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Which MPE instruments on iOS allow you to assign all 5 parameters of MPE?
Which MPE instruments on iOS allow you to assign and control all 5 MPE parameters, or at least 4? To clarify, I mean:
1. Pitch Bend (X-axis): Per-note pitch control for slides or vibrato.
2. Timbre (Y-axis): Modulating tone or texture, like filter cutoff or wavetable position.
3. Pressure (Z-axis): Pressure after striking a note, often controlling dynamics or modulation.
4. Velocity: Initial note attack or volume based on how hard you strike.
5. Release Velocity: How quickly you release a note, shaping the sound’s tail.
Many apps partially support MPE, but I want to compile a list of those that allow full assignment of all 5 parameters—or at least 4. Release velocity, in particular, is rare to find as an assignable parameter.
Comments
No advice, sorry. Just starred the thread and curious to learn more. For instance I haven’t seen those 5 so neatly put yet, thanks!
Are you saying those expensive single instrument SWAM apps does not, not even 4 by your list standard. That is very disappointing, I don't have a proper MPE controller but when I do "browse and dream" -- I usually connect my controller to SWAM and mpe' the shit out of it (I mean, it is, still a dream).
It's a very good point to bring up Gavin.
Volt I think is full MPE
Very curious about this list of apps as well.
Tera pro
The SWAM apps are mostly monophonic (except SWAM string instruments allow two notes?), so even though they allow lots of expression modulation they are not really MPE at all. It's not a failing of theirs; it's just that monophonic instruments can't be MPE. I think just about any monophonic synth can be made to respond to all five of the MPE parameters, assuming they are sent to the synth.
The key thing about MPE is that it's Midi Polyphonic Expression, which allows for multiple notes to be played at the same time, while each note is modulated independently of the others. For example, different pitch bends can be applied to each note, or the notes can have different filter cutoffs, or change dynamics differently. On ordinary polyphonic synths that are not MPE, the synth applies a single pitch bend, filter cutoff, etc. to all notes being played at the same time.
Not sure how the SWAM apps respond to release velocity, but that's kind of a poor sister of the first four modulations, not many situations (or instruments) where it makes sense to do much with release velocity, which like velocity is just a single instantaneous value for each note, not something that allows you to modify a note's expression over time. In most cases with MPE, I think the first three parameters (pitch bend, timbre, and pressure) are by far most important. (Velocity, of course, is also important, but since most[?] non-MPE polyphonic synths already allow simultaneous notes to have different velocities, you don't really gain anything with respect to velocity modulation when you move to MPE.)
Regarding SWAM apps, I would say that even though they aren't MPE because they're monophonic, they are still among the most satisfying apps to use from a good MPE controller, which will have a natural-feeling way to modify the parameters associated with the x, y, and z axes.
Roli Noise has all 5 parameters, but sadly the app was abandoned long ago (which is a damn shame since it was one of the best things Roli had going). However it still works & still sounds great... and also a lot of fun with my Lightpad Block.
Edit: I saw Roli is going to release a new (and bigger) Lightpad Block, so maybe they'll also revive Noise. It's Roli, so I won't get my hopes up, but would love to see it.
Right, appreciate the lecture. (that sound poisonous - but I really do) 😃
Good question, i thought Bricks had all 5, but it does not.
I'm guessing many will fail on (5), release velocity modulation. I only remember BM3 having it, and I noticed AudioLayer mentioned it in an update - both Release and Key Release, not sure what the difference is though. They also mentioned MPE with Aftertouch. Anyone knows if AudioLayer supports all 5 on the list?
I believe AudioDamage (Continua, Quanta 2) can do the first 4 on the list. They call Y-axis CC74 and Pressure is Aftertouch.
Here is a Continua MPE walkthrough:
Sorry, I thought you were serious in suggesting that the "expensive" SWAM apps were "disappointing" because they weren't MPE. Maybe you were joking?
I'm trying to understand how a synth could implement the first four items, but not support 5) Release Velocity.
If the first four items are supported it means that the synth is accepting Note On messages on different midi channels. Presumably if a synth doesn't support 'Release Velocity' modulation then it simply ignores the velocity specified in the corresponding Note Off message. So I guess that means "unsupported".
But adding support seems like a trivial matter. Just use a midi filtering/routing tool to send any CC messages you want based on the velocity in a Note Off message, before sending the Note Off message to the synth. It's guaranteed to affect only that note because of the way MPE has to be implemented under the covers (each note on a different channel).
I think the bigger problem with Release Velocity and MPE would be in controllers that don't support it, and just send 0 or some constant value as the velocity in Note Off.
Thnx Hes. I agree that Release Velocity is not a very important one, though it is nice to have. MPE Velocity, on the other hand, is a super important one. Baby Audio Atoms doesn't have it the lack of it is horrible imo. Note-on velocity allows you to gradually fade in a note when playing, This is similar to the Pressure parameter but is different, as it's about the attack portion only, whereas pressure is similar to aftertouch.
Roli Noise is and was great as a preset player that (in many patches but not all) allows you to use all 5 for expression, but it doesn't really allow you to have any choice about what's assigned to what. I wish they'd just released an iOS version of Equator!
The only (major) problem with Quanta 2 is that pitch seems to work so strangely. I slide from a C to the C note above and it is not a C! In the Quanta 2 thread someone posted a workaround for this but it looked like a hassle. Haven't used Continua in a long time, I think though it didn't have that problem if I remember right
Well said, and totally agree!
Regarding velocity, I was mostly just suggesting that MPE support of per-note-velocity isn't especially exciting or groundbreaking, because per-note velocity is already present in many/most polyphonic synths. The main thing added by MPE is the support for a continuous stream of per-note modulations on x/y/z axes.
That sounds strange with Baby Audio Atoms, and also like it's something specific to that synth, or a problem with the controller.
It's not possible to have a Note On message without a velocity (has to be there and be from 0 to 127), so I'm not clear what you mean by it not being supported. You mean with Baby Audio Atoms the note velocities aren't independent?
With a decent controller there is no problem creating a gradual fade in using pressure, whether MPE or not. Initial velocity will be there in the Note On message, presumably quite low just like the values in the pressure messages, and if they modify same thing [e.g., gain] then the initial velocity gets superseded by pressure within some milliseconds anyway. I think the classic way to play MPE is to think of it as using pressure to create your envelopes. (I'm sure you could get a more gradual and even fade in by disregarding pressure: set a slow attack envelope -- instead of immediate -- and trigger it to rise to the velocity in the Note On message. But that's essentially a form of automation. and MPE is more about performative expression.)
Or maybe I'm misunderstanding the Baby Audio issue. But whatever it is I don't see how it could be caused by somehow supporting velocity, but not supporting per-note (MPE) velocity.
I don´t think it was a workaround, but Quanta puts some responsibility on you as the user when using pitch bend. I don´t remember the details, but if you assign pitch bend to modulate the oscillator tuning AND the quantized grains tuning then you get an undesired double effect.
Finding synths that actually allow the user to assign mpe parameters individually is pretty challenging. Seems to be common to allow cc74 an independent assignment, and sometimes pressure, but 4 or 5 parameters is rare for sure.
Bleass Megalit it's one of the very few that gives you 5. 💕
RingsFx and Wavecloud allow 4 assignments. No release.
I mean, with Atoms you have no control over fade in time. Playing say a pad sound with a regular keyboard and with an mpe keyboard like the Roli Seaboard will be exactly the same experience. There is no expression. Velocity does control note loudness but makes no difference to attack. You know what I mean?
Right, it's strange isn't it. As Hes said, it should be very easy to add release velocity as an assignable parameter, I don't get why it's so rare
It’s not that common but release can be quite useful. For a dramatic ending, or retriggering an envelope, like in krell type self generating patches
Maybe because it is uncommon in controllers.
Which of your controllers sends non-0 release velocity?
Why is language so difficult, even when we use the same?
I was not joking, and SWAM was what came to mind so I used it in my somewhat rhetorical return question to G.
Most of the stuff you say in your reply I did not know of and therefor I appreciated it, and I thought, I told you that.
My knowledge on the backbones of MPE is (was) very narrow and there's already a lot of good info in here. As mentioned in my first post, my thoughts (dreams) on MPE are (were) probably very unrealistic.
Linnstrument and Sensel Morph both send a true release value.
Curious if you have an MPE capable controller that doesn't send release?
Seaboard does too
This is good to know I’m currently using a Morph.
Which seaboard are you using?
Seaboard Block. To be clear btw, I have not tested with a midi monitor whether this sends non zero values. All I know is that Roli identify it as being able to send all 5 mpe parameters and that when I use it with Roli Noise, at least some patches respond to release velocity. I'd assume all their mpe hardware uses all 5, and assumed that that would be standard with all controllers. The technicalities of how that parameter works are something I've never given much thought to, and I can't remember being able to assign it in any iOS apps.
I used Bleass Megalit to check. If you have it it shows all the values quite clearly.