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Mononoke : Expressive Drone Synthesizer

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Comments

  • audiblevideoaudiblevideo

    Tip:
    Blend Mononoke with MangleVerb

    Off the the App Store to rate 5stars

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User]

    @brambos said:
    I’m also discovering that the pads are really nice with Spacecraft. I think I’m slowly becoming an MPE convert myself ;)

    Ah...now you’re talking.

  • wimwim
    edited January 2020

    @YourJunk said:

    @brambos said:
    I'm adding "Mononoke Pads" to the next update: a separate AU MIDI controller plugin for playing other MPE synths with Mononoke's pads (basically Mononoke in MPE mode, with its synth engine removed):

    Would it be possible to drive Mononoke and Tardigrain at the same time using the Mononoke pads?

    I don’t see why that would be any problem. You can route one midi source to any number of destinations. You would just send the Mononoke pads to a Mononoke instance and in parallel to a Tardigrain instance.

  • brambosbrambos

    @wim said:

    @YourJunk said:

    @brambos said:
    I'm adding "Mononoke Pads" to the next update: a separate AU MIDI controller plugin for playing other MPE synths with Mononoke's pads (basically Mononoke in MPE mode, with its synth engine removed):

    Would it be possible to drive Mononoke and Tardigrain at the same time using the Mononoke pads?

    I don’t see why that would be any problem. You can route one midi source to any number of destinations. You would just send the Mononoke pads to a Mononoke instance and in parallel to a Tardigrain instance.

    Mononoke’s key mapping throws a spanner here: the note you’re trying to play isn’t necessarily mapped to the same key (most likely not, in fact).

    So yes, it will respond, but not in any predictable way ;)

  • bleepbleep

    @david_2017 said:

    @brambos said:
    I’m also discovering that the pads are really nice with Spacecraft. I think I’m slowly becoming an MPE convert myself ;)

    Whispering: mononoke is actually wetting my feet in regards of MPE. Never saw any thing desirable in it. Yeah, that slowly changes ;)

    Using MPE pads to drive Continua is also a very satisfying experience, after having mapped the knobs you'd like to modulate.

  • reasOnereasOne

    great stuff happening here!

  • wimwim
    edited January 2020

    @brambos said:
    I’m also discovering that the pads are really nice with Spacecraft. I think I’m slowly becoming an MPE convert myself ;)

    Aren’t you glad there are developers such as @brambos around to help open your mind to new things?

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User]

    Ok
    Update 1.1

    Loooove Mononoke

  • richardyotrichardyot

    @brambos said:
    Mononoke’s key mapping throws a spanner here: the note you’re trying to play isn’t necessarily mapped to the same key (most likely not, in fact).

    So yes, it will respond, but not in any predictable way ;)

    Can't it simply output the note that is mapped the pad that is being played?

    If a pad is mapped to A# for example, and Mononoke is set to output MIDI, surely playing that pad would mean that A# is the note that is sent to the other synth? If not, it would seem a bit strange and I don't think I would understand the purpose of having MIDI out at all...

  • brambosbrambos
    edited January 2020

    @richardyot said:

    @brambos said:
    Mononoke’s key mapping throws a spanner here: the note you’re trying to play isn’t necessarily mapped to the same key (most likely not, in fact).

    So yes, it will respond, but not in any predictable way ;)

    Can't it simply output the note that is mapped the pad that is being played?

    If a pad is mapped to A# for example, and Mononoke is set to output MIDI, surely playing that pad would mean that A# is the note that is sent to the other synth? If not, it would seem a bit strange and I don't think I would understand the purpose of having MIDI out at all...

    Mononoke Pads is a separate (different) MIDI plugin, which uses a different - conventional - mapping of keys. But since this mapping is different you can't use it to drive Mononoke itself, only normal MPE synths.

    The purpose of having MIDI out from Mononoke itself is mainly so you can record your performance from within Mononoke to a MIDI sequencer and be able to play it back exactly as you recorded it. This requires the mapping of outgoing/incoming MIDI notes to always be the same, regardless of how they are tuned.

    Obviously, if there was another way I wouldn't have done it this way, but for Mononoke to be recordable and replayable the mapping has to be 100% reliably consistent :)

    For example: nothing stops you from tuning all internal pads to the same note. So when you would play this note on an external keyboard, how would Mononoke know which voice you wanted to play? Or how about when you use free (unquantized) tuning?

    So yah, to understand the concept of Mononoke is to unlearn the concept of a piano. B)

  • richardyotrichardyot

    @brambos said:

    @richardyot said:

    @brambos said:
    Mononoke’s key mapping throws a spanner here: the note you’re trying to play isn’t necessarily mapped to the same key (most likely not, in fact).

    So yes, it will respond, but not in any predictable way ;)

    Can't it simply output the note that is mapped the pad that is being played?

    If a pad is mapped to A# for example, and Mononoke is set to output MIDI, surely playing that pad would mean that A# is the note that is sent to the other synth? If not, it would seem a bit strange and I don't think I would understand the purpose of having MIDI out at all...

    We're talking about a separate (different) MIDI plugin here, which uses a different - conventional - mapping of keys. But since this mapping is different you can't use it to drive Mononoke itself, only normal MPE synths.

    The purpose of having MIDI out from Mononoke itself is mainly so you can record your performance from within Mononoke to a MIDI sequencer and be able to play it back exactly as you recorded it. This requires the outgoing/incoming MIDI notes to always be the same.

    Obviously, if there was another way I wouldn't have done it this way, but for Mononoke to be recordable and replayable the mapping has to be 100% reliably consistent :)

    For example: nothing stops you from tuning all internal pads to the same note. So when you would play this note on an external keyboard, how would Mononoke know which voice you wanted to play? Or how about when you use free (unquantized) tuning?

    So yah, to understand the concept of Mononoke is to unlearn the concept of a piano. B)

    Understood, and thanks for the clarification.

    So basically it's best to use the built-in pads with Mononoke, because driving it from an external keyboard is going to be unpredictable. In fact I'm not actually sure how to map an external controller to Mononoke, is such a thing even possible?

  • brambosbrambos
    edited January 2020

    @richardyot said:

    @brambos said:

    @richardyot said:

    @brambos said:
    Mononoke’s key mapping throws a spanner here: the note you’re trying to play isn’t necessarily mapped to the same key (most likely not, in fact).

    So yes, it will respond, but not in any predictable way ;)

    Can't it simply output the note that is mapped the pad that is being played?

    If a pad is mapped to A# for example, and Mononoke is set to output MIDI, surely playing that pad would mean that A# is the note that is sent to the other synth? If not, it would seem a bit strange and I don't think I would understand the purpose of having MIDI out at all...

    We're talking about a separate (different) MIDI plugin here, which uses a different - conventional - mapping of keys. But since this mapping is different you can't use it to drive Mononoke itself, only normal MPE synths.

    The purpose of having MIDI out from Mononoke itself is mainly so you can record your performance from within Mononoke to a MIDI sequencer and be able to play it back exactly as you recorded it. This requires the outgoing/incoming MIDI notes to always be the same.

    Obviously, if there was another way I wouldn't have done it this way, but for Mononoke to be recordable and replayable the mapping has to be 100% reliably consistent :)

    For example: nothing stops you from tuning all internal pads to the same note. So when you would play this note on an external keyboard, how would Mononoke know which voice you wanted to play? Or how about when you use free (unquantized) tuning?

    So yah, to understand the concept of Mononoke is to unlearn the concept of a piano. B)

    Understood, and thanks for the clarification.

    So basically it's best to use the built-in pads with Mononoke, because driving it from an external keyboard is going to be unpredictable. In fact I'm not actually sure how to map an external controller to Mononoke, is such a thing even possible?

    It is possible, in fact it is easy because each key on a keyboard is always mapped to the same voice in Mononoke (regardless of what note that voice is tuned to internally).

    For example, the default trigger layout on a Lightpad Block will consistently map to the following Mononoke channels:

    5  6  7  8
1  2  3  4 
5  6  7  8
1  2  3  4

    Or to put it another way: you need to think of your external keyboard's keys as triggers, rather than notes.

  • reasOnereasOne

    this auto tune / note display update is perfect!! props bram!!

  • _ki_ki
    edited January 2020

    Edit: My answer came a bit late, Brambos already answered....

    @richardyot I also had to think about what the problem may be that Bram mentioned, but now its clear:

    • The Mononoke Pads send out the note they are configured to. So a synth receiving the midi will for instance play C3 for pad 1, if configured that way.

    • But Mononoke (the sound module) reads specific notes for its pads, each pad is mapped to every 8 notes in the whole note range. For example pad 1 is mapped to the input notes 52,60,68 etc. Midi input triggers pad ids and not notes. Which audible note for a pad is generated is specified by the tuning knob.

    • A C3 from Mononoke Pads first pad will trigger a C3 for a synth, and play pad five of a Mononoke sound module and therefore output the audible note configured for this pad.

  • brambosbrambos

    @_ki said:
    @richardyot I also had to think about what the problem may be that Bram mentioned, but now its clear:

    • The Mononoke Pads send out the note they are configured to. So a synth receiving the midi will for instance play C3 for pad 1, if configured that way.

    • But Mononoke (the sound module) reads specific notes for its pads, each pad is mapped to every 8 notes in the whole note range. For example pad 1 is mapped to the input notes 52,60,68 etc. Midi input triggers pad ids and not notes. Which audible note for a pad is generated is specified by the tuning knob.

    • A C3 from Mononoke Pads first pad will trigger a C3 for a synth, and play pad five of a Mononoke sound module and therefore output the audible note configured for this pad.

    ^

    Exactly this :)

  • _ki_ki

    @brambos You could add a ‚Monoke‘ tuning to Monoke pads autofill dialog, configured to play the corresponding pads of the sound module. But this wouldn‘t react to the root note in that dialog, making it different from the other tunings.

  • KrupaKrupa

    @_ki said:
    Edit: My answer came a bit late, Brambos already answered....

    @richardyot I also had to think about what the problem may be that Bram mentioned, but now its clear:

    • The Mononoke Pads send out the note they are configured to. So a synth receiving the midi will for instance play C3 for pad 1, if configured that way.

    • But Mononoke (the sound module) reads specific notes for its pads, each pad is mapped to every 8 notes in the whole note range. For example pad 1 is mapped to the input notes 52,60,68 etc. Midi input triggers pad ids and not notes. Which audible note for a pad is generated is specified by the tuning knob.

    • A C3 from Mononoke Pads first pad will trigger a C3 for a synth, and play pad five of a Mononoke sound module and therefore output the audible note configured for this pad.

    This all makes sense to me, apart from the last bit - why would the first pad of the midi pads trigger the fifth pad of the module?

  • brambosbrambos

    @Krupa said:

    @_ki said:
    Edit: My answer came a bit late, Brambos already answered....

    @richardyot I also had to think about what the problem may be that Bram mentioned, but now its clear:

    • The Mononoke Pads send out the note they are configured to. So a synth receiving the midi will for instance play C3 for pad 1, if configured that way.

    • But Mononoke (the sound module) reads specific notes for its pads, each pad is mapped to every 8 notes in the whole note range. For example pad 1 is mapped to the input notes 52,60,68 etc. Midi input triggers pad ids and not notes. Which audible note for a pad is generated is specified by the tuning knob.

    • A C3 from Mononoke Pads first pad will trigger a C3 for a synth, and play pad five of a Mononoke sound module and therefore output the audible note configured for this pad.

    This all makes sense to me, apart from the last bit - why would the first pad of the midi pads trigger the fifth pad of the module?

    It all depends on how you tune "Mononoke Pads". A C3 will always trigger the fifth pad of Mononoke synth, a D3 will always trigger the seventh pad of Mononoke synth etc.

    Each MIDI key is always linked to a voice in the Mononoke synth, not to a note (because a voice can be any note or free tuning in the synth).

    MIDI note       Mononoke voice
52                    1
53                    2
54                    3
55                    4
56                    5
57                    6
58                    7
59                    8
60                    1
61                    2
etc.

    If it helps, think of them like drum-triggers, not note triggers. Drum triggers also don't care to what frequency a drum sound was tuned, each trigger is always mapped to the same drum voice.

  • SashaPonkratovSashaPonkratov

    @brambos, thanks for adding the ability to tune the knobs to a selected scale!

    Can you explain which notes are selected?
    I don’t understand why there is no minor third in minor.
    For example, C Minor (Natural) gives me C, D, F, G, Bb, C, D, F.
    Where is Eb? =)
    It looks like Bb Major Pentatonic for me.

  • brambosbrambos
    edited January 2020

    @SashaPonkratov said:
    @brambos, thanks for adding the ability to tune the knobs to a selected scale!

    Can you explain which notes are selected?
    I don’t understand why there is no minor third in minor.
    For example, C Minor (Natural) gives me C, D, F, G, Bb, C, D, F.
    Where is Eb? =)
    It looks like Bb Major Pentatonic for me.

    Each subsequent pad is tuned at least 2 semitones higher than the last. This turned out to give more musically interesting results when using voices together (because it creates chords).

    Ofcourse nothing stops you from tuning one of the pads to Eb if you need that one in particular ;)

  • KrupaKrupa

    @brambos said:

    @Krupa said:

    @_ki said:
    Edit: My answer came a bit late, Brambos already answered....

    @richardyot I also had to think about what the problem may be that Bram mentioned, but now its clear:

    • The Mononoke Pads send out the note they are configured to. So a synth receiving the midi will for instance play C3 for pad 1, if configured that way.

    • But Mononoke (the sound module) reads specific notes for its pads, each pad is mapped to every 8 notes in the whole note range. For example pad 1 is mapped to the input notes 52,60,68 etc. Midi input triggers pad ids and not notes. Which audible note for a pad is generated is specified by the tuning knob.

    • A C3 from Mononoke Pads first pad will trigger a C3 for a synth, and play pad five of a Mononoke sound module and therefore output the audible note configured for this pad.

    This all makes sense to me, apart from the last bit - why would the first pad of the midi pads trigger the fifth pad of the module?

    It all depends on how you tune "Mononoke Pads". A C3 will always trigger the fifth pad of Mononoke synth, a D3 will always trigger the seventh pad of Mononoke synth etc.

    Each MIDI key is always linked to a voice in the Mononoke synth, not to a note (because a voice can be any note or free tuning in the synth).

    MIDI note       Mononoke voice
52                    1
53                    2
54                    3
55                    4
56                    5
57                    6
58                    7
59                    8
60                    1
61                    2
etc.

    If it helps, think of them like drum-triggers, not note triggers. Drum triggers also don't care to what frequency a drum sound was tuned, each trigger is always mapped to the same drum voice.

    Ah, cool, get it now, ta 👍

  • SashaPonkratovSashaPonkratov

    @brambos said:

    @SashaPonkratov said:
    @brambos, thanks for adding the ability to tune the knobs to a selected scale!

    Can you explain which notes are selected?
    I don’t understand why there is no minor third in minor.
    For example, C Minor (Natural) gives me C, D, F, G, Bb, C, D, F.
    Where is Eb? =)
    It looks like Bb Major Pentatonic for me.

    Each subsequent pad is tuned at least 2 semitones higher than the last. This turned out to give more musically interesting results when using voices together (because it creates chords).

    Ofcourse nothing stops you from tuning one of the pads to Eb if you need that one in particular ;)

    Third scale degree is the most important, as it defines is it major or minor scale.
    I think C Minor must include Eb (minor 3rd), as well as C (root), G (fifth).
    Nothing stops me from tuning, but this is what I expect from "Minor" preset.
    It would be weird to select C Major and get C, D, F, A =)

  • cuscolimacuscolima

    Mononoke Pads + SpaceCraft = ❤️❤️

  • david_2017david_2017

    @cuscolima said:
    Mononoke Pads + SpaceCraft = ❤️❤️

    Absolutely amazing!!! @brambos thanks man!!! Wonderful!

  • ChancedMusicChancedMusic

    New update is bombdiggitty.

  • brambosbrambos

    Good to hear you appreciate the update!

  • ChancedMusicChancedMusic

    Another Bram jam

  • Tim6502Tim6502

    Mononoke pads are an absolutely amazing bonus - thanks, Bram!

    Beware - MPE will keep you hooked seeking out and acquiring ever more synths...

  • reasOnereasOne

    @Tim6502 said:
    Mononoke pads are an absolutely amazing bonus - thanks, Bram!

    Beware - MPE will keep you hooked seeking out and acquiring ever more synths...

    best bonus ever!
    now we just need these hosts to let us record the data lol

  • ohwellohwell
    edited January 2020

    @Tim6502 said:

    Beware - MPE will keep you hooked seeking out and acquiring ever more synths...

    !!!

    Unless Bram gets hooked enough to MPE up Phasemaker? 🤔 🤓

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