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Augmatic GRE - Algorithmic Drum Patterns by Artur Antoni Nowak

135

Comments

  • @wim said:
    I find just bumping the chaos slider to be nicely coherent as the fill is based on the base drum pattern.

    You nailed it, small changes of parameters produce more musical results.

    Moving many knobs at once might sound like a drummer who starts a drum solo every 2 bars.

    My recommendation: make small changes and listen. This thing is designed to create evolving patterns; this is not just a marketing slogan ;-)

  • @Augmatic said:
    Choke is a common feature in good drum samplers and synths, for an example Klevgrand's OneShot, see the manual https://nbg1.your-objectstorage.com/klevgrplatform/manuals/oneshot_docs_1_0_3.pdf on page 9.

    That's a fair point. Choking off MIDI isn't the same as, or as effective as choking off the actual audio. But it still kind of seems like it should be logical to not have a hit and an accented hit at the same time. It's something I never cared for much about Grids.

    And then there's the question of which hit something like FAC is going to choke off if they arrive at the same time. OneShot has more control there.

    No big deal. It seems to be a thing that really very few drum apps get to my liking.

  • wimwim
    edited February 28

    @Augmatic said:

    @wim said:
    I find just bumping the chaos slider to be nicely coherent as the fill is based on the base drum pattern.

    You nailed it, small changes of parameters produce more musical results.

    Moving many knobs at once might sound like a drummer who starts a drum solo every 2 bars.

    My recommendation: make small changes and listen. This thing is designed to create evolving patterns; this is not just a marketing slogan ;-)

    The only bummer is if you've dialed in individual chaos knobs the way you like for the base pattern, moving the master nukes 'em. It would be kind of nice if it adjusted knobs proportionally somehow.

  • @wim said:
    That's a fair point. Choking off MIDI isn't the same as, or as effective as choking off the actual audio.

    Exactly, choke in samplers should fade out the sound (quickly), hi-hat is the classic example, realistic choke should sound like hi-hat being closed.

    I'll think about choke for version 2.0. Your point is legit.

  • edited February 28

    @wim said:
    The only bummer is if you've dialed in individual chaos knobs the way you like for the base pattern, moving the master nukes 'em. It would be kind of nice if it adjusted knobs proportionally somehow.

    You read my mind! Yes, MASTER CHAOS resets all individual CHAOS values; not nice :-(

    2.0 feautre idea: MASTER CHOS has SOFT and HARD mode. In HARD mode it works as it does now - resets everything. But in SOFT mode, it increases individual CHAOS knob from their current position to the maximum, and back to the initial position of each CHAOS knob when MASTER CHAOS goes down to zero.

    How does this idea sound?

    To be honest, I knew this will be an issue, but I had to stop vibe-coding eventually, ship, and see if anyone is even interested ;-)

  • wimwim
    edited February 28

    @Augmatic said:
    You read my mind! Yes, MASTER CHAOS resets all individual CHAOS values; not nice :-(

    2.0 feautre idea: MASTER CHOS has SOFT and HARD mode. In HARD mode it works as it does now - resets everything. But in SOFT mode, it increases individual CHAOS knob from their current position to the maximum, and back to the initial position of each CHAOS knob when MASTER CHAOS goes down to zero.

    How does this idea sound?

    That sounds better, but maybe it could be bi-directional. Starting from the existing position of the individual knob, moving the main slider scales each knob proportionally in the direction it's being moved.

    I'm too lazy to try to come up the math for that tho. 😉

    To be honest, I knew this will be an issue, but I had to stop vibe-coding eventually, ship, and see if anyone is even interested ;-)

    Darn straight! Your mistake was checking in here, the land of never-ending feature creep.
    You've got an app that's better than many just as it is. But you'll never stop getting suggestions around here.

  • @wim said:
    That sounds better, but maybe it could be bi-directional. Starting from the existing position of the individual knob, moving the main slider scales each knob proportionally in the direction it's being moved.

    Interesting idea, I'll think about that.

    But you'll never stop getting suggestions around here.

    I'm open to make friends ;-)

  • @Augmatic said:

    @gusgranite said:
    Is there an easy way to make a snap point and snap back to it after some further tweaks/randomization?

    Not directly. You can create a preset when you start and recall it when you go to crazy tweaking all knobs, that's not optimal, I know, but doable.

    I would love to "lock" the xy-pad to a position as long as I don't touch it, when I touch it, I'd like to be able to explore the XY pad, but when I let go, I'd like it to snap back to the locked position (could be done with a switch on the side). Phrased weirdly, but I hope it's clear, what I'm trying to say:)

  • Love the app - works great with everything except Battalion, for me - for some reason it keeps stopping/starting the sequence and muting tracks - could very likely be something I’m doing wrong

  • @Augmatic said:

    @wim said:
    The only bummer is if you've dialed in individual chaos knobs the way you like for the base pattern, moving the master nukes 'em. It would be kind of nice if it adjusted knobs proportionally somehow.

    You read my mind! Yes, MASTER CHAOS resets all individual CHAOS values; not nice :-(

    2.0 feautre idea: MASTER CHOS has SOFT and HARD mode. In HARD mode it works as it does now - resets everything. But in SOFT mode, it increases individual CHAOS knob from their current position to the maximum, and back to the initial position of each CHAOS knob when MASTER CHAOS goes down to zero.

    How does this idea sound?

    To be honest, I knew this will be an issue, but I had to stop vibe-coding eventually, ship, and see if anyone is even interested ;-)

    This would be cool.

    I guess you got your answer, huh, lol. It was #2-#3 in the States the other day, and is currently in the #4 position for Paid Music Apps in the US App Store.

  • @Augmatic - what do these do these abbreviations (tziff, tchsss, etc...) mean and what do the dots under them represent? I did glance at the manual and didn't see it mentioned.

  • @wagdog said:
    @Augmatic - what do these do these abbreviations (tziff, tchsss, etc...) mean and what do the dots under them represent? I did glance at the manual and didn't see it mentioned.

    The abbreviations are random. Just a bit of fun.
    The dots flash when a hit registers on that lane.

  • @wim said:

    @wagdog said:
    @Augmatic - what do these do these abbreviations (tziff, tchsss, etc...) mean and what do the dots under them represent? I did glance at the manual and didn't see it mentioned.

    The abbreviations are random. Just a bit of fun.
    The dots flash when a hit registers on that lane.

    Thanks, @wim. If you don’t mind, how did you know that? I did look in the manual.

  • @wagdog said:

    @wim said:

    @wagdog said:
    @Augmatic - what do these do these abbreviations (tziff, tchsss, etc...) mean and what do the dots under them represent? I did glance at the manual and didn't see it mentioned.

    The abbreviations are random. Just a bit of fun.
    The dots flash when a hit registers on that lane.

    Thanks, @wim. If you don’t mind, how did you know that? I did look in the manual.

    The column heading was discussed up thread or in the other thread. The dots I just observed.

  • Thanks again @wim .

  • @Augmatic said:

    @wim said:
    The only bummer is if you've dialed in individual chaos knobs the way you like for the base pattern, moving the master nukes 'em. It would be kind of nice if it adjusted knobs proportionally somehow.

    You read my mind! Yes, MASTER CHAOS resets all individual CHAOS values; not nice :-(

    2.0 feautre idea: MASTER CHOS has SOFT and HARD mode. In HARD mode it works as it does now - resets everything. But in SOFT mode, it increases individual CHAOS knob from their current position to the maximum, and back to the initial position of each CHAOS knob when MASTER CHAOS goes down to zero.

    How does this idea sound?

    To be honest, I knew this will be an issue, but I had to stop vibe-coding eventually, ship, and see if anyone is even interested ;-)

    This app is very cool & I’m excited to work with it. The soft lead chaos idea is fantastic.

    The only other thing I’d love to see is finer resolution/control over the swing & shift knobs, If possible. They can be really tiny depending on the host interface size and making small adjustment is really fiddly.

    This is great work!

  • wimwim
    edited March 1

    @drconfusion said:
    The only other thing I’d love to see is finer resolution/control over the swing & shift knobs, If possible. They can be really tiny depending on the host interface size and making small adjustment is really fiddly.

    I agree that they're very sensitive and it's hard to dial in small amounts. But I don't think it has anything to do with the physical size of the knobs other than visual perception. When you move your finger, you're not constrained to the size of the knob. Your finger travels a good deal away from the knob, and can even move out of the plugin window itself. There's about two inches of travel to get from neutral to full no matter how the interface is scaled.

    I think the issue is the full range of swing is really large and even a tiny bit on the dial is strong. Same for shift. To change that though would mean either reducing the overall maximum and minimum or using a logarithmic or other non linear scale.

    These knobs are bi-axis, meaning you can adjust them with both vertical and horizontal movement. Some apps use vertical movement only, but the farther away from the knob you move your finger horizontally, the smaller adjustments your vertical movement makes. I prefer that style. But, that said, I don't think the main issue is the knobs themselves, but how they scale what they're controlling.

  • edited March 1

    @wim said:
    These knobs are bi-axis, meaning you can adjust them with both vertical and horizontal movement. Some apps use vertical movement only, but the farther away from the knob you move your finger horizontally, the smaller adjustments your vertical movement makes. I prefer that style. But, that said, I don't think the main issue is the knobs themselves, but how they scale what they're controlling.

    Indeed, the knobs have a range of 128 steps. I should be able to increase their resolution to float and make higher-fidelity knob adjustments possible.

    This is great feedback, the SHIFT option is not very common in sequencers, especially negative SHIFT which is moving drum hits forward. I wanted to have negative SHIFT to make flams - a "grace note" is played just before the main stroke, creating a fatter, broader sound than a single hit. That's a quite common technique used by drummers to make the beat more engaging ( <3 Steward Copeland). So, increasing resolution of SHIFT makes a lot of sense.

    Technical detail: Augmatic GRE can't predict what Grids will play, so, how do you move the pattern forward? GRE it's actually delaying clock of the individual instrument by 1 bar - x, where x is the "forward" shift value. This is the best I could come up with. It's not optimal, I know. I'm explaining this because tweaking SHIFT in real time, or through automation, especially crossing the 12'o'clock point, might produce strange results. But, I didn't want to remove it from automation, since some subtle changes might work well. Design choices!

    BTW, AppStore ratings and reviews will be appreciated :-)

  • @Augmatic - the Shift option is awesome. I don't care how you get to the ability to "fake" moving the notes before the beat, I like it! There are very few sequencers on the platform that can do that. Keeping automation is an excellent design choice, and worth the tradeoffs.

    I hadn't thought about the 128 steps resolution. Yeh, increasing that might do wonders.

    It might also work to simply increase the "throw" of the knob movements. Knobs have about two inches of travel to go from neutral to full or zero. That can be increased, and I believe isn't constrained by the size of the plugin window. I've had apps where you could move your finger all the way across the screen as long as you don't lift it.

    The other method of having the precision increase the further away you are horizontally from the knob is nice in some plugins, but also seems like it would be a big change. The knobs work great now. It'd be a shame to break that.

  • The random label above the LEDs seems to be the most discussed feature :-)

    I'm going to change them a bit in the next version to make them less confusing!

  • Version 1.1 will be ready to test very soon, if anyone wants to join TestFlight, please send me your email!

  • Lattice works well for fills, imo.
    @cem_olcay ’s Auto Fill is very useful, it’s a set it and forget type situation and easy to dial in your desired fill while leaving your main beat alone ( sans mute obviously )

  • @maxxpower18 said:

    @Pxlhg said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @wim said:

    @maxxpower18 said:
    Is it possible to make fills?

    The simplest is just to bump the master chaos slider up and back down. There's an AUv3 parameter for that, so it's possible to automate.

    You can get more granular than that with the individual chaos and density knobs, but then you need to keep track of where things were in order to restore them.

    Thank you, will play with it.

    Cem Olcays 'Auto Fill' can also do the trick. One way would be to connect it direct to the drum app and just let it override AUG when it's time for a fill.

    @Pxlhg said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @wim said:

    @maxxpower18 said:
    Is it possible to make fills?

    The simplest is just to bump the master chaos slider up and back down. There's an AUv3 parameter for that, so it's possible to automate.

    You can get more granular than that with the individual chaos and density knobs, but then you need to keep track of where things were in order to restore them.

    Thank you, will play with it.

    Cem Olcays 'Auto Fill' can also do the trick. One way would be to connect it direct to the drum app and just let it override AUG when it's time for a fill.

    Yeah I'll give it a try. Sometimes the fills can sound a bit disconnected from the beat generated but it's better than nothing.

    Inappropriate fills are the reason why I have been disappointed with all the drum machines I have tried or seen reviews of. The only exception is Lumbeat drummers. So far, based on the YouTube videos of Augmatic GRE, I am not sure if it is suitable for classic rock/blues/funk, including realistic fills. Is it?

  • @filo01 said:
    Inappropriate fills are the reason why I have been disappointed with all the drum machines I have tried or seen reviews of. The only exception is Lumbeat drummers. So far, based on the YouTube videos of Augmatic GRE, I am not sure if it is suitable for classic rock/blues/funk, including realistic fills. Is it?

    Augmatic GRE is quite realistic due to Linear Drumming, which seems to be quite unique feature, I can't find anything similar. It controls how many drums/cymbals can be triggered at the same time. A drummer has two hands and two legs, so up to 4 sounds at the same time, right? And, he won't hit 4 drums at once, but 2 max (plus kick), or kick+snare and one cymbal. You can do the same here, or even go extreme and allow only one sound at a time. Charlie Watts used to play like this a lot, and he is not only a classic, but a legend :-)

    See beginning of this demo, you'll hear what I mean:

    But, for sure, Augmatic GRE is not a replacement of a MIDI library, e.g. which is included in Addictive Drums. On the other hand, those libraries are huge, and unless you know exactly what you are looking for, it's easy to get frustrated by browsing bits and pieces of a drum performance, at least this was the case for me. BTW, AD2 is amazing!

  • I really like the plugin, and I find the possibilities very interesting but I get stuck very quickly when I try to make a groove with non regular hits. For instance : 3 hits on kick then pause, then repeat. After tying my head in knots trying to get a working combination in euclidean pattern, I ended up trying to hear every Grids algorithm to see if there is a matching pattern that I can use on kicks, but it's difficult to browse them all since you can't guess the exact positions of every different algorithm.

  • edited March 2

    @Augmatic said:

    @filo01 said:
    Inappropriate fills are the reason why I have been disappointed with all the drum machines I have tried or seen reviews of. The only exception is Lumbeat drummers. So far, based on the YouTube videos of Augmatic GRE, I am not sure if it is suitable for classic rock/blues/funk, including realistic fills. Is it?

    Augmatic GRE is quite realistic due to Linear Drumming, which seems to be quite unique feature, I can't find anything similar. It controls how many drums/cymbals can be triggered at the same time. A drummer has two hands and two legs, so up to 4 sounds at the same time, right? And, he won't hit 4 drums at once, but 2 max (plus kick), or kick+snare and one cymbal. You can do the same here, or even go extreme and allow only one sound at a time. Charlie Watts used to play like this a lot, and he is not only a classic, but a legend :-)

    See beginning of this demo, you'll hear what I mean:

    But, for sure, Augmatic GRE is not a replacement of a MIDI library, e.g. which is included in Addictive Drums. On the other hand, those libraries are huge, and unless you know exactly what you are looking for, it's easy to get frustrated by browsing bits and pieces of a drum performance, at least this was the case for me. BTW, AD2 is amazing!

    Thanks., I didn't mean the MIDI library specifically; I like the application the way you do it. I believe there will be no problems with the basic rhythm. I'm just concerned about the realism of the fills and not having to create/run them manually so that they start, say, every x bars and slightly different/unique.

  • @Toin00z said:
    I really like the plugin, and I find the possibilities very interesting but I get stuck very quickly when I try to make a groove with non regular hits. For instance : 3 hits on kick then pause, then repeat. After tying my head in knots trying to get a working combination in euclidean pattern, I ended up trying to hear every Grids algorithm to see if there is a matching pattern that I can use on kicks, but it's difficult to browse them all since you can't guess the exact positions of every different algorithm.

    If you want to build more specific patterns, like AAAB, or even AB, you can do it with automation in any DAW, even as simple as automating one or more DENSITY knobs, or only BLEND, switching 100% between more intense Grids pattern and sparse, predictable Euclidean.

    I'm going to add features which allow to build more complex parts and structure them, but it's not going to be a full "song mode" in Augmatic GRE. It might actually be even more interesting than a song mode ;-)

  • @filo01 said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @Pxlhg said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @wim said:

    @maxxpower18 said:
    Is it possible to make fills?

    The simplest is just to bump the master chaos slider up and back down. There's an AUv3 parameter for that, so it's possible to automate.

    You can get more granular than that with the individual chaos and density knobs, but then you need to keep track of where things were in order to restore them.

    Thank you, will play with it.

    Cem Olcays 'Auto Fill' can also do the trick. One way would be to connect it direct to the drum app and just let it override AUG when it's time for a fill.

    @Pxlhg said:

    @maxxpower18 said:

    @wim said:

    @maxxpower18 said:
    Is it possible to make fills?

    The simplest is just to bump the master chaos slider up and back down. There's an AUv3 parameter for that, so it's possible to automate.

    You can get more granular than that with the individual chaos and density knobs, but then you need to keep track of where things were in order to restore them.

    Thank you, will play with it.

    Cem Olcays 'Auto Fill' can also do the trick. One way would be to connect it direct to the drum app and just let it override AUG when it's time for a fill.

    Yeah I'll give it a try. Sometimes the fills can sound a bit disconnected from the beat generated but it's better than nothing.

    Inappropriate fills are the reason why I have been disappointed with all the drum machines I have tried or seen reviews of. The only exception is Lumbeat drummers. So far, based on the YouTube videos of Augmatic GRE, I am not sure if it is suitable for classic rock/blues/funk, including realistic fills. Is it?

    Realistic fills no, but out of the all the generative drum machines GRE generates some really useful patterns. Not including Lumbeat of course.

  • Premiere starting in a few mins, detailed 35 min walkthrough focusing on the linear section, Euclidean vs Grids, and the velocity bending. Come say hi in the premiere text chat if you're free now!

  • edited March 3

    The grooves sound better than my drums.

    But why did you choose 6 tracks.

    Same as lattice ( 6 tracks )

    These both sound enough I suppose.

    Whats it like using 2 drum sequencers ?

    Sometimes I were even going blend and gain midi from 2 playbeat 4 etc ( which isnt euclidean )

    I spose its best not blending multiple gre though ( due to in app mangling functions )

    Why do I need 15 drum tracks ( just because ) Its almost like how many facebook fwends you got lol.

    Id still like to know which app might be better suited ( gre or lattice ) to multiple instance as generators ( for the 15 tracks )

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