Loopy Pro: Create music, your way.
What is Loopy Pro? — Loopy Pro is a powerful, flexible, and intuitive live looper, sampler, clip launcher and DAW for iPhone and iPad. At its core, it allows you to record and layer sounds in real-time to create complex musical arrangements. But it doesn’t stop there—Loopy Pro offers advanced tools to customize your workflow, build dynamic performance setups, and create a seamless connection between instruments, effects, and external gear.
Use it for live looping, sequencing, arranging, mixing, and much more. Whether you're a live performer, a producer, or just experimenting with sound, Loopy Pro helps you take control of your creative process.
Download on the App StoreLoopy Pro is your all-in-one musical toolkit. Try it for free today.
Comments
I’ll add why I don’t like the subscription model.
I want control over when I spend my money. If I buy an app with a one-off payment through the App Store, then I have control. A subscription would give a seller control over when to take money from me, and that’s not something I want to deal with.
I have subscribed to things in the past and forgotten about them when I no longer need them, and that feels like I have wasted my money.
In a couple of cases the process to end a subscription failed, and I ended up with money being taken from my account when I did not want the product. Was it easy to get a refund? Was it hell - I had to fight tooth and nail to get money back when I specifically requested that it not be taken from my account.
No subscriptions for me thank you.
To be fair, with Apple it's very straightforward to manage subscriptions. And, they get taken out on a periodic basis at a frequency that you choose, not Apple, and not any developer. You can cancel at any time, no hassle, no questions asked. You're dealing with a single supplier, not a bunch of wild-west developers.
You also get a email notification every time you're charged. (Which is paradoxically one of the reasons I do not want subscriptions ... I don't want to be constantly reminded how much I'm spending.)
What do others think?
This, so much this. Proper testing by the dev before the release, and a chance for would-be customers to try the product for free (the two can be related to an extent via public betas), are currently far from being universal - but that's sort of expected, or at least accepted, at the current peanut prices we pay. But the moment apps start routinely costing much more people will expect these things much more, too.
Edit: ...and manuals, too.
I got a Duet Display annual subscription. Last December I subscribed to it for 25$ cad and then immediately unsubscribed from it. I will still be able to run it until December when it runs out. I used it a bunch at the beginning but not so much lately. In a sense I feel I got my 25$ worth out of it already because the project was worth it. Will I resubscribe? Mmm, probably not unless something comes up again where I need it.
If this were BM3 or NS2 I would have had no problem with an annual subscription to them (still would have unsubscribed right away just to keep the subscribe list clean) and probably would resubscribe this coming December.
The whole annual subscription thing is totally fine by me.
Yeah I think bundles are the solution there. The annoying thing with bundles is that they only work while all apps in them are available for sale, so old versions would need to stay in the store or upgrade pricing goes away. But it’s better than nothing. I’ll probably just have a time-limited upgrade path, to avoid having to have multiple versions of the same app there indefinitely.
That’s a great idea! It would mean making the app a free download with either a one-off IAP to buy it, or a subscription, with some internal logic to track how long the subscription has been running, which is probably possible.
Having a free download + one’s own logic to handle the dual one-off/subscription schemes would also probably facilitate more flexible upgrade schemes - if the app detects an older version installed it can then offer a discount, no bundles required.
I totally agree with this mindset, and the tip jar is a great idea! Like on YouTube live I think it is where you can buy them a coffee or give them small donations.
I feel subscriptions are a bit parasitic, something that just keeps on sucking away money. And yes think most of us have well over 50 music apps, if they all went the subscription route we would be sucked dry. I like to have control over what I spend and I am a spontaneous purchaser, but when im in a purchasing mood, im well aware that I won't see that money again. Its just to hard to manage subscriptions on things that you don't know how much actually use you will get out of it. If it something to do with your job then you know that you use the software every day then you can claim the subscription cost on tax, that's all good but I would say 99 percent of us use iOS app for fun and don't ever see any revenue from the use of said apps
If all my apps were on subscriptions I think I’d serriously keep about 3 and it would definately stop me being an appaholic.
Cool! Great thread, some really good ideas.
I’m in agreement that subscriptions as they stand are not great. I think Loopy Pro will either be:
I prefer option 2 as it offers some more flexibility and much easier upgrade path I think (no time limits, can skip an entire version and still get a discount).
👍 It looks like Family Sharing is an option that developers can enable for both subscriptions and IAPs, although it seems that most don’t. What are your thoughts on enabling this?
I figured it’d just be on by default – but if not, I’d definitely turn it on
Option 1 seems way simpler to me but I’ll support your efforts either way.
Most definitely. 2 is a lot more work, but it has lots of advantages
I would agree. Option one looks clean and straightforward.
I skipped the thread but did want to say that the reality is your steady base is a bunch of hobbyists who stumbled upon a cheap route of obtaining tools, some of the best of which are either straight desktop quality ports or reasonably competitive desktop alternatives, that make them feel like more of an accomplished musician or creator than they actually are. I don’t say that as a bad thing, like it sounds, because maybe that feeling inspires them to reach new levels of proficiency, and that’s GREAT for anyone in the world who plays music no matter the ambition level.
But even the majority if this loyal base would fizzle out if they had to choose carefully between their tools instead of being able to smash “buy” with no regrets on a release, and sometimes multiple times a week, based not on need but simple obtainability.
The question is striking the best economic (re: sales $$$) balance between price and and quantity—cater to a much smaller, more diehard niche who will surely continue to buy, but surely feel even more entitled to requests, complaints, and excess feedback based upon their own vision for the app (or worse, based upon the disease of needing “more” just to have it), or keep things relatively stable, sell your work for far less than it’s true worth but at more copies, and hope that comes out ahead of the “premium” pricing strategy, all while receiving far less pressure and pushback from users as they get continued access to a cheap pipeline.
I don’t really think there’s an answer, only
more of a developer preference. The reality is it’s a raw deal for developers either way.
Also, in my opinion, subscriptions for single apps or PC programs are awful, because almost everyone is already subscribed to a Spotify, and a Netflix, and a YouTube, and God knows how many other services, and it’s always a bad feeling to get that monthly bill and see just how much you’re spending on what is ultimately disposable media. Paid upgrades are far and away the way to go over subscriptions as far as keeping users happy (assuming we don’t have to pay for bugfix releases, obviously). Especially on the cheapskates ‘r’ us iOS market. A subscription to a DAW or some similar more complete music environment I can totally understand and get behind, but not for a singularly- focused app.
Clean ish. The downside is that upgrade pricing is only going to be available for a very short time, as I’m not comfortable having old versions of the app floating around indefinitely. So people who want the cheap upgrade pricing for the next major version will have to purchase within a month or two after it’s released otherwise they’ll miss out. And if they skip a version, they’ll have to pay full price next time they upgrade.
I’m also very in favour of the idea of having a free download and trial, and especially enamoured with the idea of having a subscription option (rent-to-own after 12m), for those who don’t want to fork out the full amount upfront. I think it will be a lot more inclusive.
Wait!... so option 2 is actually option1? 😃
I think both are reasonable really. I would be happy with either.
Thinking about it - the free download and trial has got to be a good thing. I think everyone would agree on that.
During all this I was off for a play around on Launchpad and I noticed it’s a cool £7.99 a month!!... 😙
Well said
So, hmmmmm. I think I’m missing something. Let’s say I purchase v1 either as an IAP or as twelve payments. But then I’m happy with the app as it is and don’t opt to upgrade to V2. That means that I can’t go on using v1? Or just that you won’t support it when Apple does something dumb with iOS (that’ll never happen, right?) or something else breaks?
Yeah, the second option is identical to the first one in that respect – I’ll still be releasing the next major update as a separate app
The App Store is probably an example of how it works well, but I still don’t like the idea. It would annoy me to think I had paid for a month and not used it in that time, but a one-off payment and I own it wouldn’t bring that to mind.
I think option 2 sounds interesting, and I definitely support the inclusiveness aspects / a free trial period (or even a free version with just a limited number of allowed loops). I think things like that will help it reach more people, more easily. However, getting the interface right for doing these things in-app and communicating exactly what the different options mean, might be tricky. Definitely would be super annoying to have to set up an email account, for example. Would it be possible to automatically get that information (payment info + user account details like email) directly from apple? I suppose it would be automatic if simply it is an IAP. Can IAP be recurring subscription payments too? Also maybe specifically billing as "rent-to-own" or similar rather than using the word subscription might be wise.
Also worth considering whether this approach would be applicable to other future platforms for loopy pro, (like Desktop or running as a VST version?).
Duet works without that subscription for some things. Of course, if you only need it for a month or two you can just do it monthly. I personally avoided paying for Duet Display by getting a Luna Display adapter to send the video from my older Mac to my iPad. Had I just paid for a month or two of Duet, I would have realized I don’t need wireless control of my Mac and probably ultimately would have saved money. I got the adapter on sale for 50USD though. It might come in handy some day.
My problem with subscriptions is that I often don’t use things enough to make it worth it. So, sure I probably wouldn’t mind a subscription for my favorite apps that I use and need a lot might be helpful to keep content and updates coming. I have so many apps that I don’t often use. What makes one app something you use a lot and another app something you don’t use much at all is different for everyone. So, having a subscription for all these things just will not be worth it for some folks.
Also as a few others have mentioned, including a tip jar I think is a cool idea. Because there will be a reasonable amount of superfans who want to pay you more from time to time (probably including me), and i think there is something to the psychology of it. In other cases, when I've given money voluntarily it builds a sense of shared responsibility and ownership for the thing I'm donating to.
Great to hear, thank you!
Another interesting pricing model that I haven’t seen elsewhere is how the app Working Copy does it.
https://workingcopyapp.com/manual/purchase
It’s a free app with a one-time purchase that unlocks all current pro features, plus any additional pro features released within the next 12 months. Any new features added after that require another one-time unlock purchase.
It doesn’t seem like an ideal fit for Loopy Pro, but I thought I’d throw it out there for completeness or inspiration.
Interesting…
Duet was job related so a somewhat slightly different criteria than normally at play for me at the time etc. But yah I was desperate, needed the touch.
But as for music apps I would be fine subbing to things that I hope/expect major features to come, which is why I mentioned NS2 and BM3, both of which had various plans / roadmaps to support. They actually are the only two apps where I ever expected things, largely because they stated things were coming or rushed and needed further work. If they did have subscriptions from ground zero and that helped to manifest those plans (earlier or ever etc) then it totally would have been worth it. For a compressor or reverb, nah. But jeez, if we lived in a world where Blip and Intua could have been living off of subscription money while developing their apps full-time the last few years…? Fucking hell those likely would have quickly become insanely awesome apps that completely elevated this entire platform.
That sounds great!
Have you thought about accepting 1st born children?
Or 1000 dogecoins?
Im down with 1500 dogecoins, but i also want an NFT outta it
In all seriousness, i dont envy you position. The app store prices really did take a chunk out of developers value.
If the app does what I want, I dont mind paying big. I dont even mind paying a subscription. I start and cancel subscriptions on a monthly basis.
For example, ill spend 8$ Every few months for remixlive when i need it, but im not gonna continually pay when the only benefit is a new soundpack a month and it still doesnt have midi or real controller support.
But yeah, you have that other population that freaks out at anything over 4.99
There was one other app i saw, cant remeber the name, and it might be mentioned on the forums somewhere, their business model was app is free but you pay per save/export. Like 100 saves for 4.99. Fuck that model.
Off the top of my head... Piano Motifs, Rozetta, Blocs Wave, Aphelian, AUM, Beathawk, Turnado, SpaceCraft Granular Synth, Samplr, Riffer, Pure Acid, Oscilab, iKaossilator, Hammerhead, Gadget, Fieldscaper, Elastic Drums, Borderlands Granular, and something called Audiobus.
Not to mention the million or so apps that 4Pockets make :-)