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Work flow fustrations
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Please tell me im not alone....considering using apps as strictly sound sources.
Then routing ipad into outboard gear (effects, loop pedals etc). Seems a better work flow.
Thoughts?
Comments
Yes. I’m with you. Until Cubais, BM3 or any of the other DAW that are frustrating me get it together I’m back in Gadget and staying hiddden. 😬😃
iPad output plugged into outboard input....? What is specifically frustrating?
Haha ive been there. Gadets great, though i dont like being boxed it.
Im at an age where if the work flow is constantly troublesome the enjoyment sinks fast.
But i do believe it will get better.
I find that most of my frustrations are related to me always changing the bar on myself. For instance, "this app is going to be all I need" and then the next app comes along and I say, "this app is all I need!".
Funny that today I almost started a thread similar to this one. It was going to address the workflow like the OP which is, much ios music, integrated with my hardware, sent to my computer DAW. Or, is there an app that will allow me to record my hardware synths into my ios DAW.
I have several workflow scenarios that I need to work out and priortize and that's why I didn't post. But now that I'm here ...
No advice @breilly but just comiseration.
No, you’re not alone.
Just stay where you’re most inspired - really get into it - and follow that inspiration to the good place. iOS is here to help you, not trap you. Nothing wrong with using other gear.
I thought this was a fairly good workflow pep talk, even though it’s not my style at all:
You just need a decent interface and a mixer. No big deal, really. That said, what fx do you have in hardware that you can't do it ios? Very little, I would imagine.
Trying configurations: Loop effects synth jam
Have fun! Sure looks like it.
Big pain in the back yesterday: playing a guitar amp simulation in front of the PC.
So much easier with the iPad on the edge of table, a couple of effortless taps 'n swipes - instead of turning head, grabbing mouse, look to the other side, twist spine, click here, drag that menu...
On the other hand: those looping apps on iPad drive me nuts. Why can't they just leave the shit the way it is ? Every bit and piece MUST fit a beat precisely. I am NOT a swiss clockwork and don't wanna be either. Stretching sounds like crap on acoustic recordings.
Constant source of general annoyment: stupid zoom processing.
Regardless if you want to zoom at playhead position or an arbitrary area by the pinch gesture - your focus ALWAYS gets dragged off screen and another swipe back to center applies.
All it needs to alter the standard mode is a check when the zoomed area's extend hits the screen boundary. If that happens shift back to center, redraw left and/or right gap areas (in worst case) and any further zoom won't need intervention because the thing is centered.
My very first plugin (if I ever were to write one) would be a single sample delay, adjustable between zero and (say) 1000 samples. Estimated time an afternoon or two...
Shurely free of any bells and whistles, but incredibly useful for latency compensation.
I’m in the same boat as well. BM3 is too much of a long winded approach and It’s always had it’s stability issues. Cubasis has had it’s share of ups and downs. It’s gotten better. But no full screen for AUs and the timing lag in cycle mode really puts me off. Gadget might not be perfect. But it’s still the most stable, and the workflow is more fluid. Some people don’t like the closed environment. But with all the gadgets they continue to offer, it keeps me satisfied and busy enough to not mind all the AUs on the market. Most of them don’t seem so special to me anyway. I probably own more gadgets than AUs at this point. This was the whole reason I bought an iPad to begin with. So I’m gonna forget about everything else and continue with Gadget for iOS and Reason on my Mac. Everything else is just a distraction at this point.
6 years ago when I first got into iOS apps, there really was no connectivity with apps besides MIDI. So I used to run apps like Sunrizer XS and Animoog for iPhone as sound modules for my MPC2000. But as technology progressed and we had more options, things got more chaotic, and I’d spend more time troubleshooting than making music. I’ve seen so many people post all these crazy AUM and AudioBus combos, and I just couldn’t get into working like that without something going wrong. So simplicity is still the best thing for me and Gadget is king.
I was frustrated before I got my 2017 ipad. Now I can run a lot of apps well and quickly. Either in parallel, or bounce out and load in another etc. etc. Yah, it isn't perfect, I am constantly switching up the workflow and I hit snags but I enjoy what I hear now way more than I did before so the bumps in the road are worth going over moreso now. Maybe the new generation synths (Zeeon and up to Synmaster One) help a lot in that they don't sound grainy and lofi to me. Anyway, I don't have super specific goals and targets though. I could see how some very specific ideas simply don't work well (yet?). Anyway, the future is bright, I am loving this iPad and look forward to the next (or a Surface and Bitwig, hah)
Constraints are the fuel of creativity.
Well said! I started ios about 4 yrs ago, been back n forth, recently dipping in again, shocked to find the same fustrations still goin on.
I think theres too much focus put on programing rather than performance.
Are we not musicans?
I get more done in iOS with all-in-ones. Caustic, Gadget, Beathawk mainly.
I just use less and less my iPad and more and more my hardware.
For iPad BlocsWave (finish things at Ableton) and garageband. I even use less and less loopers or other tools/synths.
As Hardware I use what I need but not external mixer atm, just itrack dock and Phillips m1x...
I’ve been back and forth between iOS apps, hardware, and desktop setups more times over these past few years, that I’ve got nothing accomplished at all, musically. But I guess I gained a lot in terms of knowledge of what’s best for my workflow. So it wasn’t necessarily wasted time. Now I’m able to focus more on what actually works instead of expecting something that didn’t work yesterday to work tomorrow.
Are we not musicians?
We are Devo.
Preach it! I have an old iPad, 2nd gen, that I loaded with a couple of oldish apps. One of them is Virsyn iPoly — I wanted to force myself to use it on my lunch breaks. I had an incredibly productive time and was zinging on that energy for the rest of the day.
Hey so what setup did u find works for ya?
AUs, especially the MIDI AUs that came with iOS 11, was a big game changer for me. Right now I use AUM and Cubasis: AUM for audio phrases, and Cubasis for recording MIDI and also as a final hub for projects. It's still with certain limitations, but sometimes limitations can be used for focus.
After a shitload of hardware, software, and iOS apps over the past 23 years, I still feel the need for all 3 types of tools. So the definite keepers are Reason, my Roland JP-8080 (which I use in Reason with the JP-80X0 VST editor) and my x0xb0x which I built in ‘07. But when I wanna work strictly with my iPad, I gotta push everything aside for Gadget and my NanoKey Studio.
iPad best sound module/ sample library, creative external happy accident maker, best companion for any groovebox
While I admit that there’s often more time learning than making music, once I master something, the iPad doesn’t complicate but simplifies work flow, at least for me. Open apps, make connections and record. The creative part’s no easier with hardware than with iOS apps. My Tascam 32 track required an attached patch panel (with a diagram of what ports went where). I still have the notes I kept for myself when I wanted to mix synth, vocals and guitar by overdubbing. And timing was all by ear (humanization’s great, but you’d better be able to keep the beat!). With a midi sequencer and Ableton Link, precision’s improved. I don’t think I’d be creating pieces nearly as thorough without the iPad. There was a comment about time stretching audio above to make it fit into a loop slot. The change to the audio is not very noticeable (if at all) if the time stretching is minimal. Taking something from 110BPM to 120BPM doesn’t hurt my ear when it’s in a mix. But often what’s required is far less. I’ll gladly defend the iPad workflow [smile]. And there’s nothing to keep you from using audio you’ve created in iOS in a hardware mix, so I feel it’s the best of both worlds.
You bust out all your gear on the table. Your friend introduces you to some friends of his visiting. You mention that you are not a performer, you mainly just tinker for hours on repetitive loops until you get something right.
There are a number of key elements in Beatmaker 3 that are missing, but would seem easy to implement. I wish the developers could find a way to tap into what someone needs in a workflow in order to move fast enough not to bore the audience. I would like to see Beatmaker Live, in whatever way that entails to just get over the stoke-breaking details that gum up the experience for everyone involved.
gonna have to happen on an alternative platform, cause right now iOS is moving towards emulating the desktop experience more and more each day.
I definitely get what you are saying. Over the last while I have seen so many different BM3 workflows from people though that I think it would be hard to come up with a solution to satisfy the range of cases. Maybe there are some high level navigation aspects that could benefit all. It sounds like 3.1was targeting some significant GUI workflow aspects so hmm, yah maybe, maybe.
These developers do have brillant minds!
I do have faith these issues wiil become a thing of the past, like awaiting a disk to load in a commadore 64.
I'm thinking that no matter what BM3 (3.1) brings, i'll be using some hyrbrid approach to my silly musical experiments. I cannot see, at least at this point, trying to do it ALL in an iPad. Maybe someday, but not now.
When my PC went down had FL Studio etc. on it. I did get a new PC but I was uninspired so I decided instead to try music creation on my new IPAD Air 1 running IOS 7.0. I got Caustic, Nanostudio, Music Studio, Auria, Sunvox, Gadget, etc. It was new exciting I remember not knowing what I was doing, Then I discovered the demo videos by DJ Franz K, and some others, Doug of the soundtestroom, and Jacob Haq. There was NO Ableton Link, No AUV3, just IAA and the Auria standard and Audiobus. Those were frustrating times with no way to sync apps together. The standalone was more appealing to me at that time. When KORG dropped Gadget that was game changing. I was creating music in Gadget and polishing it in Auria which is still a effective work flow. Then came Ableton link IOS musicians were finally able to sync apps together like we do on desktop. Now with AUV3 I find myself using Gadget less and less. Cubasis is good with midi files and AUV3, Gadget is not. I saw previous comments expressing frustration of using the AUV3 as opposed to Gadget. I find AUV3 liberating. Imagine Gadget with working MIDI import, AUV3 support, and a killer .wav sampler, sample editor like Beatmaker 3.