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I have yet to read the article, but with these type of arguments (and clickbait titles by the media) I wonder who is the “we” being referred to.
Edit: After reviewing the article, I felt my assumption was fairly accurate: the “we” seems to refer primarily to an older demographic that gravitates toward familiar music. This isn’t surprising, but it’s also worth noting that listeners’ habits are diverse.
For example, I’ve noticed that many classic rock fans resist newer bands that pay homage to original sounds, such as Stolen Prayer, which some liken to Mötley Crüe. Ironically, these same listeners often avoid new releases from legacy bands, even when they capture the '80s style, as Def Leppard has. It seems that they find comfort in the original tracks from their youth.
My own tastes were shaped in the '80s, and I naturally gravitate toward that style. As rock music evolved in the '90s, I found myself exploring other genres, like dub and roots reggae, and classic soul and funk, to fill the void. This journey led me to discover contemporary music that resonates with my early influences, such as blues-infused rock and ’80s-inspired synthwave.
While I still enjoy the old hits, I actively seek out fresh sounds within these styles. Perhaps this isn’t the norm, but I believe there’s value in balancing nostalgia with discovery.
I think that context and emotions connected to certain music make quite a difference though.
I can't remember that I was much different as a kid - different times, different life, different music.
According to Wikipedia, despite the manic upfullness, Denpa Song as a genre has dark origins, being based off the defense statement of an insane serial killer in Japan who attacked people at random on the basis of ‘electro magnetic waves’ in his head compelling him to, in a ‘What’s the frequency, Kenneth’ kind of way. The genre is supposed to be the literal soundtrack of insanity.
I guess I’m kind of warming to it.
(Sidenote: as a cop I once dealt with a severely mentally deranged and violent woman who had called police and then immediately stabbed the first attending officer, because BBC DJs on the radio had told her to do it. I had quite a lengthy row with the Independent Police Complaints Commission, as it was then known, who were insisting we investigate her allegations against the DJs. They only gave up when I said I was happy to investigate after her release from a secure mental hospital, but only if one of the IPCC civilian investigators attended with me. And knocked on her door first. Delusions of control by technology have always been with us. At the dawn of scientific psychiatry in the 19th Century, case studies noted people who felt they were controlled by the tech wonders of their day - steam engines and hydraulic power.)
That was rather interesting to read.
I love Chiptune, and I'm 40. 😅 In fact, I'm working on a track with Chiptune elements. But what is Denp-
...sorry I asked. That was "fingernails on a chalkboard" bad. 😂 I mean, even given its interesting dark origins, that squeaky voice is grating!
That said, I don't think Rick Beato would ever touch upon Denpa. He seems to go after the Spotify Top 10s and whinge about what's there.
And you thought Crazy Frog was irritating
You love chiptune, and I am twenty two years older than you, more than half your whole life over again. I remember when Chiptune was the only music you could have on a computer. Hell, I remember when computers couldn’t fit in a room, let alone on a desk, never mind make music. I find it kind of bizarre when a younger generation (by which I mean you, of course!) venerate the sound of SID chips and Soundblaster cards.. Back in my day,we could only imagine orchestras, but 2 op FM and a gritty second or two of sampled noise was all we had, dammit. I saved my first samples to 5.25” actually floppy discs, for use with my C64 disc drive, my Datel Sampler64 cart:
And my Steinberg Pro16 sequencer cart
And yet, you tell kids that today, and will they believe you? You were lucky, etc…
…On the other hand, I really am coming round to Denpa. Just for its attitude, as much as anything.
Try playing Francium a few times, and see if it doesn’t grow on you. Like a fungus, or leprosy, maybe. Before you know it, you’ll be singing along. Or wanting to stab random strangers. Or both.
And yeah, I really can’t see Rick ‘digging’ it. As I believe the young people used to say.
On that other hand, of course, I really am ‘down with the kids’, obviously. I blend right in.
🎯🎯🎯
Yah to him it would sound more like the product of tech rather than a person, which tends to be his line. My folks (a little older than him) are in that camp. If it doesn't sound like a person it is just a novelty item, not worthy of much praise.
Wow. I found that very interesting.
Yah wow, interesting!
I recently told myself that as an experiment for my work/career to let AI take the lead and essentially do it's bidding. Not kidding. As a thought experiment it does relieve a certain layer of angst, giving in to a higher power sort of thing. Will be sure not to take it too far, beyond creative exercise.
Dear @Gavinski, actually I much prefer what I’m doing now compared to live playing. Part of it is that it’s a lot less pressured (obviously many musicians are not bothered by that). Also, iOS is just a lot more fun (though solitary). It’s also satisfying to midi edit my improvisations. I have no problem with that as the idea is to make the best listening possible for the listener (and myself).
For me a live audience is less important than the intense creative fun of producing a finished track.
I used to play in clubs in my twenties when I knew nothing about jazz, but I also played (one time) at Birdland and The Blue Note. Frankly, it didn’t rev me up. I did do one live concert, however, and it worked out very well. It became my first cd.
The word “We” is doing a lot of work in that assumption.
The real question is “Is there any sense in speaking of a collective “We” in 2024?”
For example, the vast majority of songs with lyrics from the past are from a heterosexual point of view. And most classic rock and pop is from a MALE heterosexual point of view. The vast majority of it deals in the objectification of women. So there’s 50% of the population who still need new music until a balance is created with everything that already exists. And that’s just scratching the surface of “the others”.
“We”!
Who is “We”?
Do “We” need any more music that addresses the concerns and feelings and tastes of the western heterosexual male? Perhaps not. But that is true for cultural production in general, and is not particular to music.
Beyond that even it seems the medium of music for music's sake itself within western civilization, much like paintings, (also traditional male dong driven) is increasingly just not as important culturally as it was. People are not just nostalgic for old music, they are nostalgic for what music used to mean to culture at large. We are now in a world of increasing hyper individuality where even the mediums/platforms people feel are relevant to their even having a worldview are becoming so individualized. The amount of people for whom music is just a trivial thing and not worthy of much focus in their life is much greater as they gravitate to games, influencers, culture war platforms etc.
I agree with this 100%. The old way where the new pushed out the old wasn’t always fair or optimal, but it did ensure a dynamic culture where the young could more easily differentiate themselves from the past.
I always felt that largely came across more as young people being manipulated by branding and image simply to drive corporate interest. The post WW2 propaganda lessons applied to youth culture demographics to pick their budding pockets. All this continued Gen X,Y,Z, alpha stuff will more and more come across as corporate astrology and degrade very quickly as individuals progress down their personal rabbit holes. I guess the music outlet kept young people from wielding real axes though, so that was good (For the establishment maaaaan!). Maybe differentiating oneself from the past has it's negative side effects. Perhaps it is good in many ways to be continually immersed and reflect back upon the past, as not to lose sight of our roots and be so simply manipulated by the new shinies, both material and ideological.
Alternate hypothesis: There have been very few musical developments in pop since 1980. Most of the difference is in sound and production. The common practices in melody, harmony, and rhythm have barely evolved at all since then.
Second alternative hypothesis: People prefer music made by humans rather than machines. Synthesizers, drum machines, and autotune can be alienating to many listeners.
Some good points! The Adam Curtis documentary The Century of the Self is so insightful on this topic:
Edit: first line of that video is missing the words: ‘100 years ago’
We are all part of the same thing here. If music brings divisive identitarian conceits to mind, then seek out better, more inspiring music.
Interesting, thanks for the link!
We are forum members, not clones you know.
I meant, we are all earthlings reflecting the universe back upon itself, created of stardust molecules vibrating in synchronicity with energy waves set in motion by the Big Bang. Music is one pathway into experiencing this reflection in vibrational harmonicity with other beings.
Quit hogging the spliff and pass it along already, would you? We are all in need of it.
BTW, on a more serious note, Happy belated Carl Sagan Day! @Wrlds2ndBstGeoshredr
It's the same urge that drives people to go live in culturally deadened suburban places (like where I live). They want nothing challenging, nothing "weird," nothing that disturbs their comfort in knowing what they like and what good taste means to them.
Capitalist cultural production keeps reselling the same culture to us because it's safe to assume what was sold before will sell again.
The vigor and dynamism of the pre-digital era were in spite of these things.
Fortunately, the "we" in the article title doesn't really exist. There are millions of us who want to hear new things. Even some of us who live within the hermetically sealed world of suburban hellscapes.
@Blipsford_Baubie said:
Sure I was high, but is what I wrote any more loopy than the guy saying we have enough music by hetero males?
Sounds reasonable to me...
I understood the "we" to mean the majority of music consumers. I figured many here are in the minority, which is why I added the question mark and started this discussion.
On the one hand, I can surely appreciate finding comfort in the familiar. On the other, I am so, so tired of the same old 💩
Not at all. The former sounds like the result of thinking, reflection, and creative postulation. The latter sounds like it came out of an echo chamber.