me as they put pressure on my head making me more likely to have one of my head pains.

I see, and what about In Ear headphones?

Never really considered them. Do they make decent in Ear headphones - never had any myself, but I’ve not really looked for any either, so I’m open minded.

Me either, but maybe something to dive into: https://www.musicradar.com/news/best-in-ear-monitors

There's also reddit for recommendations of chi-fi in ears.

@Fruitbat1919 I don't know if your studio monitors are directly connected to your ipad but if connected to a desktop computer, I'd recommend calibrating your output with soundid reference which can be put in your daw. (Or to the whole mac output)

My monitors are connected to an SP404mk2 which is basically acting as my audio interface for my iPad and my Minilogue XD. I don’t currently have a computer in my set up, beyond my iPad.

Etienne

Ah alright, it's more minimalistic than mine then lol. Maybe there are some apps allowing precise output calibration. However, it can have downsides but I mostly focus on the good ones

Mountain_Hamlet

I use a pair of Sennheiser HD300s as my main mixing monitors. I am getting to know how they sound now and so can get a balance going pretty quickly. Once I’m reasonably happy with the balance I will check them on the iPad speakers, on my iphone headset, the iphone speakers and the car. I’m not in a position currently to work with speakers, but that’s on the list to have soon. I think the main thing is getting to know what your monitors do in relation to frequencies (no matter what monitors they are). If you know your monitors well enough you should be able to adjust the mix accordingly. Maybe a spectrogram or an EQ with RTA on the master output so you can see what is going on? I have been using Logic’s mastering plugin to educate me in what frequencies I am not hearing as accurately as I would like and creating my own little EQ curve on the master to compensate for this. This approach appears to be working well in ensuring I don’t overcompensate in the mix.

DMfan

@squeals said:
When I read about car tests, I’ve always felt the advice gives a technical reason why you shouldn’t mix for the car, but misses the point.

You shouldn’t mix for the car, but your mix should sound good in the car!
I listen to most of half my music in the car. I’d never make little adjustments based on the car, but if something is off it’s back to the drawing board.

Personally, I have my monitors, my hi fi, my good headphones, my iPhone headphones car & my tv. If it sounds good on them I’m good to go. (I have set to my taste.)

+1

More or less my way. I use headphones with TB Morphit on/off, listen and cross-check with a spectogram for frequency anomalies, check on iPad speakers, earpods, and my hifi system at home.

But my main audio checkpoint is my car. If it sounds good there, I am most often good to go.

I fully realize however that I am in no way delivering ”pro” mixes. I can hear it is a lot left to do when I compare with pro mixes. But it’s my hobby and good enough and I learn things along the way.

Most important is to have fun!

😎

/DMfan🇸🇪

abf

There is good advice in this thread.

I mix listening with Kali IN-5 speakers, then check with headphones and earbuds. If something is off I'll usually catch it.

Then my wife (bassist) drives around in the car, listens, and comes home with a report. She doesn't comment with technical complaints, she'll say something like "the vocal in verse 2 sounds pale". It's her gut response and it's the most valuable feedback of all.

Also, I do believe there is generally much more bass in modern tracks compared to tracks I've listened to from the past. But it's possible you're getting a build-up of bass frequencies in your room.

Disclaimer: I don't love the mixing part of making tracks and I am no pro.

yellow_eyez

@reasOne said:
I just mix with my monitors and my te ob4.
Then the famous car test

I like you more and more with every post

Fruitbat1919

@abf said:
There is good advice in this thread.

I mix listening with Kali IN-5 speakers, then check with headphones and earbuds. If something is off I'll usually catch it.

Then my wife (bassist) drives around in the car, listens, and comes home with a report. She doesn't comment with technical complaints, she'll say something like "the vocal in verse 2 sounds pale". It's her gut response and it's the most valuable feedback of all.

Also, I do believe there is generally much more bass in modern tracks compared to tracks I've listened to from the past. But it's possible you're getting a build-up of bass frequencies in your room.

Disclaimer: I don't love the mixing part of making tracks and I am no pro.

Yes, I do without doubt have a bass issue to some degree in the room. My wife is very understanding having fishing tackle in the dining room, under the bed storage and music gear in the living room. I'm not sure she will go for bass traps and other room audio control - although some of the really expensive odd shaped wall mounted blocks look quite arty.

If only I could use headphones without issues, I would definitely invest. I'm also getting a little problematic tinnitus of late, so probably an ear syringing might help.

Ailerom

Trying to mix for everything but if I'm being honest it's probably more likely to work best in a car and on headphones.

yellow_eyez

Best is my Adam A monitors

Next would be my Beat studio pro headphones - they are the best sound quality cans that people will be wearing/buying so I want to hear what they do in the mix

Finally trying it in different cars the way people try different cans

Someone said it’s good to have
One open back
One close back
And one standard buds

But I like morphit with Beats Studio pro as they are AMAZING quality and then the Adam are like the best near field you can get under $5k

Do what you ears tell you