Which iOS daw will be still here in 3 years ?

DMfan

Roland Zenbeats for sure will be one.

It is not the fenced software like it seems, is in fact a traditional DAW having both timeline and loop views, audio tracks, sampling and is backed by a large company with a music legacy of its own.

And there is more to come. The development team is very active.

/DMfan🇸🇪

HotStrange

@BerlinFx said:

@HotStrange said:

@BerlinFx said:

@HotStrange said:
I think most of them will be around to come extent. Some of the really small ones may go away or as some have said, get maintenance only updates. But I don’t see the big ones going anywhere. If anything Steinberg my finally grow some balls and port Cubase now. I still wouldn’t use it over Logic but I know a lot of people like Cubase. BM3 is too powerful and unique to go away, imo. And AUM, Loopy Pro, etc will stick around because of the different workflow.

NS2 I’m not sure. With no audio tracks and the amount of choice now, I feel like it’s getting less and less interesting.

For BM3 , is it still Intua who care about ? I hope for thé guys loving it that they will do at least updates maintenance and bugs fixes . Last update was 2 years ago , latest version is 3.0.15 this is why I ask if someone have more infos about it .

I hope they do because I know quite a handful of people love it. I really enjoy it as well I just don’t use it often. For a sampler with pads I gravitate towards Beathawk and Pulse first.

It seems that NI doesn’t care too about Imashine seems even be deleted of the AppStore not very cool and Akai about doesn’t care too much about MPC 2 even if they are happy to sell IAP sounds ?

I didn’t even realize NI deleted their app, I never tried. I don’t have MPC either though I believe it’s developed by Retrokits now (AudioCopy devs) and not Akai. I have almost every other groovebox on iOS so I don’t really need it Vatanator Pro can do everything MPC2 can and it gets updated every 2-4 months so far.

HotStrange

@DMfan said:
Roland Zenbeats for sure will be one.

It is not the fenced software like it seems, is in fact a traditional DAW having both timeline and loop views, audio tracks, sampling and is backed by a large company with a music legacy of its own.

And there is more to come. The development team is very active.

/DMfan🇸🇪

I ended up liking it way more than I thought I would. If I click with Logic like I think I will it’s gonna be hard to leave these all behind but I doubt I would ever come back to them.

DMfan

@HotStrange said:

@DMfan said:
Roland Zenbeats for sure will be one.

It is not the fenced software like it seems, is in fact a traditional DAW having both timeline and loop views, audio tracks, sampling and is backed by a large company with a music legacy of its own.

And there is more to come. The development team is very active.

/DMfan🇸🇪

I ended up liking it way more than I thought I would. If I click with Logic like I think I will it’s gonna be hard to leave these all behind but I doubt I would ever come back to them.

That’s nice to hear about Zenbeats, and you are not alone. Even though Logic is one of the top DAWs and really good, may I hope you don’t click with it and stay with us Zenbeaters?😁

/DMfan🇸🇪

HotStrange

@DMfan said:

@HotStrange said:

@DMfan said:
Roland Zenbeats for sure will be one.

It is not the fenced software like it seems, is in fact a traditional DAW having both timeline and loop views, audio tracks, sampling and is backed by a large company with a music legacy of its own.

And there is more to come. The development team is very active.

/DMfan🇸🇪

I ended up liking it way more than I thought I would. If I click with Logic like I think I will it’s gonna be hard to leave these all behind but I doubt I would ever come back to them.

That’s nice to hear about Zenbeats, and you are not alone. Even though Logic is one of the top DAWs and really good, may I hope you don’t click with it and stay with us Zenbeaters?😁

/DMfan🇸🇪

Haha I’ve already used it on desktop years ago and liked it and I love GarageBand for all its faults, so I think I will. That said, who knows, I may keep Zenbeats around to open up occasionally for something different. Or I may end up hating logic. Time will tell 😆

ZooBaaDoo

My tuppence on this is the DAW that is developed by people who actually use it to make tracks and release music and therefore are constantly fixing issues the real issues. I haven’t really come across any DAW on my iPad that doesn’t have some strange anomalies. The most stable for me is Gadget but it’s not my way of working. Listen developers we want things to work especially after you update them. I understand the occasional bump in the road but for example Cubasis still not being able to delete part of a track consistently without freezing and GarageBand optimising performance on a 9 track song with barely any effects on a 2018 iPad Pro… REALLY? If Logic turns out like this then 😩.

dendy

@ZooBaaDoo
I haven’t really come across any DAW on my iPad that doesn’t have some strange anomalies.

But even musicians have different approaches and different “mandatory” features they expect “perfect” daw should have ..

Hope i correctly understand that with “anomaly” you mean “missing feature” :-)

[Deleted User]

@HotStrange said:

@BerlinFx said:

@HotStrange said:
I think most of them will be around to come extent. Some of the really small ones may go away or as some have said, get maintenance only updates. But I don’t see the big ones going anywhere. If anything Steinberg my finally grow some balls and port Cubase now. I still wouldn’t use it over Logic but I know a lot of people like Cubase. BM3 is too powerful and unique to go away, imo. And AUM, Loopy Pro, etc will stick around because of the different workflow.

NS2 I’m not sure. With no audio tracks and the amount of choice now, I feel like it’s getting less and less interesting.

For BM3 , is it still Intua who care about ? I hope for thé guys loving it that they will do at least updates maintenance and bugs fixes . Last update was 2 years ago , latest version is 3.0.15 this is why I ask if someone have more infos about it .

I hope they do because I know quite a handful of people love it. I really enjoy it as well I just don’t use it often. For a sampler with pads I gravitate towards Beathawk and Pulse first.

Me as well. I think it’s the most versatile, feature packed and fun to work in. Intua will hopefully update like n track and aem

ZooBaaDoo

@dendy said:

@ZooBaaDoo
I haven’t really come across any DAW on my iPad that doesn’t have some strange anomalies.

But even musicians have different approaches and different “mandatory” features they expect “perfect” daw should have ..

Hope i correctly understand that with “anomaly” you mean “missing feature” :-)

In this context I really meant niggling faults that interrupt the flow. Might as well have just said that as anomalies is probably incorrect 😂

[Deleted User]

@dendy said:

@ZooBaaDoo
I haven’t really come across any DAW on my iPad that doesn’t have some strange anomalies.

But even musicians have different approaches and different “mandatory” features they expect “perfect” daw should have ..

Hope i correctly understand that with “anomaly” you mean “missing feature” :-)

All daws have their bugs particularly after updates , to discover some of them toy need really to go deep sometimes. All desktops daws can crash even the pro Daws like Logic. The big difference is how quick the team fix it up.

It is the normal life for all software from ages . Don’t think it is better with harwares , many go to repair just when you need them ready and you need to ship and wait your hardware to be fixed. That life and amateur and pro are in the same boat for that.

ZooBaaDoo

@BerlinFx said:

@dendy said:

@ZooBaaDoo
I haven’t really come across any DAW on my iPad that doesn’t have some strange anomalies.

But even musicians have different approaches and different “mandatory” features they expect “perfect” daw should have ..

Hope i correctly understand that with “anomaly” you mean “missing feature” :-)

All daws have their bugs particularly after updates , to discover some of them toy need really to go deep sometimes. All desktops daws can crash even the pro Daws like Logic. The big difference is how quick the team fix it up.

It is the normal life for all software from ages . Don’t think it is better with harwares , many go to repair just when you need them ready and you need to ship and wait your hardware to be fixed. That life and amateur and pro are in the same boat for that.

Not my personal experience. I had the Roland VS880. Still runs today never crashes. I have a Korg Triton. Good as new. I have Gadget. Never crashes always delivers. The iPad big name DAWS fall into the “could do a lot better” category they need to consistently work. I actually think the way of paying for Logic will work for me. If it doesn’t work I can dump it until it does. I’m not sure any of these DAW’s will outlive my VS880! If they do I won’t be here to see it 😩 (I’m old!).

craftycurate

Let’s keep this thread going for 3 years and find out

[Deleted User]

@craftycurate said:
Let’s keep this thread going for 3 years and find out

It was my idea to make a point from time to time to see what daws are still alive , which one will become pro and which pro Daw will be a newcomer.

Stay tuned is important particularly for Daws and I include Zenbeat , BM3 , Cubasis and so on.

2023 and 2024 at leat are daws year.

For other tools we had already LP pro, good FX , incredible synth some old becoming AUv3. Difficult to do better synth , affects that all we have yet.

[Deleted User]

@craftycurate said:
Let’s keep this thread going for 3 years and find out

That is funny. You could lock er up on that one! Haha

AudioGus

@dendy said:

@ZooBaaDoo
I haven’t really come across any DAW on my iPad that doesn’t have some strange anomalies.

But even musicians have different approaches and different “mandatory” features they expect “perfect” daw should have ..

Yah and there is no perfect. When I only knew/used one for many years I thought it was perfect, but now that I used a few there are things I miss from each of them.

PS. Glad I married the first woman I dated

espiegel123

@Gavinski said:

@wim said:

@Gavinski said:

@wim said:

@Gavinski said:

@espiegel123 said:

@Gavinski said:
Yeah, AUM and Loopy Pro are as far as I can see, the only ‘DAW’s we have on iOS that desktop users would also wish they had on desktop. Does anyone on desktop want Cubasis? Pretty much nope, I think. Do they want a NanoStudio 2 without audio tracks? I doubt it very much. Etc etc!

Loopy needs audio tracks ideally though, no? Was that not on the roadmap but has been removed? And AUM needs a proper automation system and hopefully also a ‘mixer sliders only’ view, as many people have been - rightly in my opinion - requesting for a while. But even without these, both Loopy Pro and AUM have a lot of unique features that should keep them relevant for years to come

What do you mean about Loopy Pro and audio tracks?

It has audio tracks. Currently, each clip gets sequenced on its own track in the sequencer. (Clip events on the timeline can be edits of the source clip). Also note that clips can be as long as you want. Loopy Pro standalone is actually pretty handy for recording audio tracks for NS2.

As far as I know, a more conventional track arrangement is still in the long-term plans. But other things will happen first.

This was actually a complaint someone else stated to me. I'll pass on your message to them, thnx

Maybe they were referring to Loopy HD?

No, this was their reply:

'Yes, Loopy Pro has audio that can be arranged using the in-built basic sequencer. But there is no way to properly edit that audio. Just the marker movement... If it did have fully editable audio tracks, in the manner of Auria Pro, then Loopy Pro could replace Auria/ Cubasis etc'

Essentially the person is claiming that 'more conventional audio tracks' was something that was on the Loopy Pro road map but was removed, so he fears it will not be added, in the same way as NS2 ended up never getting audio tracks. Anyway, this is not my battle, I don't even use Loopy Pro, but is he correct that audio tracks a la auria Pro etc was included on the road map but was indeed removed, or did he misunderstand something?

I gotta think your friend must be rather stoned. I've never heard anything like that and I've been on the beta team from the beginning. Extensive audio editing of that nature has never been a priority.

Loopy Pro is a looper with many DAW features. It's has never set out to be DAW with some looper features.

Fair enough, cheers Wim. He's an ex forum member so I have told him he can rejoin if he feels the need to discuss this in more detail lol, it's very much not my battle, thnx!

DAW-like audio tracks has always been part of the long term plan. They are on the roadmap marked as planned:

https://roadmap.loopypro.com/feature-requests/p/straight-audio-tracks-for-sequencer-like-a-traditional-daw

There are also planned features that are not on the Roadmap site.

Btw, clip events on the timeline can be edited (by playing with even boundaries ) in some useful ways.

Unlike the case with NS2, development has remained at full pace in the more than a year since Loopy Pro shipped. Your friend may have unrealistic ideas of how long an app like this takes for one person to develop.

AudioGus

@espiegel123 said:

@Gavinski said:

@wim said:

@Gavinski said:

@wim said:

@Gavinski said:

@espiegel123 said:

@Gavinski said:
Yeah, AUM and Loopy Pro are as far as I can see, the only ‘DAW’s we have on iOS that desktop users would also wish they had on desktop. Does anyone on desktop want Cubasis? Pretty much nope, I think. Do they want a NanoStudio 2 without audio tracks? I doubt it very much. Etc etc!

Loopy needs audio tracks ideally though, no? Was that not on the roadmap but has been removed? And AUM needs a proper automation system and hopefully also a ‘mixer sliders only’ view, as many people have been - rightly in my opinion - requesting for a while. But even without these, both Loopy Pro and AUM have a lot of unique features that should keep them relevant for years to come

What do you mean about Loopy Pro and audio tracks?

It has audio tracks. Currently, each clip gets sequenced on its own track in the sequencer. (Clip events on the timeline can be edits of the source clip). Also note that clips can be as long as you want. Loopy Pro standalone is actually pretty handy for recording audio tracks for NS2.

As far as I know, a more conventional track arrangement is still in the long-term plans. But other things will happen first.

This was actually a complaint someone else stated to me. I'll pass on your message to them, thnx

Maybe they were referring to Loopy HD?

No, this was their reply:

'Yes, Loopy Pro has audio that can be arranged using the in-built basic sequencer. But there is no way to properly edit that audio. Just the marker movement... If it did have fully editable audio tracks, in the manner of Auria Pro, then Loopy Pro could replace Auria/ Cubasis etc'

Essentially the person is claiming that 'more conventional audio tracks' was something that was on the Loopy Pro road map but was removed, so he fears it will not be added, in the same way as NS2 ended up never getting audio tracks. Anyway, this is not my battle, I don't even use Loopy Pro, but is he correct that audio tracks a la auria Pro etc was included on the road map but was indeed removed, or did he misunderstand something?

I gotta think your friend must be rather stoned. I've never heard anything like that and I've been on the beta team from the beginning. Extensive audio editing of that nature has never been a priority.

Loopy Pro is a looper with many DAW features. It's has never set out to be DAW with some looper features.

Fair enough, cheers Wim. He's an ex forum member so I have told him he can rejoin if he feels the need to discuss this in more detail lol, it's very much not my battle, thnx!

DAW-like audio tracks has always been part of the long term plan. They are on the roadmap marked as planned:

https://roadmap.loopypro.com/feature-requests/p/straight-audio-tracks-for-sequencer-like-a-traditional-daw

There are also planned features that are not on the Roadmap site.

Btw, clip events on the timeline can be edited (by playing with even boundaries ) in some useful ways.

Unlike the case with NS2, development has remained at full pace in the more than a year since Loopy Pro shipped. Your friend may have unrealistic ideas of how long an app like this takes for one person to develop.

Since day one I felt that Loopy will eventually snag me.

dendy

@espiegel123 said:

Unlike the case with NS2, development has remained at full pace in the more than a year since Loopy Pro shipped.

NS2 development has remained at full pace in more than 2 years since first version was shipped,

Just because you didn’t get your favourite feature it doesn’t mean Matt wasn’t working very hard post release to solve other things which were for him,in his vision of NS, top priority… That guy worked hard literally 10/7 for so long time that i was even afraid about his health so he deserves a bit more respect.

espiegel123

@dendy said:

@espiegel123 said:

Unlike the case with NS2, development has remained at full pace in the more than a year since Loopy Pro shipped.

Dunno about Loopsy but NS2 developemwnt has remained at full pace in more than 2 years since first version was shipped

I would not consider NS2’s development since release to have been at full pace. Since release. The appearance is that after the iPhone version , it has been in more of a maintenance mode—and the developer has said as much.

dendy

I would not consider NS2’s development since release to have been at full pace.

that’s your opinion but because you know really nothing about how hard was he working post release then maybe keep your opinion for yourself ..

[Deleted User]

@espiegel123 said:

@dendy said:

@espiegel123 said:

Unlike the case with NS2, development has remained at full pace in the more than a year since Loopy Pro shipped.

Dunno about Loopsy but NS2 developemwnt has remained at full pace in more than 2 years since first version was shipped

I would not consider NS2’s development since release to have been at full pace. Since release. The appearance is that after the iPhone version , it has been in more of a maintenance mode—and the developer has said as much.

@dendy said:

I would not consider NS2’s development since release to have been at full pace.

that’s your opinion but because you know really nothing about how hard was he working post release then maybe keep your opinion for yourself ..

I agree with you but is it still possible for a one man to upgrade faster a Daw as the actual competition go up on Daws and so user expectations ?

I think that it is now more the work of a small team of 2 or 3 dev than a one man project considering need to upgrade and improve more regularly than 1 years ago ? I respect the dev work but time have change and a daw is a far bigger project to rely on a one man, a synth or effect can be a one man project not anymore a Daw I think, thanks to Apple .

Littlewoodg

the exception to this is MTS, mentioned above by @MisplacedDevelopment.

until LPC it is the only direct port from desktop and a one man show since forever. Forever in this world at least.

a truly a formidable DAW still very much in development, continually adding major platform exclusive and/or must-have features prompted by users and the current state of the art. yes idiosyncratic, and not so pretty, but crazy stable, very light on the processor

espiegel123

@BerlinFx said:

@espiegel123 said:

@dendy said:

@espiegel123 said:

Unlike the case with NS2, development has remained at full pace in the more than a year since Loopy Pro shipped.

Dunno about Loopsy but NS2 developemwnt has remained at full pace in more than 2 years since first version was shipped

I would not consider NS2’s development since release to have been at full pace. Since release. The appearance is that after the iPhone version , it has been in more of a maintenance mode—and the developer has said as much.

@dendy said:

I would not consider NS2’s development since release to have been at full pace.

that’s your opinion but because you know really nothing about how hard was he working post release then maybe keep your opinion for yourself ..

I agree with you but is it still possible for a one man to upgrade faster a Daw as the actual competition go up on Daws and so user expectations ?

I think that it is now more the work of a small team of 2 or 3 dev than a one man project considering need to upgrade and improve more regularly than 1 years ago ? I respect the dev work but time have change and a daw is a far bigger project to rely on a one man, a synth or effect can be a one man project not anymore a Daw I think, thanks to Apple .

We will see. Currently, the economics are such that I don’t think we will see multi-person developers that plan to earn a profit working full-time on an iOS-centered full-scale DAW.

I think there is a possibility that Logic on the iPad may legitimize iPad in the eyes of pros if it turns out to be relatively full-featured AND Apple sticks with it by devoting the resources to make it stable. If that happens, we will see more apps created by full-time teams—which may also mean that some one-person developers will be able to afford to expand.

I think we see with MTS and AEM (and I think we will see it with Loopy Pro) that engaged one-person developers can accomplish quite a lot over time.

wim

@espiegel123 said:
DAW-like audio tracks has always been part of the long term plan. They are on the roadmap marked as planned:

https://roadmap.loopypro.com/feature-requests/p/straight-audio-tracks-for-sequencer-like-a-traditional-daw

Thanks for correcting the record on that point.

Slam_Cut

@wim said:

@espiegel123 said:
DAW-like audio tracks has always been part of the long term plan. They are on the roadmap marked as planned:

https://roadmap.loopypro.com/feature-requests/p/straight-audio-tracks-for-sequencer-like-a-traditional-daw

Thanks for correcting the record on that point.

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Nice to see “adulting” on the internet. Bravo.

rollin

@cp3 said:

@rollin said:
SunVox.

The dev has said his plan is to open source it should he no longer be able to develop it. Gold standard future proofing right there.

Now this is an interesting point. From what I can tell, Sunvox is written in pure C and runs on a variety platforms and architectures (iOS, Android, Windows, Linux) and audio protocols. That, combined with open source seems the best way ensure software longevity, the same way people are still able to run DOOM on all kinds of obscure hardware. An app that is written on Apple's frameworks and API's (like mine) will only work without significant maintenance as long as Apple keeps supporting the underlying API's and hardware, which - given the rate at which they push planned obsolescence in both hardware and software - isn't very long.

Very well put.

Another aspect of futureproofing is ease of opening old projects. SunVox scores highly here too - with projects being contained in a single file (no hunting for samples or plugins) and compatibility maintained across versions.

( I enjoyed a chunk of time marvelling at all the devices that run Doom, thanks for linking that).

Simon

There will be no DAWs in 3 years time - it will all be Ai.

Is that the correct answer...it's a trick question, right?

The Krazy Wabbit

@R_2 said:

@Jumpercollins said:
Wil the iPad be around in 3 years !

Will I be around in 3 years

I ask myself this daily being north of 50.

Derailing thread. That’s on me. I’ll leave now.

The Krazy Wabbit

Back on track slightly.

Has an iOS DAW ever been retired?

I ask as I’m a fan of history and see the “this daw will end that daw” just wondering if it’s happened or is that click bait titles

Littlewoodg

@rollin said:

@cp3 said:

@rollin said:
SunVox.

The dev has said his plan is to open source it should he no longer be able to develop it. Gold standard future proofing right there.

Now this is an interesting point. From what I can tell, Sunvox is written in pure C and runs on a variety platforms and architectures (iOS, Android, Windows, Linux) and audio protocols. That, combined with open source seems the best way ensure software longevity, the same way people are still able to run DOOM on all kinds of obscure hardware. An app that is written on Apple's frameworks and API's (like mine) will only work without significant maintenance as long as Apple keeps supporting the underlying API's and hardware, which - given the rate at which they push planned obsolescence in both hardware and software - isn't very long.

Very well put.

Another aspect of futureproofing is ease of opening old projects. SunVox scores highly here too - with projects being contained in a single file (no hunting for samples or plugins) and compatibility maintained across versions.

( I enjoyed a chunk of time marvelling at all the devices that run Doom, thanks for linking that).

glad someone brought Sunvox in to the thread. I misspoke when i said MTS was the only direct port on ios. Sunvox has and has had life on every platform and device since Palm OS…
and marches on.