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Xequence apps gone? (Solved: only in the EU)

HarlekinXHarlekinX
edited December 8 in General App Discussion

Searched for Xequence 2 in the german app store.
It says that it is not available in my region
Xequence Keys and Xequence Pads are gone too.

Here are my archived german app store links

Are the apps still available in the US store?

«1

Comments

  • lasselulasselu
    edited December 8

    I can't access any of his apps in the Swedish store...

  • bygjohnbygjohn

    They’re in the UK store, FWIW.

  • DavDav

    They are in the US store.

  • HarlekinXHarlekinX

    Ok, than it seems to be a Europe thing, when it's gone in Sweden too, but not UK or US.
    Probably the new european regulations that require to make your private address and phone number available.
    Hope I still receive updates, if there should be any.
    Thanks, everybody.

  • lasselulasselu

    Hey @SevenSystems, what's happening?

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems

    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems

    @HarlekinX and could you possibly change the thread title to include "...in the EU"? Thank you!

  • DarkstringDarkstring

    Just curious, what does this mean for future app updates in the EU? We’re SOL?

  • offbrandsoffbrands
    edited December 8

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Isn’t Marek of Elf Audio in the EU? I’m sure he’s got some info on that. If I think of any EU devs I’ll share them with you as well.

    Also 360 is eye watering ugh. Apple consistently prove their one of late-stage capitalism’s final bosses congealed into a closed sourced corporation ran by suits

  • lasselulasselu

    @Darkstring said:
    Just curious, what does this mean for future app updates in the EU? We’re SOL?

    Good question...

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems
    edited December 8

    @HarlekinX thank you for editing the title!

    @Darkstring said:
    Just curious, what does this mean for future app updates in the EU? We’re SOL?

    Yes, sorry.

    @offbrands said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Isn’t Marek of Elf Audio in the EU? I’m sure he’s got some info on that. If I think of any EU devs I’ll share them with you as well.

    No, he's in the UK / US, judging from his website.

    Also 360 is eye watering ugh.

    That is the cost of a P.O. Box in Ireland for a year. Granted, the app sales in the EU are higher than that, so it would make sense economically. I just have to know if it will work or not before I purchase it.

    Apple consistently prove their one of late-stage capitalism’s final bosses congealed into a closed sourced corporation ran by suits

    This problem is being caused by the EU, not by Apple. It is regulatory overreach and the resulting collateral damage. Apple actually actively fought these regulations.

  • offbrandsoffbrands

    @SevenSystems said:
    @HarlekinX thank you for editing the title!

    @Darkstring said:
    Just curious, what does this mean for future app updates in the EU? We’re SOL?

    Yes, sorry.

    @offbrands said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Isn’t Marek of Elf Audio in the EU? I’m sure he’s got some info on that. If I think of any EU devs I’ll share them with you as well.

    No, he's in the UK / US, judging from his website.

    Ahhh you may be right. Apologies. I should have thought about that more.

    Also 360 is eye watering ugh.

    That is the cost of a P.O. Box in Ireland for a year. Granted, the app sales in the EU are higher than that, so it would make sense economically. I just have to know if it will work or not before I purchase it.

    Oh okay I got it that’s what you meant by arrangement. Apologies.

    Apple consistently prove their one of late-stage capitalism’s final bosses congealed into a closed sourced corporation ran by suits

    This problem is being caused by the EU, not by Apple. It is regulatory overreach and the resulting collateral damage. Apple actually actively fought these regulations.

    Oh okay I conflated the fees you mentioned as apples for devs. My bad.

    I don’t know enough about the EU regulations but I’ll spend some time to understand. Is there anything you can point me towards that you have? If not quickly then no worries.

    Either way that’s unfortunate.

    I still stand by my Apple hate / love though. Even if this wasn’t them their fingers are in plenty of shit pies where my above statement is applicable. I’ll apologize for my other lack of knowledge / assumptions though but never about my apple shit talk 🤪

    Apple user for 20 years (iPods, imacs, iPhone 3GS and every other gen since, MacBooks, the lot.) and still one and will always be one but I talk shit because I want better from what I love 🤷🏻‍♂️

  • DarkstringDarkstring

    Ok, how about future downloads of existing versions?
    It’s worrying, if apps can simply disappear completely. Does not inspire confidence in this model/marketplace at all.
    People in ALL markets should consider this, before spending any money on anything here.
    Seems the best way is to save purchases for desktop and then only those products where eye-patch backups are available in case of bankruptcy or shenanigans.

  • azul3D_Appsazul3D_Apps
    edited December 8

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Hi @SevenSystems, I was able to meet the EU DSA trader requirements using a PO Box in the US. Of course this results in recurring extra costs that need to be recovered or else it isn’t viable in this niche market.

    Edit: should have noticed you needed confirmation from an EU dev. Hopefully Apple will accept EU PO Boxes too.

  • offbrandsoffbrands

    @azul3D_Apps said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Hi @SevenSystems, I was able to meet the EU DSA trader requirements using a PO Box in the US. Of course this results in recurring extra costs that need to be recovered or else it isn’t viable in this niche market.

    You a real one for reaching out in this. Well more of one because Piano Motifs is legit. Great update this week 🙏🏽

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems

    @offbrands said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    @HarlekinX thank you for editing the title!

    @Darkstring said:
    Just curious, what does this mean for future app updates in the EU? We’re SOL?

    Yes, sorry.

    @offbrands said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Isn’t Marek of Elf Audio in the EU? I’m sure he’s got some info on that. If I think of any EU devs I’ll share them with you as well.

    No, he's in the UK / US, judging from his website.

    Ahhh you may be right. Apologies. I should have thought about that more.

    Also 360 is eye watering ugh.

    That is the cost of a P.O. Box in Ireland for a year. Granted, the app sales in the EU are higher than that, so it would make sense economically. I just have to know if it will work or not before I purchase it.

    Oh okay I got it that’s what you meant by arrangement. Apologies.

    All good.

    Apple consistently prove their one of late-stage capitalism’s final bosses congealed into a closed sourced corporation ran by suits

    This problem is being caused by the EU, not by Apple. It is regulatory overreach and the resulting collateral damage. Apple actually actively fought these regulations.

    Oh okay I conflated the fees you mentioned as apples for devs. My bad.

    All good.

    I don’t know enough about the EU regulations but I’ll spend some time to understand. Is there anything you can point me towards that you have? If not quickly then no worries.

    It's rather simple -- anyone who offers any kind of digital product in the EU now has to publish for the whole internet to see a physical address where they do business. In the case of indie developers who can't afford or refuse to rent separate business premises, this means their home address.

    I still stand by my Apple hate / love though. Even if this wasn’t them their fingers are in plenty of shit pies where my above statement is applicable. I’ll apologize for my other lack of knowledge / assumptions though but never about my apple shit talk 🤪

    Apple user for 20 years (iPods, imacs, iPhone 3GS and every other gen since, MacBooks, the lot.) and still one and will always be one but I talk shit because I want better from what I love 🤷🏻‍♂️

    I'm torn on Apple myself, but mostly for technical reasons. I'm mostly disappointed by the constant degradation of their software quality and loss of holistic vision since Steve Jobs left this universe.

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems

    @Darkstring said:
    Ok, how about future downloads of existing versions?
    It’s worrying, if apps can simply disappear completely. Does not inspire confidence in this model/marketplace at all.

    Yes, I completely agree, despite me being one of those developers. It's one of the reasons I would love to offer all my apps as browser apps instead so they are free of these restrictions. Unfortunately, monetizing them is far more complex if you go that route, so I haven't finished this yet. For all criticism that Apple has to take, monetizing software via the App Store is still comparably simple compared to, say, web apps. But maybe I'm doing something wrong.

    Here's hoping all of my apps will soon be available in the browser, and thus on any device, without any restrictions.

    I'm still considering to license or open-source them for a reasonable fee. I'd actually prefer this because I want to avoid being involved in the actual marketing and sales side of software in the future.

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems

    @azul3D_Apps said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    Hello all,

    yes, unfortunately, I have taken the decision to remove my apps from sale in the EU due to privacy concerns as @HarlekinX has guessed correctly.

    This decision had already been contemplated before, but combined with a separate massive privacy violation that occurred to me recently, I have decided to significantly reduce my public attack surface.

    I will consider putting my apps back on sale in the EU if a P.O. Box address works instead of a physical address.

    Unfortunately, the information available on this is very vague and I have not yet seen a firsthand confirmation from a EU app developer that has successfully used a P.O. Box as his "Trader" address.

    If anyone here can confirm that this works, I will consider shelling out EUR 360 a year for such an arrangement and bring the apps back.

    Thank you for your understanding, and all hail the EU! 🙏

    Hi @SevenSystems, I was able to meet the EU DSA trader requirements using a PO Box in the US. Of course this results in recurring extra costs that need to be recovered or else it isn’t viable in this niche market.

    Edit: should have noticed you needed confirmation from an EU dev. Hopefully Apple will accept EU PO Boxes too.

    Thank you for your help, it's appreciated a lot. This does sound encouraging. Should I get a confirmation from a developer that is also a sole proprietor and lives in the EU, I will rent a P.O. Box and make the apps available again.

  • oldsynthguyoldsynthguy
    edited December 8

    Just out of curiosity - what’s the issue with complying with EU trading regulations?

    Online businesses here in the UK are required by law to include their business address and contact details on their website, but doesn’t seem to be an issue? If they’re trading from a home address, they’ll have to use that.

  • offbrandsoffbrands
    edited December 8

    @SevenSystems said:

    @Darkstring said:
    Ok, how about future downloads of existing versions?
    It’s worrying, if apps can simply disappear completely. Does not inspire confidence in this model/marketplace at all.

    Yes, I completely agree, despite me being one of those developers. It's one of the reasons I would love to offer all my apps as browser apps instead so they are free of these restrictions. Unfortunately, monetizing them is far more complex if you go that route, so I haven't finished this yet. For all criticism that Apple has to take, monetizing software via the App Store is still comparably simple compared to, say, web apps. But maybe I'm doing something wrong.

    Here's hoping all of my apps will soon be available in the browser, and thus on any device, without any restrictions.

    I'm still considering to license or open-source them for a reasonable fee. I'd actually prefer this because I want to avoid being involved in the actual marketing and sales side of software in the future.

    The new owners of Audiobus seem to have money to spend. I think they got some of Audiokits apps too if I’m not mistaken

    Just try and make sure they agree to not turn on tracking if they do acquire your products, as it’s been a thing they’ve done on their new to them products so far on at least one of their acquisitions (Audiobus) and it’s a rightfully touchy subject.

  • wimwim
    edited December 8

    @offbrands said:
    Just try and make sure they agree to not turn on tracking if they do acquire your products, as it’s been a thing they’ve done on their new to them products and it’s a rightfully touchy subject

    Tracking has only been added so far to Audiobus, but definitely something to watch for if they update the Audiokit apps they acquired.

  • offbrandsoffbrands

    @wim said:

    @offbrands said:
    Just try and make sure they agree to not turn on tracking if they do acquire your products, as it’s been a thing they’ve done on their new to them products and it’s a rightfully touchy subject

    Tracking has only been added so far to Audiobus, but definitely something to watch for if they update the Audiokit apps they acquired.

    Ooo fair point! I’ll fix that. Thank you @wim

  • uncledaveuncledave

    @oldsynthguy said:
    Just out of curiosity - what’s the issue with complying with EU trading regulations?

    Online businesses here in the UK are required by law to include their business address and contact details on their website, but doesn’t seem to be an issue? If they’re trading from a home address, they’ll have to use that.

    "Trading" is a pretty big word for a part-time developer, selling through the Apple AppStore. He has no involvement in payments, product delivery, or warranty. He has no actual contact with customers. Customers only do business with Apple. Their only recourse is to request a refund from Apple. They don't need to know the developer's home address in order to do that.

    And I suppose the issue is the increased risk of identity theft, and family endangerment, from publishing personal contact data. Not only risk from angry customers (unlikely), but risk from the entire internet.

  • nickpettnickpett

    It’s taken a decade but the first advantage of Brexit?!

  • MadGavMadGav

    @nickpett said:
    It’s taken a decade but the first advantage of Brexit?!

    Not really, because to sell to the EU you have to comply with EU regulation (same as the rest of the globe). It’s become an issue for small businesses with new regulations coming in to force round about now - my wife is about to turn off sales to EU in her Shopify.

  • tom_wardtom_ward

    @SevenSystems said:
    For all criticism that Apple has to take, monetizing software via the App Store is still comparably simple compared to, say, web apps. But maybe I'm doing something wrong.

    You're not doing something wrong. Apple gained this position in large part because of how easy they've made it for people to market apps. Doing all the work yourself is a lot more work, and more difficult.

    Side note, I'd be really interested to see how your apps would port to the web! That could be really powerful.

  • SevenSystemsSevenSystems

    @tom_ward said:

    @SevenSystems said:
    For all criticism that Apple has to take, monetizing software via the App Store is still comparably simple compared to, say, web apps. But maybe I'm doing something wrong.

    You're not doing something wrong. Apple gained this position in large part because of how easy they've made it for people to market apps. Doing all the work yourself is a lot more work, and more difficult.

    Yes, indeed. It's not even mostly technical hurdles, but simply bureaucracy and "compliance" (i.e., drive small developers and businesses out of the market but at the same time pretend to be protecting them).

    Side note, I'd be really interested to see how your apps would port to the web! That could be really powerful.

    All my iOS apps are already web apps in a web view. There is no need to port them.

  • tom_wardtom_ward

    @SevenSystems said:
    All my iOS apps are already web apps in a web view. There is no need to port them.

    Hah, well played!

  • oldsynthguyoldsynthguy
    edited December 9

    @uncledave said:

    @oldsynthguy said:
    Just out of curiosity - what’s the issue with complying with EU trading regulations?

    Online businesses here in the UK are required by law to include their business address and contact details on their website, but doesn’t seem to be an issue? If they’re trading from a home address, they’ll have to use that.

    "Trading" is a pretty big word for a part-time developer, selling through the Apple AppStore. He has no involvement in payments, product delivery, or warranty. He has no actual contact with customers. Customers only do business with Apple. Their only recourse is to request a refund from Apple. They don't need to know the developer's home address in order to do that.

    And I suppose the issue is the increased risk of identity theft, and family endangerment, from publishing personal contact data. Not only risk from angry customers (unlikely), but risk from the entire internet.

    They’re creating a product, which they supply to Apple for payment, purchased by tens, hundreds, possibly even thousands of unique customers. That’s trading. Apple provide the hosting, promotion, point of sale stuff for which they take their own cut from the sale.

    I’m interested in understanding why developers selling via Apple should be able to remain anonymous, whilst equally sized developers - who could also be trading from a home address - selling direct to the public, don’t have that privilege.

    Not trying to start a debate, just genuinely curious why there should be a two-teir system 🧐

  • brambosbrambos

    @oldsynthguy said:
    I’m interested in understanding why developers selling via Apple should be able to remain anonymous, whilst equally sized developers - who could also be trading from a home address - selling direct to the public, don’t have that privilege.

    If you buy a book, are you entitled to knowing where the author lives? No, of course not. You're only dealing with the publisher.

    Apps are very much the same deal, and Apple / App Store is the publisher.

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